tartan 34C yawl vs wellington 47 ketch

[Dooglas]

Originally Posted by dhenline

If you are willing to stay in the US, then I would suggest an RV and some extended camping. It would fit your budget and be equally as escapist. It would likely end up being pleasant.

You don't seem to have a much clearer picture of what is happening at the moment than does the OP. Half the Country is on lockdown already, the rest will be before long. Campgrounds and most other support facilities are closed. People are becoming fearful and suspicious of travelers. No, a road trip right now would not be particularly pleasant, or well advised.

[Sailingmartin]

Waipea. We sailed from the UK to the Caribbean in 2015 with two collie dogs and beyond to the US (we sold that boat there in 2017 and flew home with the dogs). This was a 42ft sailing boat and the dogs coped with this with no problem - the longest period at sea was three weeks. During this time, you play games like hide and seek for treats etc and the dogs just loll about like humans do. Toilet training was easy and done before we left. When they got to St Lucia it was just like normal with no ill effects from the trip. Our dogs have been to more than 15 countries (with EU pet passport), again with no problems as long as you follow the rules - normally a health check in each country and a small fee (allow US$50 for each in every country).

The only problem I can see with your plan is the Pacific as there are so few places that let dogs land, with stiff penalties for breaking the law. I would love to do a circumnavigation with the dogs but this has stopped me. How about going through the Panama Canal to the Caribbean and then go on to Europe where everything is much more dog-friendly?

I am planning to go back to the Caribbean again as soon as the virus will allow - was hoping for this year, but maybe have to postpone until 2021 if I can’t get to leave the UK before September. This time only one dog and 36 ft boat so plenty of room. Went around the UK with the same dog on a 26ft boat in 2018 - this was easy as only a couple of overnight trips were involved. Not sure how to send a copy of this but the trip was featured in the March issue of the Cruising Association magazine if anyone is interested.

Finally, check out the Noonsite website (www.noonsite.com) which lists the entry regulations for virtually every country. If you scroll down you will find the requirements for pets. Good luck.

[Svmoondragon]

We currently live aboard our Wellington 47 ketch. Ours was very well maintained when we purchased her two years ago. That said Wellington boats are getting older and if they have not been treated well they can quickly become very expensive to update or repair.

The Wellington is designed as a blue water boat and sails very well offshore. I can speak from personal experience as we regularly sail offshore. That said you have to really go over any boat you are going to go out with from top to bottom. There are a lot of systems that have to be inspected and kept up with in order for it to be done safely. A cheap boat is going to cost a bunch to be made safe for a trip like that.
We love our boat. She sails beautifully. But this is not a “cheap” boat to own.
If you have any specific questions feel free to ask.

[Pete7]

Originally Posted by Sailingmartin

Went around the UK with the same dog on a 26ft boat in 2018 - this was easy as only a couple of overnight trips were involved. Not sure how to send a copy of this but the trip was featured in the March issue of the Cruising Association magazine if anyone is interested.

Do you have a copy in an electronic format, say word or PDF?

Pete

[cjdport]

Hola! Many here have offered sage advice I will endorse. I did want to chime in re: the Wellington 47. It surfaced great memories of two cruises I did on a friend's 47 flush deck: Annapolis to Tiverton RI and Charleston SC to Fort Pierce FL. Four crew on board and a very comfortable boat - but not one I would venture far off shore, especially short handed. It would make a wonderful home, in the event you decided to stay in one place, and you can work on it until you retire cause you'll never catch up with it! I do hope there's some aspect of your plan you can focus on, until such time as we can all head out the channel again.


Cheers


Craig

[Sailingmartin]

Pete. Yes I have a PDF copy if you want to send me a pm.

[dhenline]

Originally Posted by Dooglas

You don't seem to have a much clearer picture of what is happening at the moment than does the OP. Half the Country is on lockdown already, the rest will be before long. Campgrounds and most other support facilities are closed. People are becoming fearful and suspicious of travelers. No, a road trip right now would not be particularly pleasant, or well advised.

Douglas: I should have been more specific. I meant to imply that OP would not leave in the immediate future. It would take several months to find a decent used RV and get ready for a "land based cruise". I would predict that in several months, travel in the US will be somewhat relaxed.

