Used Life Rafts?

[boatman61]

Originally Posted by SomeGuyInaShirt

British Columbia, West Coast of USA and Baja Mexico initially. It would probably be wise for me to hang out in Mexico for a few years though and spend the off season back in Canada working because when I head into the South Pacific, it doesn't look like that'll be an option until quite a ways to the west and i don't want to rush through the Marquesas.

Kind of considering an EPIRB and drysuit as I'll be a maximum of 200nm offshore until I head into the South Pacific and I can't afford a drysuit and life raft.

But you will I presume have a dinghy.. get the dry suit and stow the dinghy on the foredeck with an emergency pack strapped inside it for voyaging.
Simple enough to rig a shelter from the sun and as long as everything including you is tethered all should be fine on the off-chance you get flipped.
A collapsing rope ladder at the transom and a manual watermaker are a plus.

[SomeGuyInaShirt]

Originally Posted by boatman61

But you will I presume have a dinghy.. get the dry suit and stow the dinghy on the foredeck with an emergency pack strapped inside it for voyaging.
Simple enough to rig a shelter from the sun and as long as everything including you is tethered all should be fine on the off-chance you get flipped.
A collapsing rope ladder at the transom and a manual watermaker are a plus.

Yeah I think this is the wisest choice for now. It would be a hellish wait for rescue but better than nothing and the drysuit is a pleasure when the weather us crap. Every day is summer in a drysuit XD

[wholybee]

Personally, I think using a dinghy as a liferaft in anything other than near coastal calm weather (where you are unlikely to ever need one anyway) is a terrible idea. It is unlikely that you will be sinking in calm weather, and dinghy can flip in 2-3 ft waves, where you will be experiencing 10-15 ft waves or larger (not even in a storm, that can be on a good day in the tradewinds)

That said, (and this may be an unpopular opinion), if you are on an extremely tight budget and dead set that you are going to leave regardless of how prepared you are (or aren't) then don't buy a liferaft at all. Spend that money replacing your through-hulls, below the waterline hoses, standing rigging sails and rebuild your steering. You are far better off in a boat that is unlikley to need a liferaft and without one, then you are in a boat that is not seaworthy, but you have a raft.

Because if the cost of a liferaft is prohibitive, I can't imagine much else on the boat is brand new or seaworthy.

[JPA Cate]

On my first offshore passage, I wanted us to have a liferaft, and so we did.

However, after our Rountrip SF-HI-SF, we then attended a meeting at Island Cruising Yacht Clug, where a man who owned a liferaft business made a presentation. It turned us off liferafts entirely. Ultimately rather drown at sea than be up for $8,000 every x years.

Facing death is something we all have to do sometime.. We just decided that if we were "relatively young" when that happened, we'd have to cope with it......and it's maybe better than rotting away in a nursing home. Ymmv.

Ann

[ChrisJHC]

Originally Posted by JPA Cate

On my first offshore passage, I wanted us to have a liferaft, and so we did.

However, after our Rountrip SF-HI-SF, we then attended a meeting at Island Cruising Yacht Clug, where a man who owned a liferaft business made a presentation. It turned us off liferafts entirely. Ultimately rather drown at sea than be up for $8,000 every x years.

Facing death is something we all have to do sometime.. We just decided that if we were "relatively young" when that happened, we'd have to cope with it......and it's maybe better than rotting away in a nursing home. Ymmv.

Ann

Hi, Ann,

What was it that put you off life rafts?

[Pete7]

Originally Posted by wholybee

Personally, I think using a dinghy as a liferaft in anything other than near coastal calm weather is a terrible idea.

I agree which is why we have a 4 man life raft, oh and the risk of fire.

SG, if you medium term plans are NWP and Mx, then buy a raft to suit your needs. If you do eventually decide to go across the Pacific, you will need to evaluate everything before hand anyway. After all plans change you decide to stay States side.

