Danny green chameleon nesting dinghy

[TooCoys]

Originally Posted by JAFO

When I originally contacted Danny Greene directly about the plans, he told me that I should order them through Duckworks.

(Oh, and don't bother with getting the fullsize templates version. Not worth the bother, as the templates are only for a couple of the pieces.)

Thanks!

Nice blog too! I am enjoying reading it!

[JAFO]

Originally Posted by TooCoys

Nice blog too! I am enjoying reading it!

You're welcome, and thanks for the kind words!

[TooCoys]

Originally Posted by JAFO

You're welcome, and thanks for the kind words!

Why did you decide that the Chameleon was head and shoulders above the rest of the models out there? I'm specifically curious as to what benefits it has over the CLC Eastport Nesting Pram. I like the front transom of the Chameleon, but I like the lapstrake sides of the Eastport.

[Jammer]

Originally Posted by TooCoys

ETA: Are the plans available from this Duckworks place only, or is there another way to obtain them?

I bought the plans a couple of years ago directly from Danny. I believe I still have his email address, PM me if you need it.

[Jammer]

Originally Posted by TooCoys

Why did you decide that the Chameleon was head and shoulders above the rest of the models out there? I'm specifically curious as to what benefits it has over the CLC Eastport Nesting Pram. I like the front transom of the Chameleon, but I like the lapstrake sides of the Eastport.

They are very different. There are a large number of plans and kit nesting dinghies out there including those from B&B, CLC, and Bateau. PT Watercraft's PT-11 (kit only) is also similar -- they are presently out of production but are serious about resuming albeit with some design changes. Chameleon is an older design, I believe dating to the 1980s. The non-sailing version is optimized for ease of construction from plans, and for optimal use of 4x8 sheet stock. All the other designs are optimized to a greater or lesser degree for CNC kit production with the PT-11 being designed around CNC cutting to the point where the designers don't see a hand-cut build as being feasible. I will note that a builder in South Africa apparently has made CNC files for Chameleon, something to consider if your travels take you in that direction.



I believe all of the designers (with the possible exception of B&B) were aware of Chameleon at the time they designed their boats and I know for certain that the design of the Bateau FB-11 and the PT Watercraft PT-11 were informed by the success of Chameleon to some degree based on correspondence and forum posts with the designers.


For the CLC Eastport Pram in particular, there are three major differences. The first one is size as the Eastport Pram is 7'9" long compared to the Chameleon's 10'4" length; Chameleon is also more beamy. The second is that the Eastport Pram has visibly more rocker resulting in better glide but more difficulty maintaining directional control. The third is the more rounded design, with more hull panels, resulting in better glide while rowing at the expense of initial stability and overall capacity.


As for the others, well, CLC Passagemaker is closer in size (somewhat larger than Chameleon) but doesn't really nest as such. PT-11 is highly regarded but expensive; it has a pointed bow rather than a bow transom, and has a more rounded hull design even than the Eastport Pram but not as much rocker. The FB-11 from Bateau is the same length as Chameleon but has a little less capacity because it's less beamy in the stern and gives up some displacement to -- once again -- a more rounded hull design.


Reviewing the plans and talking to builders and owners I think the sailing version of Chameleon is less well thought out than the rowing version. It's heavier and harder to build, and the plans aren't as detailed and well developed as those for the basic boat. Like nearly all nesting designs for sailing, it's a daggerboard design. As drawn it does not have a kick-up rudder. People who have grounded them claim the boat is light enough and strong enough that it just stops with no damage.

[TooCoys]

Originally Posted by Jammer

The first one is size as the Eastport Pram is 7'9" long compared to the Chameleon's 10'4" length; Chameleon is also more beamy. The second is that the Eastport Pram has visibly more rocker resulting in better glide but more difficulty maintaining directional control. The third is the more rounded design, with more hull panels, resulting in better glide while rowing at the expense of initial stability and overall capacity.

These three, especially the bold sentence, sealed that deal right up for me.

I tried to use a 1958 Lonestar 12' aluminum john boat as a dinghy, but it was too rocky. And the spousal unit and I are big boys at 200/230lbs, so we need the greatest capacity, especially because we intend on using a very small outboard.

[Jammer]

For clarity, rocker is the distance the hull at the bow and stern is above the bow amidships. The hull profile is the shape of the hull when viewed from the end. Jonboats have flat bottoms and flared sides.

Generally Jonboats are stable in calm water but do not handle waves well. Rounded bottom boats are less stable in calm water than Jonboats because they will heel when loaded unevenly, but they are less affected by waves. V-bottomed boats like Chameleon are somewhere in between.

