Steel Boats and Welding

[SaltyMonkey]

Having an internal tank separate from the hull make sense to me - after all most newer tankers have inner hulls, so why not boats?

[GordMay]

Originally Posted by Yachts66

I was told that by a very well know Naval Architect...
... I'm at a loss as to how this was mindless and unsubstantiated.
Thomas

You didn’t originally indicate that you “heard” from a N/A, and you still haven’t identified this source, nor those certifying agencies prohibiting integral tanks. Thus, by definition, your information was & is “unsubstantiated”.

I apologise for characterizing your statement as “mindless”. It was a misplaced turn-around on your “bureaucrats and their mindless rules”.

[Yachts66]

I will ask him if that would be ok with him. It was a private conversation, so I feel it necessary to get his approval first. I'll fire off an email to him and see what he says.

Thomas

[Yachts66]

Ahhh yes, I do have a not so soft place in my heart for bureaucrats, that is true. I stand by that as well.

Thomas

[GordMay]

Originally Posted by SaltyMonkey

Having an internal tank separate from the hull make sense to me - after all most newer tankers have inner hulls, so why not boats?

Tanker and boat construction have little in common.
For instance, the cavity between inner & outer hulls on a tanker, is large enough to permit access, inspection, and repair work.
This would be impractical on a small boat.

[GordMay]

THOMAS:
Please also ask him which Agencies, which type of tank (fuel, water, holding, ???), and apllicable to which type(s) of vessel.

[Yachts66]

Exactly, Gordo, internal tanks which are not integral make inspection and maintenance impossible unless you go to the trouble of removing the tank, which on some boats is almost impossible without removing a good bit of the interior joinery. Which makes the whole idea of non-integral tanks very unappealing to me.

Back in my wayward youth, I owned a marine engineering firm and dealt with ABS, Det Norske and Lloyds fairly regularly. Some of their rules made sense, then and now, some did not. I suspect this situation is a by-product of the double hull rule on ships that just got incorporated into small boats. I'll ask about that as well.

Thomas

[SaltyMonkey]

So Y66 and Gordie, you're saying the current best practice of installing ss, alum, or fiberglass fuel and water tanks on a boat is bogus because of inspection issues?

[GordMay]

No, I'm not.
For a number of reasons, I am generally in favour of integral water & diesel fuel tanks on metal (not galvanized) boats.
Gasoline tanks may NOT be integral regardless of material.

[spiritbaer]

Hello, building an internal tank on a steel boat would not be all that difficult. If you keep the sides and bottom of hull skin air tight rust would not be an issue. What I am talking about is a half inch gap between the tank,the hull sides and bottom. What is there to inspect,all inspection would be externally. After all your keel would have a plate welded across it keeping any bilge fluids from getting in there,and you are not doing any internal inspection on it.
I have several sketch up drawings showing this in better detail but I am having problem posting them keeps telling me too large.

[SaltyMonkey]

Originally Posted by GordMay

Tanker and boat construction have little in common.
For instance, the cavity between inner & outer hulls on a tanker, is large enough to permit access, inspection, and repair work.
This would be impractical on a small boat.

Thanks for the clarification.

[Yachts66]

On this, Gordo and I are in complete agreement.

Thomas

[Brent Swain]

Many screw ups in small boat design come from trying to down size tanker practice on them.

[haidan]

Originally Posted by SaltyMonkey

Thanks Perchance.

Do you use it (welding) at all in your boating at all?

I just finished setting up my alternator welder, works great though a little cold (just a bit) and I think I need to get a bigger pulley on the engine/smaller pulley on alternator to speed it up a big and generate more juice.
So to answer your original question salty, yes in fact I can now weld while sailing if I feel so inclined.

[SaltyMonkey]

oh man! haiden that is just too cool! I'm really impressed!!