Composting head vs classic head

[qwerme]

Originally Posted by newhaul

sorry but I have to call bs that it won't fit through the door . It had to fit to get in the head to begin with.

The entire Nature's Head doesn't fit as a single closed piece. I have to remove the top part. then the big open bucket of **** only fits throught the high part of the door, so I have two choices: A- Empty it in a garbage bag in the head, which is what I most often do. Or B- Lift the thing up awkwardly up to my face and try to walk out the head door.


BS yourself.

[Mike OReilly]

Originally Posted by qwerme

I have a composting head. I have never had a regular head. Emptying the liquids is a pain in the ass and overflows happen, specially with the kids on the boat.

As far as emptying the solids, always a disgusting experience. It smells like wet soil.. but makes you want to gag. Due do the size of the head and the size of the door, I can't simply carry it out the boat closed so there are spills.

Like I said, I have no experience with normal heads and I haven't had to go to the pump out or worry about that.

It's still **** and piss and not a pleasant experience.

Sorry to hear about your experiences qwerme. How many people are using the head? These really are designed for two, perhaps three people full-time. More than that will definitely over-tax the design.

But maybe we can help... The overflow thing surely is simple learning. Kids learn not to pee on the floor, so they can learn to look at the bottle level and not overflow it. With Nature's Head the bottle top 1/3 is visible, so a simple glance usually suffices. Perhaps draw a red line on the bottle, saying "if it reaches here, dump first!"

I don't find wet soil to be a bad smell, but to each his own. But I don't try and move the whole head when dumping. I just wrap a bag around the base, and then tip it over. This way I don't have to try and carry at all. I don't know if your head space is large enough to do this, but it certainly works for me.

[Q Xopa]

Originally Posted by Mike OReilly

That's also my impression.



Completely agree. I think a lot of the poop laws around boating are bunk. As I say, I think direct discharge in areas of good volume/flow is usually the best way to deal with our outflows. It's just in confined areas, or places with high concentrations of other people, where some sort of holding or treatment system is needed.



I wish others would follow your lead DH. I talk about composters because I have actual, direct experience cruising with one. And I try and be helpful to those honestly interested in the idea. I try not to ramble about things I know little about.

But as usual we can count on some regular suspects to contribute some empassioned albeit amusing posts. I get the feeling some here just love a good opposing discussion. If not usually logic I can follow, it certainly makes for entertaining forum reading.

I have an Airhead, and a regular manual holding tank unit. I certainly know which one I prefer.

It's on my list, admitadly a little way down, to get rid of the Holding tank. Many holding tanks are under V berths. To me sleeping ontop of sloshing effluent seems gross. But with thru hulls, sanitation hoses etc for me it's not a difficult choice.

Carry on.

[newhaul]

Originally Posted by qwerme

The entire Nature's Head doesn't fit as a single closed piece. I have to remove the top part. then the big open bucket of **** only fits throught the high part of the door, so I have two choices: A- Empty it in a garbage bag in the head, which is what I most often do. Or B- Lift the thing up awkwardly up to my face and try to walk out the head door.


BS yourself.

what vessel?
Now to solve the issue place a bag over the unit before moving it . No spilling .

Also if its wet or smells then it sounds like to much moisture and that is likely urine going the wrong way.
Are you sure all the males are sitting properly to urinate?

[Mike OReilly]

Originally Posted by newhaul

what vessel?
Now to solve the issue place a bag over the unit before moving it . No spilling .

Also if its wet or smells then it sounds like to much moisture and that is likely urine going the wrong way.
Are you sure all the males are sitting properly to urinate?

I was just about to suggest the same. If it's wet, or smells like feces or urine, then it's an indication the mixture is off. Too much moisture going in, or not enough (or the right) bedding material, or perhaps not enough venting. If urine is getting in, then that's gotta stop.

And as I said, if too many people are using the head, well, it's just not going to work very well.

Not clear what the challenge is regarding moving the material. If you can tip it into a plastic bag, then there's no reason to move the whole head. But it's really hard to assess without being there -- I understand.

I'd really like to help (as would others, I'm sure) if we can. These heads do require a different set of skills than standard marine heads. But it's just another skill, like everything else on a boat.

[Montanan]

Originally Posted by Mike OReilly

Sorry to hear about your experiences qwerme. How many people are using the head? These really are designed for two, perhaps three people full-time. More than that will definitely over-tax the design.

But maybe we can help... The overflow thing surely is simple learning. Kids learn not to pee on the floor, so they can learn to look at the bottle level and not overflow it. With Nature's Head the bottle top 1/3 is visible, so a simple glance usually suffices. Perhaps draw a red line on the bottle, saying "if it reaches here, dump first!"

I don't find wet soil to be a bad smell, but to each his own. But I don't try and move the whole head when dumping. I just wrap a bag around the base, and then tip it over. This way I don't have to try and carry at all. I don't know if your head space is large enough to do this, but it certainly works for me.

Okay so the customary expression as to maximum boat occupancy can be modified for those with composting heads to be:

Six for drinks.
Four for dinner.
Two or three for toilet usage.
and
Two to sleep.

Or one could just install a second composting head for larger occupancy and greater P1, P2 capacity in a second head to handle more passengers.

[Mike OReilly]

Originally Posted by Montanan

Okay so the customary expression as to maximum boat occupancy can be modified for those with composting heads to be:

Six for drinks.
Four for dinner.
Two or three for toilet usage.
and
Two to sleep.

