Production Mono's - Any to avoid?

[sandy stone]

Originally Posted by capn_billl

but there was a boat off of Galveston a few years ago that capsized, and killed most of its crew. Crevice cracks in the keel bolts caused the keel to drop the moment they needed it the most.

Another bit of inaccurate information. This boat also suffered a hard grounding and inadequate repairs to the keel support structure (on a designed-to-the-limit, purely racing boat). The hull failed in way of the keel, crevice corrosion had nothing to do with it. Oh, and "only" one person was killed, the faculty safety officer on what was a college racing crew, who was trapped in the cabin after pushing another crewmember out of the companionway before the boat flooded.

[Paul L]

Originally Posted by Eder

I wasn't fast...others were slower I guess.


PHRF ratings are better when the swells are less than 10' , breezes are under 25kt, and squalls never leave the horizon.


I think my boat was better in the conditions I was sailing and that's why our trip was faster than most.

Certainly boats have sweet spots. Most boats do really well on a reach. The ratings show a little more varied environments.

How many days was your crossing, from where, what size IP.

When we crossed from Panama the biggest difference in similar vessels was the actual route taken. In our year, go smaller lats and get a little more current, go higher lats and get better trades.

[Sputnik]

.....on a slightly different tack (!), there are many boats that have been for sale for a long time. The asking price is often ridiculous, don't be afraid to put a low bid in...if the boat has been for sale for a long time they may take the bait to cut their overhead losses. There are also bargains to be had where "dreamers" have got half way to their goal, or even arrived there, to find that the dream was just that, and want to get out in a hurry, however, that boat isn't going to come to you, you need to get mobile.
FWIW.
Neil

[a64pilot]

Originally Posted by Paul L

Seems a popular thing for IP owners to say how fast they are. The PHRF ratings just don't support it.



Not what the encapsulate keel comment has do with it.

They have a somewhat unjustified rep of being pigs. I think that has more to do with who they are sailed by and how they are sailed than the capability of the boat itself.
The photos of my boat I have under sail were taken from other boats that we were going faster than they were, my avatar was taken from a Lagoon 38 when we were going to windward, and I have photos of us downwind under the code zero from a performance sloop, that was sailing on their white sails cause that was all they had, if they had a code zero, I’m sure they would have been faster.

Also I believe IP’s are more often sailed by Mom and Pop crews that don’t really care much about performance, it’s not why they bought the boat, so you don’t see them performing well, often.
However people that usually buy boats that are known for their performance of course are more likely to be constantly trimming sails and or buying performance sails for the boat etc.

We came back from the Bahamas with an IP 440, which should have been a much faster boat, but wasn’t. I’m still trying to figure out why, they should have run away from us, but didn’t. In fact they had to motor sail just to stay with us, and we were sailing.

None of my sails are factory sails, and they had in mast furling, maybe that is one reason why?
Or maybe it was their shallower draft, even though they are a bigger boat?

[MartinR]

Originally Posted by a64pilot

None of my sails are factory sails, and they had in mast furling, maybe that is one reason why?

That might be itfewer horses. Also, in mast furling tends to attract sailors that are not performance orientated, so maybe they were not trying hard.

[Singularity]

Originally Posted by a64pilot

...Also I believe [XYZ boats] are more often sailed by Mom and Pop crews that don’t really care much about performance, it’s not why they bought the boat, so you don’t see them performing well, often.
However people that usually buy boats that are known for their performance of course are more likely to be constantly trimming sails and or buying performance sails for the boat etc...

Same with cars, bicycles, motorcycles, airplanes, roller-skates, etc. Real world performance I think tends to reflect owner personality much more than it reflects the capability of the machine. Internet forums, coffee shops, bar stool discussions on the other hand will debate the superiority of one marketing spec sheet vs another spec sheet ad nauseam.

I'm still trying to understand how two boats with the same theoretical hull speed that are each traveling at their hull speed can have different speeds while each is traveling at its hull speed.

[sailores35]

How can you sail and never use your traveler. Former IP 35 owner for 27 years.

[a64pilot]

Originally Posted by Singularity

I'm still trying to understand how two boats with the same theoretical hull speed that are each traveling at their hull speed can have different speeds while each is traveling at its hull speed.

I don’t understand what your saying?

[Training Wheels]

If one boat is more heavily loaded, it will submerse the hull in the water. Boats with overhangs increase their waterline length as their draft increases. Therefore, the heavier boat is faster.

[Singularity]

My point is that the merits of the high aspect fin keel are generally exaggerated in typical cruising conditions for typical cruising boats insofar as factors such as the crew's willingness (particularly in the longer keeled boats) to put up adequate and trimmed sails ultimately provides the determinant variable that determines passage speed when two boats that share the same LWL ~hardwall and while other boat planform parameters are kept equal.

From my perspective, maybe wrong...the tendency of a fin keeled boat to be faster is a function of the ease as which it can go faster, not the ultimate capability to go faster (again, when all other planform parameters are kept equal). The whole "don't confuse the enemy's will with his ability" or the "it's not what you got, but how you use it" kind of considerations.

[Training Wheels]

Just because 2 boats have the same waterline length, doesn’t mean the hull speed is the same. Also, lighter boats with flat, wide stern sections plane much easier, allowing them to exceed their hull speed.

[Singularity]

Originally Posted by Training Wheels

Just because 2 boats have the same waterline length, doesn’t mean the hull speed is the same.

Understood. But given two boats of the same LWL, what is the practical difference in real-world cruising conditions when all other factors are kept equal (save difference in effective sail exposed)?

Also, lighter boats with flat, wide stern sections plane much easier, allowing them to exceed their hull speed.

Understood. But again, in real-world conditions, how often is this a factor? How often are people pushing to the point of planing on a passage?

[boom23]

In my opinion, cruising is not racing.

I am very competitive, and I have raced motocross, cars and flew planes. But, for me, cruising is about enjoying and being safe & comfortable. I care less if someone passes me while sailing. I smile and wave from my dry cockpit, with a warm/cold drink in my hand, listening to music.

Not everyone cares about best cruising performance.

[Training Wheels]

But some do.

[boom23]

Originally Posted by Training Wheels

But some do.

Of course! They are the ones passing me...

I just wanted to remind posters that the OP did not mention "best performance" as a requirement.