Building a boat is a big investment of time and money. I've bought a couple of older fiberglass dinghies of different shapes and sizes to try to better understand their capabilities and the consequences of hull design, since there's no one nearby with a Chameleon that I can ask to take out around the bay.


There's a partial design from the 1980s for an "Abaco-11 Nesting Dinghy" floating around the internet. It's essentially a lightweight, nesting Jonboat made out of then-innovative foam PVC board. I haven't been able to find a source for the plans, but it's best understood as a calm-water dinghy anyway, with no ability to withstand waves.

[JAFO]

Originally Posted by TooCoys

Why did you decide that the Chameleon was head and shoulders above the rest of the models out there?

I believe Jammer has done a far better job of explaining this than I could.

Originally Posted by Jammer

I bought the plans a couple of years ago directly from Danny. I believe I still have his email address, PM me if you need it.

I seem to recall that a couple of years ago, you mentioned that you'd bought his plans a couple of years before that.. so.. more like 3-4 years ago now? I still have 2 of his current email addresses (and they're not the ones you see posted most places online) and when I mentioned buying plans from him, almost exactly a year ago today, he advised me to obtain them from Duckworks. So I'm guessing/assuming that these days, he'd prefer to not have to deal with the whole process himself. Understandable if you consider that he must be getting up in years. However, feel free to PM me if you'd like his current email addy, Toocoys.

Toocoys - is there any particular reason why you wish to avoid buying from Duckworks?

[JAFO]

Originally Posted by Delancey

Okay, here's something kind of interesting on the subjuct of freeboard. Look in the photo and see how it looks like a strake was added above the originally designed gunwale. Can't see it so well from the outside beacuse of the fender added around it. Thought that was interesting.

Thanks to the magic of the Internet Archive's 'Wayback Machine', I've been able to find some more photos of this build. Worth sharing, I think, because there are some interesting ideas amongst them.

Firstly, on the topic of freeboard. The Chameleon shown above was built to a LOA of just 8'6". Hence her name, "Gecko". This size was achieved by doing a linear reduction of all dimensions by 11%, which resulted in somewhat less freeboard than a standard Chameleon. This not only caused some stability concerns, but also resulted in the oarlocks being too low, meaning the rower's hands would bang against their legs on the downstroke.

As Delancy mentions above, strakes were added around the gunnels to solve this issue.

The first "new" photo I've located, is a shot of the first strake being added. I've enlarged it somewhat, so it's a bit pixelated, but it's still quite informative. I present it here, because some people still regard the Chameleon's freeboard as being on the low side, and this is one solution to that.




And now for the other "new" photos I found.

"Features shown in the photos are: [1] protection of the transom finish when the outboard motor is fitted [2] towing ring located near the waterline (reinforced with a backing plate) [3] bowlocker with waterproof hatch, cleat (also reinforced with a backing plate), and nonskid finish [4] security cable for oars [5] reinforced bolt holes (stainless steel pipe nipples buried in the bulkhead) and lifting rings for bridle and [6] dual rowlocks with reinforcing along the gunwale."

[JAFO]

I missed one photo.

[rb1685]

I just recently finished and launched my Chameleon, "KILLICK". Sailed it for the first time yesterday, and it sails wonderfully.

Here's the full build album.

https://imgur.com/gallery/UZ5y52j

[JAFO]

Originally Posted by rb1685

I just recently finished and launched my Chameleon, "KILLICK". Sailed it for the first time yesterday, and it sails wonderfully.

Here's the full build album.

https://imgur.com/gallery/UZ5y52j

Beautiful job! Well done.

[Jammer]

Originally Posted by rb1685

I just recently finished and launched my Chameleon, "KILLICK". Sailed it for the first time yesterday, and it sails wonderfully.

Here's the full build album.

https://imgur.com/gallery/UZ5y52j

Beautiful, high quality build. The brightwork accents make it a real work of art.


I am curious about the workshop. Were you able to lease workshop space, or do you have a deeper connection with the shop?

[TooCoys]

Originally Posted by JAFO

Toocoys - is there any particular reason why you wish to avoid buying from Duckworks?

Just wasn’t sure what I was dealing with when I Google searched. Hadn’t heard of Duckworks before and relatively simple web pages make me hesitate.

[JAFO]

Originally Posted by TooCoys

Just wasn’t sure what I was dealing with when I Google searched. Hadn’t heard of Duckworks before and relatively simple web pages make me hesitate.

Fair enough. Just so that you're aware, for builders of small wooden boats, they're famous as one of the best and biggest suppliers in the US.. so you can order with confidence.