Ketch vs Sloop vs Cutter

[bob perry]

Me too and it's 50 years.

[Jim Cate]

Originally Posted by zeehag

i only know what i have experienced ...

And that, dear Zee, is the trouble with anecdotal evidence!

Jim

[capnorv]

Bob, Zee, as I have it, age wise you're contemporaries, I too have over 50 years experience on boats (have the video to prove it), but I would never think my experiences could hold a candle to Bob Perry Naval Architect...just saying. Maybe that's because I'm only in my mid 50's, but I think my respect is for the accomplishments of the man.

[Curmudgeon]

With respect to the Ketch, I would refer posters here to a very fine (and beautifully illustrated) publication entitled "Yacht Design According to Perry: My Boats and What Shaped Them" and in particular the passages appearing on pp. 81-82 (comparing the Tayana cutter to the ketch) and p. 163 (discussing the pros and cons of a Ketch sailing "jib and jigger" in heavy air).

[bob perry]

All I was trying to say in my nnormal smart ass way was it is dangerous to generalize. There are good and bad sloops and here are good and bad ketches.

[Curmudgeon]

But isn't it true that, all other things being relatively equal (e.g. LWL, hull configuration, type of keel, etc.) the sloop will have its inherent advantages, but so will the ketch?

[Sailmonkey]

I like sailboats........I have a ketch now, but have owned a sloop......I thought they both sailed nicely but differently.............what else is there to be said!!

[zeehag]

good and bad everything--ketches, sloops, sailors, everything... even some designs werent so great-- i learned on gaff rigged sloop--sloops are great--i have one. i also have ketch-- they are great also--each has a different job,and a different performance base.

[bob perry]

There you have it.

[S/V Alchemy]

My pal has a Goderich 40 center-cockpit, round-chined steel ketch. It's a substantial piece of work from the drafting board of Bob Wallstrom and Ted Brewer (I believe Mr. Wallstrom actually drew it, but it's definitely got Brewer "touches".) I've ridden this boat in some big air, and it does quite well with the mizzen/jib combo, but she can't point even as well as my own 41' steel cutter (in other words, not even close to my Viking 33.)

On the other hand, were my friend to produce his long-buried mizzen staysail or mizzen spinnaker, I'm pretty sure he'd take me in a light air reach.

There's arguments in favour of the ketch, sure, but the fact is that they've fallen from favour in the "regular folks" list of new boats, and are pretty rare in decent condition in the used market. I would've had one had I been able to source it, but a steel cutter found locally made more sense. Why would I have favoured a ketch? Because I can't afford a Shearwater 43 or a Saga 43, and I want to cruise before I die or win a lottery. A couple can operate a ketch with muscle power, usually, and there's a stronger likelihood of keeping a bunch of (relatively) lower, smaller sails up. The ketch staysail, for instance, is, with a reefed mizzen, capable of driving the whole boat at apparent wind speed that would argue for a trysail and/or storm jib on a sloop, and yet is arguably safer to manage.

Now, if I could only make a case for the yawl...

[bob perry]

Don't forget that a ketch is more expensive to build.

[slap]

Originally Posted by S/V Alchemy

Now, if I could only make a case for the yawl...

Yawls are pretty. And sometimes, that's enough.

[Sailmonkey]

Originally Posted by bob perry

Don't forget that a ketch is more expensive to build.

And maintain.....sort of like having a 32' boat and a 20' boat

[Curmudgeon]

Yes, there's the extra mast rigging and therefore windage with a ketch. But that's a small price to pay for having a nice coat rack in your cockpit.