New to steel.

[Andreas W]

Originally Posted by markcouz

Bruce Roberts boats have a good reputation in RSA where sailing can be really tricky. We have frontal systems coming up from the roaring 40's every few days (Cape Town is at 38S) and moving up our coastline against the powerful Agulhas current - which combination can ruin your day!

As I was looking for steel the main contenders were BR45 and Lavranos 42 of which a few examples are available in our market. I quickly scratched out the Lavranos because the liveaboard space is vastly better in the BR.

Many of the BR in RSA where built in one of 2 yards to a high standard, often as hull/deck only finished by owner - some good some not so good (but hull good).

I finally settled on a BR45 which is solid fiberglass with no core, is is very strong and also very heavy (17T) - so not winning any races but that was never my plan.

I like the Bruce Roberts boats. You are lucky to have such good steel boat builders in SA. Well, not so many anymore as in the 1980's but still.

I had a Dix 43 myself. Built in Welkom, and finished in Durban where I had her till 2016.

[hpeer]

Makobuilders,

That kind of crazy is not limited to steel boats and is a concern in ANY boat. VERY recently someone was discussing their generator that was installed into the hull and then the deck installed with NO provision to remove the generator, production car IIRC. I had a guy show me his engine in a production Ketch, access was through the back of an aft stateroom locker. The engine had to be disassembled in place to remove and install.

IMHO it should be required on every pre-purchase survey to observe and report on replacement access to any big objects. A good grinder WILL remove the washer. I’ve taken out a Heavy steel fuel tank in 10 pound pieces.

[markcouz]

... what decided it for me was that a meticulous old German was unable to control the rust despite his impressive effort because of the inaccessible areas - you won't either unless all internal cabinetry is easily removed and reinstalled, and you are prepared to do that on a regular basis.

[mako]

Access.

I recall one of the Pardey’s early books where they discussed how the entire interior of their wood boat was accessible. How once a year they would empty the boat and wash it down inside with a hose.

That would be such a wonderful trait of a steel boat!

[FAST FRED]

I don’t now now if this vessel is under powered because if you use the formula I have read about out there where it is 1 hp per 500 pounds of weight that would put this vessel and it’s engine right at the limit for his 30,000

The usual , Rule of Thumb is 3 hp for a ton (2240lbs) of displacement .

At about 13 tons you may be slightly under powered , no big deal.

A fat boat will use the sq rt of the LWL times .9 rather than 1.34.
A light or skinny boat may use 1.4 or even 1.5 if both light and slender.

An installed engine with a good prop will produce 15 hp for each gallon of fuel burned.

[hpeer]

I have an 8 ton, 16,000# steel boat, 33’ on deck. She has a 1985 Volvo MD-7A, 13 hp. I get around pretty well. Thats 1.6hp/ton. I do tend to run her hard at times, near max.

Our 20 ton, 40,000# steel boat, 44’ on deck has a 2006 Yanmar 4JH4, 72 hp. I get around pretty well. That’s 3.6 hp/ton. I do run her pretty lightly most of the time, down around the 50hp range because she feels better there and the fuel economy is better. That’s 2.5hp/ton. I only use more up in special situations like trying to get off being aground, and when in a back and fill turn to kick the prop walk or when setting the anchor.

NOTE: calcs using 2,000 “short” ton.

[yr2030]

Originally Posted by Lucas1983

I seem to get conflicting answers that controversy about aluminum being pretty much hassle free in the only way to go oh, I'm interested to hear what you discovered. How big was this boat for you to call in a condo boat or do you just mean the layout is Tonye staterooms sort of like what I'm after except mine is pretty small unless I was to sacrifice the crash is owns on the bow and Stern and make those part of the rooms which isn't worth it since they're sealed up pretty good in the boat shouldn't sink very easy god forbid a missile hits me.

Aluminum is great in FRESH WATER. Not worth a tinkers dam in salt.

