Going 60NM offshore with Beneteau 26?

[keyway]

If you are not familiar with the boat I would recommend a couple of day sails with someone how is familiar with that boat. Have proper safety equipment and go for for it. If you prove your project maybe you can get more funds for a bigger boat!!

[wingssail]

Originally Posted by Jaco Versfeld

Good day,

Our research group at the university has a sail boat - Beneteau 26 - which we use for research. Our research group looks at developing algorithms and systems for detecting, classifying and tracking cetaceans (whale) using passive acoustics.

We have a localisation system that we want to test out, but this requires that we operate in deepish waters (1000m - 2000m) in order to minimise reflections.

We operate from False bay, South Africa. In order to reach the required depth, the shortest route would be about 60NM.

If we do this, I assume it will be a three day excursion. Day one: to sail out - 60 NM. Day two: Experiments. Day three: sail back.

Would a Beneteau 26 be up to the job?

The boat is certified for 4 or 5 people, but this is too much. I envisage a crew of three if we do this with the Beneteau 26, as space is very cramped.

Obviously, with the Beneteau 26, one will have to choose a very good weather window. The Beneteau has a Yanmar 2YM15 engine - which is awesome. We will take plenty extra fuel with. We have a VHF and a B&G Vulcan 7 installed on the Beneteau. (I will update flares to Cat A/ or Cat B - offshore, we currently have Cat C CoF - 25 NM from land) If we undertake the trip, I would also get a 4 man life raft for the boat.

Would the Beneteau be up to the job, or should we rather look at a more robust boat which is over the 30 feet threshold for proper offshore sailing - something like a Miura 30?

Any suggestions will be greatly appreciated,
Jaco

Jaco, this could be quite the adventure but there are some risks and the safety aspects are important. i hope my tips will not sound too basic.

TIP #1: TAKE THIS SERIUOSLY

The boat
Since this is a Uni owned boat it very likely does not have regular and consistent maintenance. You need to enlist a reliable and knowledgeable sailor to go over the whole boat with you and look for signs of wear or weakness. You don't need to invest in major equipment upgrades, this trip should not require the best and newest of everything. Be sure and take a look at the rig and the sails and sail handling equipment. You may need to be able to reef deeply and reduce headsail area. make sure this works and you know how to do it. Check the steering gear as well as the engine and transmission and gears and linkage for operating them. Insect the lifelines. Be thorough.

Navigation
You must have a good understanding of navigation and some basic equipment with charts and GPS. You should practice this.

Communications
You need to have a means of communicating back to shore if you get into trouble. Cell phne coverage will not be present out there. VHF radio will not reach that far although in the busy shipping lanes around the Cape you will almost always have the means to contact ships. You should carry an epirb, or sat phone, or HF radio, Oh, test them.

Weather
You are going into one of the world's most dangerous oceans, the Southern Ocean, and probably into the Agulhas Current. This is the Cape West Forecast Area. This area can be treacherous. Conditions change quickly. Fortunately the South African Weather Service is very good. You should contact Contact the SAWS Marine Unit and find out their broadcast schedule and channels. Then you should practice receiving them.

Crew
Some one will need to be the Captain. It will be best if that person has some ocean sailing experience and the ability to lead the others. This is not a trip to be taken casually. Going to sea in a small boat is playing for keeps. Seriously. Sea Sickness is debilitating. You can expect one or more of you will be sea sick. Sea sick medication is advised by many people, my wife uses sturgeron for the first day or two. Unfortunately you won't be out long enough to get over the early days of sea sickness, that usually takes three or four days..

Clothing and safetyQuality foul weather gear is essential. Borrow or buy good gear, Do not depend on supermarket rain gear. Expect to be cold so take layers. Each person needs a lifejacket and safety harness with light and whistle. The boat must be rigged with jack lines (at least one). Practice man-overboard procedures. Understand the life raft deployment and use.

WatchesThe Captain will set the a watch schedule covering 24 hours so you always know who is on watch, and who is called up if a second person is needed. Rest for the Off Watch is essential. The watch schedule is posted on the wall so everyone can see when they are off, on etc. On our boat we do 3 hour watches. With three people that means 3 hours on, 6 hours off, quite a luxury for people used to 3 on 3 off with only two crew.

DutiesPost some onboard duties so everyone knows who is responsible for cooking and clean up, as well as other onboard duties.

Food Take prepared meals and snack foods. Instant noodles are good. Candy bars or breakfast bars. Plenty of bottled water. Coffee or tea is good to warm up after a cold night. Skip the beer but a bottle of wine for the nice sunset sail on the way home could be a good reward. Try out the stove and check the amount of stove fuel.

TrainingUnless you are experienced ocean sailors I recommend a one day training sail where you practice operating the boat, the radio, navigation, reefing safety, etc. Cook a meal and wash up. If this goes well your real trip has a chance.

I think there s a lot more but this is all I can think of on the fly.

