Couple Cruising Under 30ft?

[Cheechako]

The Vega is a small boat. In many ways.

[Adelie]

Originally Posted by AiniA

Not sure how you fit a water maker and the support for it (batteries, genset, fuel) on a Vega.

Skip the genset and fuel. To paraphrase from the graduate: "One word; Solar."

[Amani Jnana]

Originally Posted by ILikePlanesToo

Hello everyone,

I’ve read the forum for a few years but never had the need to post. I have some thoughts that I’d like some input on.

My wife and I are looking to get our first small cruising boat, and I’d like some experienced input. Specifically, I’d like everyone’s thoughts on the suitability of the Pacific Seacraft Orion 27 for bluewater cruising verses a classic larger, heavier, cruiser like a Westsail 32.

Pacific Seacraft Orion 27:
--LOA: 30′ 11″ (including bowsprit)
--LOD: 27′ 4″
--LWL: 22′ 2″
--Beam: 9′ 3″
--Draft: 4′ 0″
--Displacement: 10,000 lbs.
--Ballast: 3,500 lbs.
--Cutter Sail Area: 508 sq.ft.

Westsail 32:
--LOA: 40′ (including bowsprit and boomkin)
--LOD: 32′ 0″
--LWL: 27′ 6″
--Beam: 11′ 0″
--Draft: 5′ 0″
--Displacement: 19,500 lbs.
--Ballast: 7,000 lbs.
--Sail Area: 629 sq. ft.

Doing a little arithmetic to help compare, I get:

Displacement / Length Ratio D/L 409.9 (Orion) 418.6 (WS32)
Ballast / Displacement B/D 0.35 (Orion) 0.36 (WS32)
Sail Area / Displacement SA/D 17.5 (Orion) 13.9 (WS32)

I know this isn’t really apples to apples, but the displacement to length ratio shows both boats are pretty heavy (over 400), the ballast / displacement ratio shows them to likely have similar stability (caveat: we understand this is actually very dependent on location of ballast), and the sail area / displacement is interesting with the Orion cutter being a little more canvased.

Overall, the Orion looks like a scaled down Westsail 32 with a little more sale area.

I’ll add to this post momentarily with more background information.

Michael

Hi Michael,

I doubt you'll find one on the West coast, but I just bought an Island Packet 29 in New York. It's never dipped its keel in salt water before, but come May I'll be sailing it from Lake Seneca (finger lake) to Phuket Thailand. It may not be the right choice for you, and I only responded because you say you have considered the IP 27 & 31.

I did as well but I found the 27 to be a bit too small and have read the 29 out sails the 31 due to a more modern hull design. Kind of a goldilocks story for me. In any case, fair winds to you and your crew.

Stay in touch, I'd love to find out what you end up going with.

A.J.

[laika]

Hi Michael,

I've owned a Vancouver 27 since 2009 and lived aboard full time for most of it. It may take some modifications/additions to make it a long-term voyager, but it's definitely doable..these days more than ever with advances in technology. For ex, we have a 14GPH WM onboard and a backup manual handheld, so having only 50 gallons of tankage is a non-issue. Enough solar to keep up, at least in lower lats. A good composting toilet eliminates the need for holding tank space. Windvane and redundant APs. More electronics and sh!t than I should probably want. Plenty of room to provision for months at a time, and lots of fishing gear. Finding standing headroom would be my personal limiting factor. At 6'1" the V27 works for me, barely.

There have been times when I certainly wished there was more space for stuff, but I've met plenty of people living on larger boats who had the same gripe. End of the day, the size works perfectly for us. Keep it clean and tidy and you don't need to feel cramped.

Recently moved off the boat for a year or two and just bought a trailer to take her up to a cabin in WI. With a beam of only 8'8" it can be trailered cross country with a large pickup and sans a wide-load permit. Plan is to do another refit, this time w/o the boatyard, and hit the water again in a year or two. Biggest plan is to carve out an enclosed head.

A small boat obviously has plenty of drawbacks, and you have to be more selective in certain ways about what makes the cut onboard, but for us, a young outdoorsy couple of 33 and 26, it fits the bill wonderfully. Currently own a small boat and small bush plane. Couldn't afford both and wouldn't want the maintenance either if they were much larger or more complex.