Or one could just install a second composting head for larger occupancy and greater P1, P2 capacity in a second head to handle more passengers.

If it's six for beers, then they better be peeing over the side .

[valhalla360]

Originally Posted by newhaul

For some composting head use can negatively affect their bottom line.

I suspect that is why a certain "marine provider" is horrified by the idea. Nothing to break or fail with a composting unit and really not hard to self install.

If they became the standard, it would really cut into the bottom line.

[Montanan]

Originally Posted by Mike OReilly

If it's six for beers, then they better be peeing over the side .

Two frat boys were stranded at sea in a life boat. On the 4th day, a mermaid came up out of the water and offered them one wish to save their lives.

The frat boys thought about it and one shouted out,"I wish the ocean was a sea of beer." And it happened.

A little while later the other one shouted,"Great, now we have to pee in the boat!"

[Montanan]

Three men were standing side-by-side using the urinal.

The first man finished, zipped up and started washing and literally scrubbing his hands ... clear up to his elbows ... He used about 20 paper towels before he finished. He turned to the other two men and commented: "I graduated from Harvard and they taught us to be sanitary."

The second man finished, zipped up and quickly wet the tips of his fingers, grabbed one paper towel and commented: "I graduated from the University of California and they taught us to be environmentally conscious to not waste paper or water."

The third man zipped up and as he was walking out the door he had a smirk on his face and said: "I don't know about you guys, but where I went to college at Montana State University, they taught us not to piss on our hands."

[Montanan]

Sticking to a nautical theme.

Once upon a time, there was an officer of the Royal Navy named Captain Bravado who showed no fear when facing his enemies. One day, while sailing the Seven Seas, his lookout spotted a pirate ship approaching, and the crew became frantic. Captain Bravado bellowed, "Bring me my red shirt!"

The first mate quickly retrieved the captain's red shirt, and while wearing the brightly colored frock, the Captain led his crew into battle and defeated the mighty pirates. That evening, all the men sat around on deck recounting the triumph of earlier. One of them asked the Captain, "Sir, why did you call for your red shirt before battle?"

The Captain replied, "If I were to be wounded in the attack, the shirt would not show my blood. Thus, you men would continue to fight, unafraid." All of the men sat and marveled at the courage of such a manly man's man. As dawn came the next morning, the lookout spotted not one, not two, but TEN pirate ships approaching. The crew stared in worshipful silence at the Captain and waited for his usual orders.

Captain Bravado gazed with steely eyes upon the vast armada arrayed against his ship, and without fear, turned and calmly shouted, "Get me my brown pants."

[valhalla360]

Originally Posted by Mike OReilly

But maybe we can help... The overflow thing surely is simple learning. Kids learn not to pee on the floor, so they can learn to look at the bottle level and not overflow it. With Nature's Head the bottle top 1/3 is visible, so a simple glance usually suffices. Perhaps draw a red line on the bottle, saying "if it reaches here, dump first!"

Start making the boys clean it up if it overflows...they will figure out to check first real quick.

But as Mike said, they are really best suited to a couple if more than day sailing. 4-5 people for a week will be a problem.

[smj]

Originally Posted by Montanan

Sticking to a nautical theme.



Once upon a time, there was an officer of the Royal Navy named Captain Bravado who showed no fear when facing his enemies. One day, while sailing the Seven Seas, his lookout spotted a pirate ship approaching, and the crew became frantic. Captain Bravado bellowed, "Bring me my red shirt!"



The first mate quickly retrieved the captain's red shirt, and while wearing the brightly colored frock, the Captain led his crew into battle and defeated the mighty pirates. That evening, all the men sat around on deck recounting the triumph of earlier. One of them asked the Captain, "Sir, why did you call for your red shirt before battle?"



The Captain replied, "If I were to be wounded in the attack, the shirt would not show my blood. Thus, you men would continue to fight, unafraid." All of the men sat and marveled at the courage of such a manly man's man. As dawn came the next morning, the lookout spotted not one, not two, but TEN pirate ships approaching. The crew stared in worshipful silence at the Captain and waited for his usual orders.



Captain Bravado gazed with steely eyes upon the vast armada arrayed against his ship, and without fear, turned and calmly shouted, "Get me my brown pants."

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[Minggat]

Originally Posted by qwerme

I have a composting head. I have never had a regular head. Emptying the liquids is a pain in the ass and overflows happen, specially with the kids on the boat.


As far as emptying the solids, always a disgusting experience. It smells like wet soil.. but makes you want to gag. Due do the size of the head and the size of the door, I can't simply carry it out the boat closed so there are spills.



Like I said, I have no experience with normal heads and I haven't had to go to the pump out or worry about that.

It's still **** and piss and not a pleasant experience.

A guy I met in my marina in So Cal came down to enjoy his new to him boat with his family. The troubles he experienced because of overwhelming his wet sewage system were... well, ...wet sewage overload.

There is no type of sewage overload that ends well.

Point is, you are not describing optimal operation. Jumping right in with a composting toilet without even experiencing a wet sewage system, I suggest that you are at a disadvantage to figuring out optimal operation of a dry system. And as I have said before, the difference between the marketed systems can be an issue.

[jmh2002]

Originally Posted by Dockhead

...my opinion will be of zero interest to anyone. Hence I keep my mouth shut; a practice which should be more widespread when people lack experience or any kind of specific knowledge.

Best comment ever in relation to this thread (and probably a few others too).