Thoughts on possible new boat

[SY Kelpie]

I'm firmly at the daydreaming stage of this, pretty happy with the current boat (Moody 39) which I've had for five years. But it's nice to start planning ahead!

Looking to build up a shortlist of suitable boat designs which fit the following criteria:
- just under 12m LOA
- less than 1.8m draft
- moderate to good performance (~SA of 16+)
- solid enough to take the ground (longish fin or wing keel, probably skeg hung rudder)
- wide enough transom to take usual cruising clutter (davits, windvane)
- inline spreaders for easier downwind sailing on white-sails only
- at least one good seaberth for each tack, near the middle of the boat

That's the essentials. The nice-to-have list would include:
- shaft drive preferred over saildrive
- tankage of at least 200l diesel, 500l water
- one heads should be at the companionway
- at least one good private double cabin, a second private single or double cabin, plus either a third cabin for storage, or a workshop type space
- reasonable galley space; fridge and freezer must be easily accessible
- ability to entertain 8 in the cockpit, 6 for dinner
- no big overhanging counter (slapping, awkward dinghy access in a swell)
- minimal teak
- cutter rig


I know that this will describe an awful lot of boats, and I'm deliberately trying to build a list rather than find a 'best' model. And some of my points are pretty flexible, e.g. tanks can be upgraded, teak can be removed.

Anyway, hit me with some ideas!

[S/V Illusion]

Cutter rig…. You need a personal shopper, dba, a broker.

[leecea]

I'm deliberately trying to build a list

What boats have you found for your list so far?

[SY Kelpie]

Originally Posted by S/V Illusion

Cutter rig…. You need a personal shopper, dba, a broker.

Well it's a bit early days for that!
I'm hoping to draw up a list of boats that would fit my needs, and then proceed from there to setting a budget and a timescale, based on how long I will need to save up...

[SY Kelpie]

Originally Posted by leecea

What boats have you found for your list so far?

Starlight 39 looks interesting, I'm not completely sold on the galley.

Warrior 40 might be good, cockpit is a bit small and it has a saildrive.

A more modern Moody could work. They tend to waste space in the aft cabin with a pointless settee.

[hpeer]

You might pass an eye over some of these Alan Pape designs. These were commercially produced. He also did some semi custom designs that were similar.

https://sailboatdata.com/designer/pape-alan/

You should also mention your budget, and if you are restricted to fiberglass. You may find some more interesting boats in steel or aluminum.

I would also research Bayfield and their folow on company Gozzard. IMHO Gozzard makes a very nice boat.

https://sailboatdata.com/builder/bay...-yard-ltd-can/

https://sailboatdata.com/builder/goz...le-marine-ltd/

[SY Kelpie]

Originally Posted by hpeer

You might pass an eye over some of these Alan Pape designs. These were commercially produced. He also did some semi custom designs that were similar.

https://sailboatdata.com/designer/pape-alan/

You should also mention your budget, and if you are restricted to fiberglass. You may find some more interesting boats in steel or aluminum.

GRP only. I can see the appeal of aluminium but I doubt my budget is going to stretch to anything new enough to be a serious contender.

Budget is flexible but likely under £100k. I'm going to assume that I'll looking at boats from the 70s to 90s but that's not a requirement, it's just a result of my criteria.

[SY Kelpie]

Oh btw when I say 'cutter' I'm really meaning more like a solent stay, possibly removable, rather than a bowsprit.

[hpeer]

Originally Posted by SY Kelpie

Oh btw when I say 'cutter' I'm really meaning more like a solent stay, possibly removable, rather than a bowsprit.

Ah ha, thank you. I came back to ask just this question. There is a world of confusion over the meaning of “cutter.” I am of the older definition that implies a bowsprit mounted foresail so that is how I responded.

Now some folks call a “double headsail sloop” a cutter.

What I (me personally) am now hearing is you want a solent stay.

The double head sail sloop MAY be advertised as a cutter. I think most solent rigs would be advertised as a sloop. But, I could he wrong. And I suspect you may see regional sifferences between the USA and UK for example .

But if you want a solent rig examples then search using that term.



All of the above have

[SY Kelpie]

The solent stay thing is definitely a 'nice to have' and is something that could be retro-fitted.

[s/v Jedi]

I recommend a cutter for sure. Not a hundred year old one with bowsprit, just one from the 80’s.

A solent stay or a cutter rigged sloop are both sloops, not cutters. A cutter has the mast a bit further aft and two headsails and a mainsail as working sails.

A cutter has much more sail combinations than a sloop and adding a stay to a sloop doesn’t give it the balance a cutter has.

I don’t even know if they mass produce cutters anymore… must be way too expensive with the variations and the interior is affected by the different mast positions.

[SY Kelpie]

The solent stay thing is definitely a 'nice to have' and is something that could be retro-fitted.

[hpeer]

Originally Posted by s/v Jedi

I recommend a cutter for sure. Not a hundred year old one with bowsprit, just one from the 80’s.

A solent stay or a cutter rigged sloop are both sloops, not cutters. A cutter has the mast a bit further aft and two headsails and a mainsail as working sails.

A cutter has much more sail combinations than a sloop and adding a stay to a sloop doesn’t give it the balance a cutter has.

I don’t even know if they mass produce cutters anymore… must be way too expensive with the variations and the interior is affected by the different mast positions.

Well he is limited to £100,000 so I don’t think he has to worry about modern production much.

I went on BOAT.com (I think) and there were quite a few.

And he is in the UK. I think that helps?

Maybe try Apolloduck.

[SY Kelpie]

I'm based in the UK, and that would be the easiest place for me to buy, but I'm currently long term cruising and actually in the Caribbean. So willing to look pretty much anywhere.

And I'm not just going to search for solent rigged boats because that's not an essential feature, and can be added later anyway.

The first half of my list are the really important criteria.

[Pontoonrob]

I have been looking for similar and if the 10 or so I have looked at in that budget all are full on refits.

I am curious, how does one hang a dinghy from davits and still have room for a windvane?