[Copacabana]

Originally Posted by laika

Hi Michael,

I've owned a Vancouver 27 since 2009 and lived aboard full time for most of it. It may take some modifications/additions to make it a long-term voyager, but it's definitely doable..these days more than ever with advances in technology. For ex, we have a 14GPH WM onboard and a backup manual handheld, so having only 50 gallons of tankage is a non-issue. Enough solar to keep up, at least in lower lats. A good composting toilet eliminates the need for holding tank space. Windvane and redundant APs. More electronics and sh!t than I should probably want. Plenty of room to provision for months at a time, and lots of fishing gear. Finding standing headroom would be my personal limiting factor. At 6'1" the V27 works for me, barely.

There have been times when I certainly wished there was more space for stuff, but I've met plenty of people living on larger boats who had the same gripe. End of the day, the size works perfectly for us. Keep it clean and tidy and you don't need to feel cramped.

Recently moved off the boat for a year or two and just bought a trailer to take her up to a cabin in WI. With a beam of only 8'8" it can be trailered cross country with a large pickup and sans a wide-load permit. Plan is to do another refit, this time w/o the boatyard, and hit the water again in a year or two. Biggest plan is to carve out an enclosed head.

A small boat obviously has plenty of drawbacks, and you have to be more selective in certain ways about what makes the cut onboard, but for us, a young outdoorsy couple of 33 and 26, it fits the bill wonderfully. Currently own a small boat and small bush plane. Couldn't afford both and wouldn't want the maintenance either if they were much larger or more complex.

I think the Vancouver 27 (or the newer 28) would make a fantastic small cruiser for a couple. I have to say that the voyages of Bosun Bird in the South Atlantic/Patagonia and the Chilean canals convinced me that the boat is ready for anything. The book is a terrific read and should be on the shelf of every Vancouver 27 owner!

https://www.amazon.com/Winter-Firela.../dp/0888645473

I also see they have a website:

Bosun Bird - Winter in Fireland

[sailorboy1]

In the 5 months I'm been out cruising going from Boston to the bahamas the smallest active cruiser I've seen is 30'. The next active smallest is probably 34'.

Just posting what I've seen.

[robert sailor]

When we started cruising 35 years ago there were lots of sub 30 foot offshore cruisers out there. Back then a 40 foot boat was huge. It's all in your mindset, the oceans haven't changed but our sense for adventure may be diminishing ...that and the fact that cruisers are much older these days, on average and smaller boats work better with younger bodies.

[Copacabana]

I think the sweet spot is around 35 feet. You have the storage and tankage to cruise in comfort, room for two and enough displacement (usually) that you are not knocked around so much in bigger seas. Over 35 feet you don't usually get much more usuable living space (just more berths or cabins, maybe a second head), although the storage space goes up considerably. It's all a trade-off, but smaller boats have their advantages, especially in the cost to purchase and maintain.

[Cheechako]

Originally Posted by robert sailor

When we started cruising 35 years ago there were lots of sub 30 foot offshore cruisers out there. Back then a 40 foot boat was huge. It's all in your mindset, the oceans haven't changed but our sense for adventure may be diminishing ...that and the fact that cruisers are much older these days, on average and smaller boats work better with younger bodies.

Yep, ^^ This. I had a lot of fun in my 30. Things are small, light and controllable. Speed is the only big drawback compared with 40+.
To me 30-32 is a great size. What do you get with 38-40? Another head.

[sailorboy1]

I've been in West End Bahamas for 4 days. The smallest boat has been 36'.

[sailjumanji]

Originally Posted by sailorboy1

In the 5 months I'm been out cruising going from Boston to the bahamas the smallest active cruiser I've seen is 30'. The next active smallest is probably 34'.

Just posting what I've seen.

Yep, we spent two months in Bahamas last year, mostly in exumas. Except for two corsair 31 trimarans, we were the smallest multihull we saw.

We have a spectra watermaker, no generator, and everything powered solar or outboards.