What Do You Think Is the Current State of the Sailboat Market ?

[tropicalescape]

Originally Posted by zeta

As a buyer to be, looks excellent to me. As a seller, not so rosie. It is wishful thinking on an owners part to think it will get better. There is nothing in the US economy that would point to upper middle class job increases. We are not manufacturing, consumers are not buying save for electronics (read china), people are getting laid off right and left, and disposable income is at an all time low. The upper middle class is quickly evaporating and there is nothing that indicates we will become a major manufacturing country again, as share holders demand greater profits afforded to those companies exploiting cheap labor overseas. If anyone can point to me where good paying jobs will appear in America, please do so....all I see is service jobs, and most working in that industry do everything they can to stay afloat--so to speak.

There are 12000 jobs this year alone in the Bakken Play(ND) .. starting pay is 100000+ per year..To damn cold for me..

[zeta]

Originally Posted by tropicalescape

There are 12000 jobs this year alone in the Bakken Play(ND) .. starting pay is 100000+ per year..To damn cold for me..

Let's see, 14,000,000 unemployed, 10,000,000 under-employed, 12,000 temporary high paying oil industry jobs, not quite getting us there, +ND is dam cold

[Privleoplag]

"damn cold"... obviously you folks don't live here. It's worse than that!

[tropicalescape]

Originally Posted by zeta

Let's see, 14,000,000 unemployed, 10,000,000 under-employed, 12,000 temporary high paying oil industry jobs, not quite getting us there, +ND is dam cold

My understanding is that there will be even more thats just one company!lots in the pacific rim area also ..DVC

[capnorv]

The way I see it, the only way a "traditional" middle class American should buy a boat is cash and, and then make sure you can afford a place to park it or have other options. We are all frogs in the cookpot. If it's a sailboat, make sure you can get by without your auxillary.

Unfortunately we're on a downward spiral...and people need to quit thinking of luxuries such as cars, boats, motorcycles, airplanes, etc. as investments, and see them as they are as vises and addictions.

That said, I'd much rather spend my last dollar on my boat than a whiskey bottle, whore, or crack pipe...just my personal preferance.

People I've known have wasted their whole lives triing to time markets and never lived. If you want to be a boat owner make it happen, nobody is going to lead you by the hand and if you're a boat seller, you should have never drank the koolaid that it was an "investment".

[Randyonr3]

Originally Posted by Captain Hunter

I'm looking for a go anywhere sailboat 37-47 feet. If you have any bargains in your marina, I'm willing to pay a finders fee for a nice Caliber, Benneteau, Spindrift. No junk, just really nice cruisers. I've looked for months on the internet from illinois. Brokers block almost everything worth my money. Thanks

Thats one of the issues in the selling and buying market.. the seller wants the most he can get and the buyer wants a deal.. or as you put it a "Bargain"
Put ours up for sale a few months ago, testing the waters and thinking of going power.. Purchased it 10 years ago for just over 100k and figured we'd walk away if someone offered us 60 to 70 k..
Had a few SOBs come look and a couple made offers at around 30k saying the market was down.. couldnt run them off the dock fast enough..
decided not to sell but bought the power boat (42 foot Silverton) anyway..
the market is only down if you want it to be.. I have more work than I ever have had, and cant find any help.. booking jobs better than 2 months out..
you cant make me believe we are in a down market.....No matter what the news says

[zeehag]

captain hunter, there are 153 boats in mazatlan yachts for sale--most are cruisers left by folks who havent the ability or desire to return for them.
they have everything from a 30 ft islander for really cheap from canada to fuji 45 at 245000usd. call ray and take your pick. they all came here from north somewhere, mostly usa, but some canadian .... ray has boats in la paz, san carlos/guaymas, and 3 other locales here.

[rhr1956]

I'm not sure how the boat market and car market my be similar but here is the scenario we've experienced selling cars.

2008 4th qrt market took a dive (new and used) that lasted until early 2010.
2010 started to get better for new cars and used cars. Gradually getting better and better.
2011 1st qrt momentum was building for new especially for new cars. Could we be getting back to normal? (Prices still high for used cars due to reduced trade-ins for the previous 2 years). march 11th Japan earthquake hit disrupted production for many brands by nearly 50% for the next 120 days. Used car prices went sky high. We are just now getting new car pipelines flowing and used car prices are starting to fall.