I am familiar with the current crises. I am a HCW, in the hotspot of Seattle. Yikes

[jbrasseul]

It's a joke.

[Dooglas]

Originally Posted by dhenline

Douglas: I should have been more specific. I meant to imply that OP would not leave in the immediate future. It would take several months to find a decent used RV and get ready for a "land based cruise". I would predict that in several months, travel in the US will be somewhat relaxed.

I am familiar with the current crises. I am a HCW, in the hotspot of Seattle. Yikes

The OP sounds like he is trying to get out of the LA area sooner rather than later. I agree with you that "land cruising" can be a realistic alternative to cruising by boat - at least in better times. I'm afraid, however, that it will take us longer to return to "normal" than most anticipate. Stay safe in your difficult role in the meantime.

[Old fella]

Originally Posted by jim King

I can't imagine a better boat for what you have suggested than the HC34 Lazerbrains suggested : https://www.yachtworld.com/boats/197...utter-3604225/ It is far more sea worthy than either the Tartan or the Wellington you suggested. the price is also way under market for a comparable blue water cruiser. I would advise you buy it and continue to develop your skills by sailing to the Chanel Islands for an adventure in which you will still be in California and not need quarantine for you four legged friends. It will also give you a taste for what the future might bring on longer passages and whether the four of you would be compatible on those journeys. Continue up and down the coast of the US for a few months until the covid 19 virus becomes history. If by then you think the sailing life works for the four of you do some research as to what ports are dog friendly. If the experiment doesn't work out, you won't have any trouble selling a HC34 for close to what you bought it for.
Cheers and best of luck with your adventure.

Perfect advice,do this.

[GRIT]

Big projects, and inexperienced sailors always bring out the naysayers.

Granted, your project isn't going to be easy, but as you read, from two dog loving boats, they can adapt. You already know this. You also have an idea if your wife can adapt.

I'm not a fan of buying a coastal cruiser first, then getting some experience, then selling and upgrading to a larger boat. As you said (Original Poster), it's a buyers market, and you'll just be adding another chore, and another boat to fix.

Buy the boat you figure will satisfy your needs, and learn to sail on it. Cruise the coast on it, as you said you wanted to. I think that's the best way to do it.

It's probably going to be expensive, and a bigger boat does cost more to maintain than a smaller boat, and it's more work to sail. But why does this mean he (OP) can't start out this way? How many Youtubers have started out with these massive boats, and very few seem to die from it.

I started with a 35 footer, as a single hander. That was a big boat back then. Back in the day (early 90's) everyone told me to start with a Tanzer 22, and work my way up.

I bought the 35, having never been on a boat before, delivered it, by water, 1500 miles to my home, and learned to sail on the way. 2 years later, I took it to the Bahamas, from Canada. Most of the guys who told me to start with a 22, have still not been to the bahamas (2020). I learned to sail from Cruising world magazine. Surely he can learn via Youtube.

My point is, stick it out there, and try not to get it cut off. You'll never know unless you try. If those Youtubers can do it, why can't you?

Research, research, research. Find out the facts, cruiser's forum is full of opinions, but few facts. Sorry guys, but you all know it's true.

The only folks I saw on this thread who gave pure facts, were the two dog boats. And those who mentioned quarantine. Pretty much everything else was conjecture. About the dogs, about his budget, about what HE needs to cruise whatever boat HE chooses. We don't all need every bell and whistle. My first boat was a "coastal cruiser", many said wouldn't go anywhere. By the time we (I got married) sold it, it had been from Canada to Trinidad and back, and from Canada to the Bahamas 5 times. That's mostly coastal, but it's far more sailing than any of those folks who wanted me to do it their way.

None of us know anything about this fellow, or his wife, or his dogs. I assume he knows it takes a few weeks to cross the pacific, and I assume he knows whether or not his dogs can handle it. The wife can take Bonine (I do, I get seasick), that and a good attitude will get her places. Maybe she doesn't get sick, mine doesn't.