I hope you don't think this is too basic of information, I don't want to insult you.

Have fun, you will never forget this trip.

[Halam]

Lots of good advice here, including talking about ways to call for help. Help can take a long time to come so my view is you should not rely on being rescued, so you need to be self-sufficient and able to handle bad weather and mechanical problems as well as crew injury and illness. I can't help feeling that if you had the skills needed you would not need to ask the question, 60 miles is 12 hours motoring and maybe 3 gallons of fuel so it's practical to monitor the weather and run home if the barometer drops.

You can build up to this trip and if you do you will know from shorter trips how the boat and crew handle the lumps and bumps. Then you can decide, because in the end, the skipper decides and you need experience to make that judgement.

[JPA Cate]

Good morning, Jaco,

I have only one thing to add to what Fred wrote: Keep aware, if someone gets REALLY sea sick, you'll want to abort the mission. Getting dehydrated from throwing up all the time, is a life threatening situation. Get information from an ER doctor...on how to telll when it is necessary to return, remembering it may take you hours to return to harbor, especially if the current has set you away. ....And it can be difficult at night, visually.

Not saying don't do it, saying do it responsibly. Your passive listening devices should work fine from a 26 ft. boat, but I expect you're going to be challenged for battery power, unless those boats are equipped to run their lights all night?



Ann

[Elie]

Yes a Beneteau 26 can navigate 60 miles offshore. But where you will be sailing you have to keep in mind and watch for the Agulhas Current. Is is a powerfull east setting current that borders the South African shore. It can be very dangerous for any boat in a westerly blow. Huge wave and sometime rogue waves may be created , and you would't want to be cauth in a blow there. Here is a link that you may find informative. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Agulhas_Current

[Dockhead]

Originally Posted by Elie

Yes a Beneteau 26 can navigate 60 miles offshore. But where you will be sailing you have to keep in mind and watch for the Agulhas Current. Is is a powerfull east setting current that borders the South African shore. It can be very dangerous for any boat in a westerly blow. Huge wave and sometime rogue waves may be created , and you would't want to be cauth in a blow there. Here is a link that you may find informative. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Agulhas_Current

Indeed! I mentioned currents in my previous post above, and it's worth mentioning again. I think this thread has generated a lot of good advice and hardly any wrong advice, but I some of it in my opinion is a bit of overkill -- with a good weather window this is NOT a very challenging trip and we shouldn't make the OP afraid. No need for serious foul weather gear, no need for HF radio or sat phone. 60 miles is a day sail, for Pete's sake, or an easy overnighter.



HOWEVER, this business about currents is important. The OP should understand that not only does a current complicate navigation for a small and slow boat like this one, but can create dangerous (or at least very unpleasant) sea states even in fairly mild weather, if the wind blows against the current. So the OP should consider a weather window not only a period (one day longer than the planned passage) with no material risk of more than F5 (say) weather, but also -- no wind against any strong current he may be passing through.


If he is passing through a strong current like the Gulf Stream (?), he will need to do CTS navigation, a somewhat advanced technique which an electronic chart plotter won't do for him. He should find an experienced navigator to help him, or if he wants to post his passage plan on here, I'm sure the guys here will be glad to help.

[Jaco Versfeld]

Thank you very much to everyone that have replied.

I have read through each of the replies. I have certainly learned a lot and picked up many tips.

I currently have a day skippers - (South African ticket, that allows one to sail 15NM from port). I have sailed the Beneteau a couple of times in False bay. I learned early on (the hard way, fortunately together with boats from our local club) that even the semi-protected False bay becomes quite tough with a strong South-Eastern or North Western wind.

I have not sailed outside of the bay, so currents are something that I need to read up and learn about. (Our Sailing School told me about the notorious East coast of South Africa, with the Aghulas current and a South / South West wind ...) For 95% of the time False bay has a short fetch, so I also haven't experienced huge waves ...

Thank you all for all the safety tips. I am going to work through them again.

Thanks for pointing out that I need to obtain a commercial endorsement. This is something that was at the back of my head, but I didn't think about too much. I have initiated the process to obtain the commercial endorsement -it seems easier due to the fact that I have the day skippers.

I think for my immediate situation, it would be best to "charter" a boat with a skipper. In the mean time, I will log up more sailing miles in order to obtain a "Coastal Skipper".

As was pointed out, the systems that we work on will need continuous testing. Working with a limited budget, it might be beneficial for myself to obtain the necessary certification. (It is a tough job, especially the sailing ... )

Thank you to everyone that replied
Jaco

[wingssail]

Originally Posted by Dockhead

Indeed! I mentioned currents in my previous post above, and it's worth mentioning again. I think this thread has generated a lot of good advice and hardly any wrong advice, but I some of it in my opinion is a bit of overkill -- with a good weather window this is NOT a very challenging trip and we shouldn't make the OP afraid. No need for serious foul weather gear, no need for HF radio or sat phone. 60 miles is a day sail, for Pete's sake, or an easy overnighter.