Crewsaver I would suggest as VW quality rather than Mercedes. Perhaps the most important item is to ensure it has an insulated floor whilst you are in the PNW. UK prices:

https://www.marinescene.co.uk/en/cat...gory-liferafts

We have the Seago 4 man valise equivalent, stored below when on passage.

Pete

[GarryD]

Make sure you get a guarantee that if it doesn't work you can take it back for a refund. Like the one they give for parachutes.

[lo2jones]

For a safety at sea seminar, I inflated a 30 year old life raft, last certified in 18 years earlier, it inflated quickly, healed the weight of two volunteers who stayed in the raft for 20 min. It was fun to see the old emergency supplies inside.

[CLASSEA]

For open water passages Life rafts should NOT be an option, you should have one that is current with it’s inspection . . . There are companies that will rent you one if you are needing one for say a month or so and will be back, just an option . . . Some brands have “styled-obsolescence” meaning that they may change firing mechanisms, or some other important component of the raft . . . So while you May get a “deal” on your about to expire (or expired) Life Raft . . . When you go to get it
Certified, it may be all she wrote . . . Heard (and saw pictures from their Life Raft) about a Sport Fisherman burn to the waterline in 3 minutes, 20 miles offshore from Bimini . . . They were glad they had their deployed . . . Just saying -

[Cpt Mark]

I was given an out of service date Avon liferaft. The hardcase was cracked and water pouring out of it. My liferaft guy said it was probably fine as that particular model was packed in a vacuum bag. This was a coastal model but built to offshore standards. Had all the best self righting features etc. Difference between coastal and offshore was how much food/water is in it. I have a separate ditch bag with a ton of stuff in it if I have to ditch so I went ahead and got it recertified. It's out of date now and I'm not concerned. Mostly stored out of the weather as I haven't figured out where to mount it yet.

There are a lot of seemingly minor differences between different rafts and they can make a huge difference in fulfilling what you want and what you need. Talk to the raft guys and get educated. It's a lot of money for something you hope to never use but if you do.... you want something that suits your needs.

[JPA Cate]

Originally Posted by ChrisJHC

Hi, Ann,

What was it that put you off life rafts?

First off, their failures to inflate properly, shown at the demonstration I mentioned above; their vulnerability to tube deterioration; also, though, it was the ongoing costs relative to re-packing; the incorrect re-packing in many places, so that you don't receive what you're paying for anyhow--that really griped me.

But there's also the temptation to buy bigger, for the room, but then the ballast ratio isn't right. It is a dilemma, you can easily imagine the 4 man raft rolling over and over blown by the wind, whereas, the two man one is very, very cramped, plus imagine having to deal with toilet necessities in one, while imitating a tilt-a-whirl.

I do think, if one had a fire, one might save one's life. The problem is that they are reported to be hard to be able to get into. In a highly populous area they might save your life. In the middle of the ocean, it is only a tiny dot to find, once the EPIRB battery fails or the PLB fails, basically a long shot. If you go far off the shipping traffic lanes, no one will be able to reach you in time.

For me, the worst downside was how many re-packed ones failed to inflate. With mis-packing, sometimes the food, etc, has been packed on the outside of the raft, so that it gets lost when it inflates. That made a big impression on me, that one might be counting on it to save your lives, and the hope utterly misplaced.

I want to add that if you stow it below decks, it will most likely inflate correctly, and the tubes will be okay. Like Pete 7 above, the raft in a valise (below decks) increases its chances of that. Still good is in a valise above decks, but with a heat reflective, waterproof cover that is easy to remove. A problem to solve is where outside can it best be protected from heat in the tropical regions? Heat and moisture are the enemies of the tubes. If you're going to have a life raft, one with ballast is a good idea.

Of course, your mileage may vary from ours.

Ann

[AiniA]

Better than used - if you want a cheap raft, check out the many Chinese manufacturers on Alibaba.