I'm not in love with offshore cruising, but I do love visiting foreign countries. I've crossed the Atlantic Ocean twice, with this in mind. I suffered greatly on the way to Europe, but loved being there. I wouldn't trade that for anything.

I started with a 35 footer, single handed, before electronic charts were a "thing". Paper charts, a compass, and hand held gps. That was high tech, back then.
I survived, and you're at least as smart as I am. Do your research, talk to folks about the specific boat you're interested in, and go for it.

I know that sounds like a rant, insert smileys where appropriate. I'm just passionate about people doing things other than wishing they were doing things...

Now give me a minute to put my hockey gear on, I know I'm going to get a lot of pucks shot at me now!

Peace.
Paul.

[GRIT]

Ok, I'm dressed. Bring it on.

PS. That HC 34 is precious, it gets my vote. Catalina 38 too, since it's roomy, has a good reputation, and will be faster overall. But you didn't mention the price or condition of the Catalina.

Cheers.
Paul.

[hamburking]

IMHO, the dog question is simple...is it for the benefit of the dogs or the owners?

The OP says the dogs are their "children". Well, when my actual children where old enough to say they didn't want to go sailing, I didn't FORCE them to go. In fact, I sold my boat, since sailing without them was no longer fun for me.

I circumnavigated Lake Ontario with a large dog aboard a C&C27. We found (and paid for) a dock every night...which greatly restricted our schedule (and wallet). And although we visited many interesting places, I never went into a single restaurant, because my dog was always with me. I spent all my time ashore searching for dog parks and carrying a bag of poop.

Later, with a bigger Hunter Legend 35.5, We would anchor out. Then I would spend all my time taking the dog back and forth to shore...at least twice a day, often 4 times a day...in the dinghy.

Occasionally, when it was very rough, my dog suffered below. She would get thrown about the cabin...dogs can't "hold on", and was generally terrified when the waves got big.

When approaching shore, my dog could smell land...and would get excited...making docking even more difficult than necessary. Often she would sprint off the boat and take off on her own. She tolerated the boat, but I knew she would have been better off camping in the woods, or home in her big backyard.

Yes, we had many great times with the dog aboard too. Overall, she enjoyed the places we went, not the boat ride to get there. So I planned my trips with this in mind.

One more note...In my area of Canada, leash laws are standard most places. But on the south shore of Lake Ontario, many of the small towns allow dogs to run free. There we were often met at the dock by a group of local dogs. I allowed my dog to join them. I often worried if they would tear her apart. But joining these free roaming dogs was a great joy for my pet, and there was never any trouble.

[waipea]

Well i went to see the HC34, i was impress by the construction and overbuilt rig, lot of good new gear, the owner moved to saint thomas and need it sold, the main problem with the boat is that i couldn't fit inside, i was hitting my head all over the place, i wish i was 6 inches shorter, also the teak looked expensive to
maintain.
i went to see a pearson 365 that was mod as a Sloop and me and my wife vibe with the boat, the owner was in default with the broker and he wasn't able to keep making payments i put an offer for 18K and was accepted , it has a new yanmar 39 Hp with 750 hours, and the boat overall looks in really good condition i have schedule a good survey for wednesday to go over the boat, the surveyor who has more than 6000 surveys and with 47 years of experience told me that the pearson it a very capable offshore boat, he mention that can be slow in light winds but its a very stable and safe boat.

me and my wife decided to hold on about the pacific not because we are afraid to die in the ocean like some of you told me, but for the restrictions in New Zealand and Australia with the dog quarantine , the plan is to leave the US in a year from now sailing south, explore and cruise the Sea of Cortes for a while where passages will be shorter and the dog are welcome ashore and enjoy some desert hikes and day in the beach, then keep going south and go around the cape of horn ... nah now Im joking lol, we'll do the canal and get into the Caribbean , we know the Caribbean is a dream destination for most people but since we born and raised there we know the good , the bad and the ugly and thats why maybe we were underestimating the place. if everything goes good with the survey i should have a boat in a week from now.

[GRIT]

Congratulations. Yes, that's a good choice, in my opinion. 365 has quite a lot of room for a boat of that size, and they're pretty rugged.

You must be very excited!

Again, congratulations.

Paul.