[zeehag]

false rises are common in a down turning market.
occasionally folks need to replace the beeters they were driving to death, so cars will sell. boats, on the other hand, are a luxury item and will not come back for looong time. many of the sales of boats now, if you notice, are the oversized models for the financially well off. some smaller boats are selling because they are useful on a whimsy basis.
the gulfstar 47 is not gonna sell at 140-k usd anymore......false upturns need to be watched carefully and the generalizatrions need to become specific.

[Kettlewell]

false upturns need to be watched carefully and the generalizatrions need to become specific.

So true! If you are scouring the market for a boat that is in really short supply anyway you won't find the bargains. However, if you have an open mind and are willing to look at lots of different boats in lots of different places, there are plenty of bargains to be found.

That's the way my uncle buys his cars. He goes into a big dealer's lot near the end of the month and says he'll pay cash for whatever is the best deal on the lot, doesn't matter what it is. Sometimes he gets a truck, sometimes a car, sometimes it is a weird color, sometimes it has strange equipment, but there is always something on the lot the dealer wants to get rid of or has himself purchased for a special deal.

Not saying you want to do that with a boat, but the principal remains the same. Much better deals if you are willing to have an open mind.

[rhr1956]

If we had more people like your uncle, we could put the auction houses out of business!

[zeta]

Originally Posted by Randyonr3

you cant make me believe we are in a down market.....No matter what the news says

That's because you are a seller and what you think your boat is worth has no relevance in what someone is willing to pay for it. Sellers will always be optimistic because it serves them, but optimism does not make for reality. IMHO Zeehag has it right stating there are thousands of good boats on the market at very attractive prices. Many of which are capable of taking you anywhere and for less than the cost of a new subcompact Hyundai car. Good luck with your boat, hope you get everything you feel she is worth.

[VirtualVagabond]

Originally Posted by Randyonr3

Thats one of the issues in the selling and buying market.. the seller wants the most he can get and the buyer wants a deal.. or as you put it a "Bargain" Thus has it ever been, since the dawn of commerce. Not unique to current times.

Put ours up for sale a few months ago, testing the waters (ie. not a genuine seller) and thinking of going power.. Purchased it 10 years ago for just over 100k and figured we'd walk away if someone offered us 60 to 70 k.. Did you do your homework? ie was that a realistic price at the moment? Are other comparable boats getting that kind of money?

Had a few SOBs come look and a couple made offers at around 30k saying the market was down.. couldnt run them off the dock fast enough.. Why? No negotiation skills?
If you're a genuine seller, It's your role to show buyers that your boat is worth the asking price. It's their role to show you why it's not.
It's called the art of negotiation!
They could be saying, "That SOB is dreamin' if he thinks his boat is worth twice what going rate is."

decided not to sell but bought the power boat (42 foot Silverton) anyway..
the market is only down if you want it to be..
No, it's only down if you are genuinely in the market. You never were.
If you'd sold your boat at the price you wanted you could say this.
You couldn't, so the boat market obviously IS down.

I have more work than I ever have had, and cant find any help.. booking jobs better than 2 months out.. Different market. Liquidators are finding the same thing!

you cant make me believe we are in a down market.....No matter what the news says ... and no matter that you couldn't sell your boat... and no amount of hard evidence will make any difference, apparently.

In a month or 2 we will be genuine cash buyers and will be having to waste time with 'sellers' who are just testing the market, and brokers desperate to make a bit of commission showing us all kinds of stuff that will still be 'on the market' 2 years from now.

Those boats are not really on the market. The owners are boat danglers... the seller equivalent of tyre kickers.
They're just clutter to be waded through as part of the process. There is no way around it, it's part of the process and we'll 'enjoy' it for what it is.

Now THAT is reality

[socasailor]

Originally Posted by zeehag

false rises are common in a down turning market.
occasionally folks need to replace the beeters they were driving to death, so cars will sell. boats, on the other hand, are a luxury item and will not come back for looong time. many of the sales of boats now, if you notice, are the oversized models for the financially well off. some smaller boats are selling because they are useful on a whimsy basis.
the gulfstar 47 is not gonna sell at 140-k usd anymore......false upturns need to be watched carefully and the generalizatrions need to become specific.

Zeehag, I tried to send a PM. Please send me contact info, or email of Ray. I'm looking for another blue water boat. Thanks.

----on the topic---I sold my boat for 1/2 of what it was worth 4 yr ago. I'm pretty bummed about that. But, boats are a financial liability to most people that don't cruise or liveaboard.

[zeehag]

the website for mazatlan yachts..

Mazatlan Marine Center SA De CV