Sutton designed it, but someone else built it in the 50s. The three masted schooner was 19m oal, 15m lwl, 5.4m beam, 3m draft and didn't sail worth a dam. Keel was a 17m x 45cm steel I-beam; ballast 12MT of steel; 12mm at keel 9mm below waterline, 4mm on deck. Three staterooms, one head. I had to insulate the hull and provide watertight doors. The mechanicals were fine - passed easily. I got it for a song - but in hindsight, I should have walked away on it. It never left our dock in Akureyri.

Personally I would take a wood gulet before aluminum

[mako]

Originally Posted by yr2030

Personally I would take a wood gulet before aluminum

Speaking of wood gulets (yes I know that's a Turkish thing), but when I was living in India, and then Southeast Asia, I was really tempted to a new-build in wood. India in particular showed better craftsmanship in wood than fiberglass. Prices for the basic hull were fantastic.

Even so, my wife refused to allow me to buy a wood boat - she has more common sense than I do (I'm more of a romanticist)

[yr2030]

Originally Posted by makobuilders

Speaking of wood gulets (yes I know that's a Turkish thing), but when I was living in India, and then Southeast Asia, I was really tempted to a new-build in wood. India in particular showed better craftsmanship in wood than fiberglass. Prices for the basic hull were fantastic. Even so, my wife refused to allow me to buy a wood boat - she has more common sense than I do (I'm more of a romanticist)

I don't know about good sense, but I do go with wood being most prevalent in other countries, not dependent upon fossil fuels. There will come a day when those plastics will be verbotten.

Right now we have a disaster on the reef. 3000MT of fuel is leaking onto our beaches.
Unfortunately for us, we have to move

[hpeer]

Speaking of steel the boat yard I’m at specialized in metal boats and they have introduced me to a paint pre-primer I’ve never heard of before.

Ameron or Devoe Pre-Prime 167z

It used for steel and concrete. It’s a 2 part mix that is nearly the consistency of water. It goes on sparingly, no puddling, and is slow to cure. It is designed for “less than perfect surface preparation” circumstance; hand cleaning.

I’ve heard it described as “creepy” in that it creeps into pores and crevices and seals any active rusty surface. Then you out in the 302 zinc or 235 Bar-Rust while the 167 is still tacky.

I’m working on some hard to reach areas with light surface rust that are normally covered. So I want this to work, I don’t ever want to have to touch these areas again.

I’m cleaning the surface with an oscillating tool. I’ve come to really like this. Use a saw blade, old one will do fine. Wack the paint with the flat EDGE of the blade and any loose paint will come right off, loose surface rust as well. Work with the corners to hit heavier rusted areas. It is great for getting int right angle corners. Sometimes I ant to cut some trim back to allow a little breathing room, not let it rest on the steel. Then I use the teeth of the blade, if it has any.

I have light rust in an area where I can’t get the oscillating tool and can not reach. I bought a short sink snake at Lowe’s. It had a straight piece of steel bent to a crank handle. I wacked off the crank, ran a piece of PVC pipe over it and put it to my drill. I also jammed a 1/2” chisel into the business end. I could run that in where I could not reach and just let the chisel flop around beating the stuffing out until I got no more debris or dust. When the straight shank broke off I just put the flex coil into the drill and that worked just as well. I ran a bore scope in there and it looked pretty good.

Clean this mess up and use OSPHO to convert any remains rust to primeable material.
Then use the 167 to seal.
The 2 coats of 235.

Ask me in 10 or 20 years how it held up.

[Johnknutson]

Originally Posted by Michael Cobbe

Have an ultrasound test which tests the thickness of the metal if it is thinner than it should be then there is rust. The only to fix it and stop it the coming back is to sandblast it and paint it with Zinc rich epoxy.

hello, Im looking for a paint recomendation for my steel boat. Having my boat mediablasted and was told i must coat rightaway to prevent flash-rust.