My search for a boat may have just happened.

[GordMay]

“... The one real problem with the Vanguard’s basic structure is the keel (it’s not a problem as long as you don’t hit anything, but groundings, for the curious cruiser, are as predictable as the tide). The lead ballast castings were set in a bed of resin inside the hollow keel, which is part of the hull mold, then glassed over so that water entering the keel cavity will not enter the cabin. Without fiberglass reinforcement, the resin bed is brittle and provides little added protection from a grounding. Voids between the ballast and keel sides were filled with various types of material over the years, including sheets of balsa, which can soak up water like sponges if the keel is holed ...”
➥ https://www.practical-sailor.com/rev...rd-1229-1.html

➥ The venerable Pearson Vanguard This grandÂ* old dame willÂ* always be someone

➥ pearson vanguard at pearsonvanguard.org

[topfish]

Originally Posted by GordMay

“... The one real problem with the Vanguard’s basic structure is the keel (it’s not a problem as long as you don’t hit anything, but groundings, for the curious cruiser, are as predictable as the tide). The lead ballast castings were set in a bed of resin inside the hollow keel, which is part of the hull mold, then glassed over so that water entering the keel cavity will not enter the cabin. Without fiberglass reinforcement, the resin bed is brittle and provides little added protection from a grounding. Voids between the ballast and keel sides were filled with various types of material over the years, including sheets of balsa, which can soak up water like sponges if the keel is holed ...”
➥ https://www.practical-sailor.com/rev...rd-1229-1.html

➥ The venerable Pearson Vanguard This grandÂ* old dame willÂ* always be someone

➥ pearson vanguard at pearsonvanguard.org

I read all these links Gord and am now a little scared about this boat. The info was very good and am grateful for your input. You are not the only person mentioning these issues so I really should take this to heart! Another poster commented on some boats closer to me in the PNW. My search yielded none guess I am just not that savvy lol. I did find a cape dory 28 that looks clean.

[Cadence]

Pearson has made good boats. Beyond that?

[Sailmonkey]

Originally Posted by topfish

I read all these links Gord and am now a little scared about this boat. The info was very good and am grateful for your input. You are not the only person mentioning these issues so I really should take this to heart! Another poster commented on some boats closer to me in the PNW. My search yielded none guess I am just not that savvy lol. I did find a cape dory 28 that looks clean.

Keep in mind that any boat at any time can have similar types of problems. Base each boat on its individual condition, not an overview.

[Cheechako]

Shipping cost will kill that deal. Not a cheap price on a boat that old anyway.

[Don C L]

Originally Posted by chris95040

No, I was not referring to something else, I was referring to a Vanguard that ended up in pieces in the dumpster after the internal ballast broke loose, although if you have an internally ballasted boat I can understand you wanting to plug your ears for that story.

It was relayed to me, but its easy to imagine how it happened: The vanguards have a few voids in the keel that notoriously end up filled with water, many owners end up installing drains for them. Even though lead ballast won't rust like cast iron, freeze/thaw cycles of the water in those voids could easily do some damage. As I recall, the ballast was installed after the keel shell was molded up and was supported with foam and wood, builders sure do love an achilles heel...

Personally this story has always soured me on internal ballast, no way to inspect whats supporting the keel. Failure is a rare occurrence I'm sure, but one you have no real way to mitigate.

That's a new one for me, I had never heard of encapsulated ballast becoming dislodged before. Thanks for the info. I certainly had heard of water intrusion after a grounding but didn't know it could cause that problem. In my own boat of course I have seen 0 problems in that department but I do know of a story of one of mine (Columbia 29) that hit a rock and punched a hole in the keel and then kept on going across the Atlantic... don't know what happened after that though! I still prefer my encapsulated lead though.

[topfish]

Originally Posted by Cheechako

Shipping cost will kill that deal. Not a cheap price on a boat that old anyway.

I thanked you privately but should also post for others as well. I believe your the third person to share this with me. Thinking it is wise to listen and take council. I believe the 6K shipping rate was pretty low. I am also finding the 5200 dollar deck delamination does not come off asking price so that will be a deal breaker for me. I did receive a message a few minutes ago from broker. He is busy at present with an in water boat show. This is why I have not received the survey! Again Thanks for you thoughtful input! It really helps me.

[SuW]

Originally Posted by topfish

I will have to do some research on composting heads. The boat will be in Texas or San Diego. All thru holes were replaced except the head. I may just invest in a fresh water vacu flush head. My parents love it on their trawler. I hear mixed views on composting heads so that will be addressed and to me is not a big matter! I do look forward to chatting with you on this matter later. Thanks a Bunch!

No problem. We decided on the composting head after talking to others who already had one. One friend was so enthusiastic that he allowed us to borrow his Nature's Head for a month in the winter (he'd already cleaned it out) and that was the one we used in the house. It worked great.

I understand that some people have a visceral reaction to dealing with human waste and by products but there is nothing more demotivating to a sailing wife than getting a serious blowback from a holding tank when pumping out. For one thing, everyone else at the dock laughs...so I'd rather deal with the solid (mostly) non-smelly residue of a composting head than that!

Again, if you're in cooler climate, the decomposition might not be active all the year.

[hamburking]

Not to muddy the waters, but have you seen this:

1964 Pearson Vanguard Sail Boat For Sale - www.yachtworld.com

Quite an awesome boat!

[hamburking]

Originally Posted by topfish

I read all these links Gord and am now a little scared about this boat. The info was very good and am grateful for your input. You are not the only person mentioning these issues so I really should take this to heart!

I owned/sailed a 1971 Pearson 30 for 5 years, sold it recently. Encapsulated fin keel. No problems at all. Even after I hit a rock....just patched up the scar the following spring with some epoxy. However, sailing a 45 year old boat did make me worry a bit more when the wind got strong and the waves got big.

[Cadence]

Originally Posted by hamburking

Not to muddy the waters, but have you seen this:

1964 Pearson Vanguard Sail Boat For Sale - www.yachtworld.com

Quite an awesome boat!

If that's the one he is speaking of she looks sweet for19K. I' can't see trucking across the country. The engine bed is impressive as are the plugs from the hull. She was built when some glass went into construction. A composting head would be a nit.

[hamburking]

Originally Posted by Cadence

If that's the one he is speaking of she looks sweet for19K. I' can't see trucking across the country. The engine bed is impressive as are the plugs from the hull. She was built when some glass went into construction. A composting head would be a nit.

Oh yeah...I think that must be the one the OP wants to buy! I missed that.

I'd buy it.

Don't truck it to the PNW...sail it to the Caribbean... from Texas should not be a problem.

[Catboatjoe]

I have a friend who re-powered his Vanguard with a Beta 20hp. He cruises Long Island Sound and is really happy with the engine and the amount of power it has.

[captlloyd]

Go on YouTube and do a search for “ composting toilet”. Lots of good info, 90% in favor I might add.

[chris95040]

Originally Posted by Catboatjoe

I have a friend who re-powered his Vanguard with a Beta 20hp. He cruises Long Island Sound and is really happy with the engine and the amount of power it has.

Yeah, I had a 2qm15, 2 cylinder yanmar, seemed plenty.