Here is one of them https://www.alibaba.com/product-deta...2d43233dJeB2BE

A four person raft in a canister is about US$500 with shipping to North America about US$160. If you look at the pictures you can see that they make the Lalizas brand rafts that are common in Europe and elsewhere. Another company had photos showing the RFD brand.

I have bought some stainless cowl vents through AB and the quality was superb and the customer service was excellent. They respond quickly and fully to questions you send. Ask about repack interval and what is in the raft in the way of supplies. Some say they are SOLAS but I wonder.

A word about how much of Chinese manufacturing works. Someone will start a company making X. Before long, someone working at the company will start they own company making the same products. Soon you end up with a bunch of competitors in one district. We visited a town where there were something like 20 companies making hardwood flooring that was sold all over the world with various local and foreign brands. I imagine these Chinese rafts are similar in general but there may be some quality differences, that is why I would look for a company that makes rafts for a Western company.

I am considering one of these Chinese rafts since I am only going from the Chesapeake to the Eastern Caribbean and have no plans to do the Canal and head west again.

[Cynara]

Can you work another 6 months and buy a new one

[Cynara]

Check prices in other countries. We live in the US and bought our raft from the UK. Even with shipping saved a ton.

[CarinaPDX]

In much of the world you can get a raft re-packed pretty much independent of its brand, or at least I never had an issue. But in the U.S. and Canada liferaft servicing companies will only service rafts from manufacturers that they have been trained and approved by - no doubt a legal liability issue. Apparently they must have a current contract with the manufacturer. My liferaft is good quality and the packers have always told me that it was well made and should last a long time. But I can't get it re-packed in the U.S. or Canada because the manufacturer was bought out by a larger outfit (concentration of market power via roll-ups affects liferafts as well) and there just aren't enough of them left in the U.S. to justify renewing the contracts (it is a U.K. raft). I understand that there might be one place in California that can still do it but that would be hideously expensive with the shipping of pressurized gas and flares. (BTW the pressure tank is not DOT so another headache.) So think twice about buying an off brand, and just forget about Chinese liferafts unless they can be serviced here.

For the PNW you need a raft with a double floor, and you need survival suits for everyone. With neither you will be dead within an hour of entering the water (likely much sooner). With a liferaft you will survive days if you are lucky. But with a suit and raft a week or more is possible. If the CG knows that you have both they will continue the search for a week or so, but will likely give up in a few days if not. So buy an EPIRB, add the liferaft and suit info to the registration, and let your contact know to tell the CG that you have them in an emergency. (There are lots of old but unused survival suits to be found in the PNW.)

Consider buying a good waterproof handheld VHF with GPS and DSC. This will be very helpful in an emergency.

While my liferaft was good quality, as it came from the factory it had a bad pack. When I repacked a year later in the UK I discovered that the paddle was broken, the overhead light had been activated when packed (killing the battery), and the seal had leaked and the seawater had corroded the pressure tank, requiring stripping, priming, and painting. An acquaintance bought a Zodiac liferaft and reckoned that he didn't need to do the mandatory (for warranty) repacks for the first 5 years. When he took it in the packers couldn't inflate it because the seams had failed, and of course the warranty had been invalidated. Ann is right: you simply cannot count on your raft always inflating with everything working.

Repacking used to be an annual affair, and for 12 years I did so in order to maintain the warranty. These days it can be 3 years if vacuum-bagged. The cost will start with the basic repack and inspection, then add the other necessary servicing. Dated flashlight and lighting batteries need replacing, the first aid kit gets replaced when the drugs expire (often 3 years), the flares are good for 3 years, the pressure tank must be hydro tested every five years, food and water packets need replacing, and of course any repairs need to be done. That is why it is so expensive to maintain. Take a close look at the service intervals and warranty requirements before buying, because they will dwarf the purchase costs over the lifetime.

If it is just you aboard then do as you will, but as long as you take others you will be responsible for their safety. There is no getting around it: buy safety equipment.

Greg