HOWEVER, this business about currents is important. The OP should understand that not only does a current complicate navigation for a small and slow boat like this one, but can create dangerous (or at least very unpleasant) sea states even in fairly mild weather, if the wind blows against the current. So the OP should consider a weather window not only a period (one day longer than the planned passage) with no material risk of more than F5 (say) weather, but also -- no wind against any strong current he may be passing through.

If he is passing through a strong current like the Gulf Stream (?), he will need to do CTS navigation, a somewhat advanced technique which an electronic chart plotter won't do for him. He should find an experienced navigator to help him, or if he wants to post his passage plan on here, I'm sure the guys here will be glad to help.

Dockhead, OP says he thinks a charter with a skipper might be better, so possibly this is a mute point, but I just want to reiterate my statement that they would need foulies (and lifejackets and tethers).

The Cape West forecast zone is a stormy place where weather systems come up frequently and from the West where there are few weather stations, so they are often not well predicted as to strength and conditions. Anybody sailing in that area may experience gusty wind and rain regardless of the forecast, any time of year.

The Agulhas is not only a very strong current, which runs against the prevailing winds, but as it sweeps westward around South Africa it picks up figid Antarctic water. That SW coast of Africa is cold, even in the summer.

They were not contemplating a 60 mile day trip, they were contemplating a 120 mile trip with a day spent on station, so probably three days at sea.

Throw in potential sea sickness...whew, it can get serious.

Given all of that I think that the risk of getting wet and hypothermic is real and a danger. Imagine, in a 26 ft boat, gusty, rainy conditions, one person down with seasickness and the other two hypothermic and trying to deal with reefing or some other boat issue. Scary. But if they are well protected with proper clothing then there is a much better chance for them to remain functional than being in soaking wet jeans, jumper, and sneakers.

I've had this issue with crew sailing in those waters. They didn't want to buy foul weather gear. I said, "OK, you're not going." They did buy West Marine 3rd Reef gear and they wound up living in it.

[Little Song]

Hello.

I would suggest to take a look at this link, at least for inspiration...

https://youtu.be/yUi0gsxVHZM

Best.
Jorge

[GrowleyMonster]

The boat will be up to it, given certain limitations. The crew? Better be sure about that. If funds are available, I would DEFINITELY go with a bigger boat and a paid skipper at least the first go. Honestly I would be surprised of your school's insurance carrier would sign off on this adventure as planned. I have rounded the cape many times in ships. BIG ships. And often even a large ship will give it's crew a pretty rough ride, stuff breaking loose and sliding/rolling all over the place, machinery breaking down, even generators and main engines tripping due to oil sump level alarms, etc. Sometimes the weather is very nice there. So they say. I haven't seen it so. The Agulhas current is indeed something to be reckoned with, and the prevailing winds BLOOOOOOOOWWWWWWWWW. Yeah, the boat can probably take it. The crew maybe not and an inexperienced crew will cause itself more problems than the weather will.

[petter5]

Really, you ask the wrong question: It's not about the size of the boat, but the seamanship and experience of the crew,,,,,,

[skenn_ie]

No problem for that boat. My parents sailed from Mumbai to Karachi in a similarly sized wooden boat. A friend sailed a Hurley 22 from Ireland to StMaarten via Portugal and Canaries. The did get hot by a storm, tore mainsail, repaired it and completed the journey. 60NM offshore, in fair weather shouldn't be a problem. I say shouldn't because things do go wrong, and the sea is not a very forgiving place. DO wear lifejackets when on deck. DO carry a liferaft. DO keep an eye on the weather, and try to avoid the areas where rogue waves are known to frequent. BE PREPARED, DON'T TEMPT Neptune by taking the sea for granted.

[Adelie]

You probably want to look into whether the trip is subject to commercial rules, it’s for research with an expected product. That means it’s in a grey area. Depends on local rules.

[skenn_ie]

Originally Posted by Adelie

You probably want to look into whether the trip is subject to commercial rules, it’s for research with an expected product. That means it’s in a grey area. Depends on local rules.

I suspect that it only relevant if the crew is being paid to to the job.

[barnakiel]

If this is research not a pleasure trip, then you must comply with not just reason but also the legal requirements in RSA.


Bene 26 is a small light boat and the waters offshore False Bay can be very very rough at times.


Is it not safer and simpler to hire a powerful rib and do the research from such a platform?


If your spot is only 60 miles offshore, a power boat can cover this in less than 2 hours. In a sailing boat, it can be anything from 12 to infinity hours.


Personally, as a sailor, I would rather not be 60 miles offshore False Bay in a Benneteau 26 - especially if my plan were to return to False Bay (rather than follow whatever the weather throws at me, and end up in Namibia ... or Recife (Brazil)).


barnakiel