My First Sailboat

[Manateeman]

Little wings. Hi. Your right. I did come down on him like an avalanche but apologize...nope. Give me a shot at what I see from my side.
I’ve been sailing, like you, since childhood. I’ve built a lot of boats. By myself, and for both good and bad OEMs. I’ve known good and bad surveyors. I’m qualified as a USCG safety coordinator which is a level above inspector.
You hold a Yachtmaster, which I most admire. I hold an active Merchant.
So let’s just say both of us are pretty knowledgeable.
OK? First time boat owner comes on the forum and he’s got a real problem.
I do a little research to find the videos so he can either help himself do the job or feel more in control if he has a yard do it.
Maybe I should have told him to get an attorney because the keel issue is an expensive job involving a lot of work. But it’s his first boat. I open the thread and see the post saying you need an ABYC Certified Corrosion Expert.
That statement is utter nonsense.
So I look at the about me stuff on the poster and find out he is either recommending himself or another ABYC guy.
Fear mongering.
He told someone to go get an ABYC corrosion expert when it’s just a case of a rusted keel...and on the web, there is a nice video on how to fix it.
Make a mountain out of a mole hill and expect an avalanche.
My father was an attorney in admiralty. I’ve seen first hand in court, the opinions of experts bought and paid for...maritime ambulance chasers.
What there is no need for on this forum, are fear mongers and posters who hide everything about their credentials.
I won’t apologize for calling out bad advice. Especially toward new owners.
Especially recommendations for senseless expenditures.
I saw fear mongering. Period.
Anyway, happy trails to you.
Captain Mark and his happy boatbuilding manatees

[jpendoley]

Jon Von Orient welcome to CF. One of the great benefits of this forum is the tremendous depth of experience and willingness to share it on this forum. You do need to take it at face value though-its free and freely given. Some my comment casually and others more thoughtfully-it’s up to you to filter it, consider the source and validate the advice given. Both ManateeMan and BoatPoker have given you good perspectives and you have some things to ponder.

[jpendoley]

I sent that before finishing...in my novice opinion tempered by many years of working on old boats-your problem may be minor or it could be a bigger one. The holes are there for a reason-if it were me I would get on a Dufour owners forum and ask for yet more advice before taking any action. Both ManateeMan and BoatPoker gave you good advice.

[upstateny]

ManateeMan I think it is possible to post your different opinions without negative (bullying) comments toward other members.

For starters lets start off with being respectful of other members.

This is not that complicated. You can post different opinions without the hate and anger.

[JonVonOrient]

Thank you everyone for your help, as well as welcoming me to the forum.
I have been a lurker for a while, reading many people's adventures and stories wondering when I would acquire my own sailboat and am finally glad to say that I have one.

Now about the holes, I talked with the marina who informed me that they were the ones who made the holes.
Backstory time, this boat was abandoned not just once but three times. And before I acquired her, the yard wanted to chop her up. But before that, they wanted to know what metal her keel was and when they found out it was iron they gave up as the cost of iron was not worth the scrappage fee.

So I at least knowthst she was not in the water with those girls. But I now need to check if the rust is surface rust or deeper.
I learned that Dufour made the keel out of iron and encapsulated it in fiberglass. So my question is what techniques would you guys use to find out if it is indeed surface rust?

My plan was to buy a small automotive camera and try to Dremel the hole out until I get the rust off and then paint it with rustoleum to prevent further oxidation.
Next I would consult a surveyor on to the best course of action to reseal the holes and preform a final inspection of the ballast.

Do you guys/gals have a better suggestion or advice?

[Manateeman]

There are two videos on exactly this repair. Google the boat make and keel repair. The keel bolts are hidden. It’s not like the iron sides of the keel being rusty is the problem ( the rust will expand and can split the glass) ...the issue is the keel bolts...they hold the keel onto the hull.
The whole thing probably can be fixed if you are willing to do all the crappy dirty work. I’ll see if I can find the video.
Mark and his hungry manatees

[Manateeman]

Just google Dufour 35 keel bolts and you will find three videos.
Step by step on removing the glass, unbolting, fixing it all back.
The glass work is just filthy and hard but it will give you great satisfaction.
It does come off. Grinding the steel is just grinding. You really ought to do the job right. No camera needed. There was a lot of water and rust.
You might ask the people who did the video about tips, money and time.
Happy trails to you
Captain Mark and his aluminum loving manatees

[Jim Cate]

Originally Posted by Manateeman

There are two videos on exactly this repair. Google the boat make and keel repair. The keel bolts are hidden. It’s not like the iron sides of the keel being rusty is the problem ( the rust will expand and can split the glass) ...the issue is the keel bolts...they hold the keel onto the hull.
The whole thing probably can be fixed if you are willing to do all the crappy dirty work. I’ll see if I can find the video.
Mark and his hungry manatees

I'm not familiar with this marque, but I thought that the whole point of encapsulated ballast was that they did not depend upon keel bolts. What is going on here?

Jim

[JPA Cate]

Jon,

Boat has been abandoned 3 times?

Owner/boatyard thought she's worthless?

It is time to ask yourself how much time/and money you are willing to devote to an effort at repair. It should be a super learning experience, IF you have the time and money, or a soul-sucking nightmare. You might want to give yourself a little emotional distance, to assess the problem. You may want to open it up and have a look.

Ann

PS. If someone is sending harrassing PMs. Be aware, they must conform to the posting rules, (PMs are treated as if they were posts). Failure to do so has consequences. JPA Cate, moderator

[Calif.Ted]

The first 2 repair videos were very illuminating, you should watch them, note the pace of work. You retired with lots of time and good weather available ?

[JonVonOrient]

Alright I am back,

So while J have been searching for a surveyor in the upper Maryland area to look at the keel. I have been focusing on repairing the cracks I have found underneath the floorboards.
Upon dremeling them out they seem to be limited to the gel coat. Which I can only assume was because the boat has been on the hard for 15+ years. Right now, I am preparing all of the materials to begin fairing/filling the cracks with West marine epoxy filler.

Following that I am going to address the various holes in the boat for equipment the previous owners wanted to install but didn't.

Attached are the cracks that I have found in the bilge.

[JonVonOrient]

I plan to have these filled by Sunday, and then work on the issues with the top decks which I believe will need a layer or mat in two small areas.

I would like to repaint her before the winter sets in or at least in October but I am not sure if I can make that deadline with how much rain I have been getting.

[JonVonOrient]

My goal so far is to get from here to the water by April/May. She does not need to be the prettiest boat on the water but she must be safe and functional.

I will be repainting her though don't worry, that will come after the keel is looked into. I plan to buy a borescope too and take a look into the holes to see what can be viewed.

[LittleWing77]

Thanks for the pictures, Jon!

Doesn't it just want to make you get into all those crevasses with a scrub brush?

Peggie Hall recently posted about a formula for cleaning the bilges with a power washer... I'll see if I can find it for you.

Good luck with those cracks!
Warmly,
LittleWing77

[JonVonOrient]

I have the green scoring pads that are used for dishes. That I am going to use as well as star-brite hull cleaner to try and get that to a better shade of white.
Admittly she is not the greatest looking boat at the moment.