Why do you guys like monohulls so much?

[valhalla360]

Originally Posted by boatman61

That's why I like bilge keels..
Run aground.???
Break out the tea service Betty, let's look like we meant it, pass the scones and jam up..

Didn't they do that in Mary Poppins with an underwater tea? ...oops, that was up in the air by the ceiling. About the same level of silliness.

Yes, catamarans can capsize and monohulls can go to the bottom...neither is a serious consideration.

[Chotu]

Originally Posted by smj

We can achieve 10 kts in about 11-12 kts of wind, but then we are cruise loaded which slows us down a little!
As others have pointed out, so many different varieties of both catamaran and monohull. Some sail well while others are pigs but can carry a huge load, and this holds true for both cats and monos.

Exactly. I think sometimes when people start talking about catamarans on here, they forget that there is a huge spectrum just like there are of monohulls.

Often times people will refer to a catamaran not being able to do double digits. That’s because they are essentially sailing the 45’ Formosa ketch of catamarans.

They have a spectrum. All the way from Formosa ketch to, I don’t know, a J 50? A moth?

I find that a good evaluation of a catamaran’s potential for speed it’s to look below the waterline. The less of the boat you see down there, the faster the boat is. Assuming similar sail area.

I saw some catamarans at the boat show in Miami last year that were 1/3 to half below the waterline. Definite pigs.

[chrisr]

Originally Posted by Pelagic

Wow! Amazing speeds!
.....but I don't get how things get smoother and quieter at speed.
Please explain thanks?

sorry...thought i made it clear this was on a yacht ie mono...not a cat

36' highly modified mumm 36 offshore, at night under masthead kite, 25-35k TWS...slight seas with abt 2m swell. i think it was a southport race

and yes, we were definitely planning, so water noise less and boat skimming waves rather than bumping. at that BS the AWS was way down, so wind noise decreases

that boat always steered beautifully (one of farr's very best designs imho) and at that speed it was finger tip steering control. micro helm movements needed.

at that moment i would not have been anywhere else...but time moves on and these days living aboard & permanently cruising we would not be on anything other than a catamaran

cheers,

[more]

Originally Posted by sgl

90% of your time is at anchor, and you can't beat that large shaded cockpit / saloon area to have a few sundowners with friends.

This is not thru 99,3 to 99,99 % boat is in marina or anchor. Wery rare some 10% time sail. Who annually 36 days and night sailing.

[jmh2002]

Originally Posted by Pelagic

If running, you will be in your element and leave me behind as I would only average 8 knots in those short steep seas due to my heavy displacement of 42 tons. I am guessing your displacement at about 15 ton.

I think the early TPI Lagoon 42 is much lighter than 15 ton, probably more like 10 or less, give or take for cruising load.

They are a vastly different boat to the Lagoons now. And as this photo shows far more of a performance hull than one thinks of when they hear 'Lagoon'.

It would however probably be too 'small' for your purposes, both in usable accomodation as well as cruising payload.

Here's a good thread on that boat: https://www.cruisersforum.com/forums...2-a-59922.html



Here's another example of those earlier (better) Lagoons, a 67s from 2001 (this particular model being an even higher performance 'S' variant). One quick look and it's easy to tell that this is a more performance orientated boat from an earlier generation.

It's for sale relatively cheaply now after sitting for a while I think after it's previous big refit and cruising adventures.



https://youtu.be/F1duV3nmLJ8

https://youtu.be/YZeoLzA_6Jw

https://drive.google.com/file/d/14kU...rQtb2wFzO/view

https://www.worldwideyachtbroker.com...s-for-sale/931

As was mentioned, just like monohulls there are many different catamarans with many different characteristics making them more or less suitable for one's intended use.

[Tetepare]

I like the Lagoon 62, that would make a great party pad. Bit pricey for me.

[malbert73]

I’ve surfed double digits several times in my monohull (max 14 kts) off the wind. So no surprise a cat could do same with enough wind and waves. But, the only cat I would own is a performance one and those still tend to be pricey to get same performance, blue water capacity, cruise comfort, and quality as my mono. Would really enjoy that someday.

[chris mac]

Originally Posted by jmh2002

I think the early TPI Lagoon 42 is much lighter than 15 ton, probably more like 10 or less, give or take for cruising load.

They are a vastly different boat to the Lagoons now. And as this photo shows far more of a performance hull than one thinks of when they hear 'Lagoon'.

It would however probably be too 'small' for your purposes, both in usable accomodation as well as cruising payload.

Here's a good thread on that boat: https://www.cruisersforum.com/forums...2-a-59922.html



Here's another example of those earlier (better) Lagoons, a 67s from 2001 (this particular model being an even higher performance 'S' variant). One quick look and it's easy to tell that this is a more performance orientated boat from an earlier generation.

It's for sale relatively cheaply now after sitting for a while I think after it's previous big refit and cruising adventures.



https://youtu.be/F1duV3nmLJ8

https://youtu.be/YZeoLzA_6Jw

https://drive.google.com/file/d/14kU...rQtb2wFzO/view

https://www.worldwideyachtbroker.com...s-for-sale/931

As was mentioned, just like monohulls there are many different catamarans with many different characteristics making them more or less suitable for one's intended use.

Close, and good info. Our 42 TPI is around 16000 lbs factory. So pretty close to 10 ton set up for cruising
.
I saw an interesting chart showing SAD of many cats. The TPI was up around otremer and catanas. So it's not necessarily fast in low winds, but its potential goes up quickly as wind increases.
Not bad for a keeled cat!

[valhalla360]

Originally Posted by more

This is not thru 99,3 to 99,99 % boat is in marina or anchor. Wery rare some 10% time sail. Who annually 36 days and night sailing.

Very true and why condomarans sell like hotcakes vs full keel boats largely not even being produced (outside rare custom/semi-custom jobs).

If you really feel the need for a visceral sailing experience, get the condomaran and carry a small performance sailing dingy.

[akopac]

I enjoy sailing with my wind vane steering system. Can you use a vane on a cat?

[more]

Originally Posted by akopac

I enjoy sailing with my wind vane steering system. Can you use a vane on a cat?

and where you sailing and how many annual hour you sail.
i know my because i am professional charter skipper and annually 22-24 weeks on boat and max sail 400-600 hour.
because year have around 8765 hour this is 95,5% yacht in marina under sail/motor 4,5%

[jmh2002]

Originally Posted by akopac

I enjoy sailing with my wind vane steering system. Can you use a vane on a cat?

On some cats, yes sure



Wharram even have their own simple wind vane design for home building - and the norm is actually to have 2 vanes, one on each hull/rudder, thereby getting even better airflow and providing an inbuilt backup.

It works very well on their designs and is simple, cheap, and easily repaired if necessary, even in remote locations with simple tools and spares.

[chrisr]

Originally Posted by akopac

I enjoy sailing with my wind vane steering system. Can you use a vane on a cat?

usually, no...but what is so special about a wind vane steering system ?

autopilots of various brands have been easy, reliable and cheap for decades now. use very little power - and power drain rarely a problem on cats due to normal large solar panel systems anyway

most can steer to wind angle (ours does) if that's your thing...but will also steer to waypoint. will a vane do that ?

and please don't say the vane is more reliable...imho & experience they are not

cheers,

[boatman61]

Originally Posted by chrisr

usually, no...but what is so special about a wind vane steering system ?

autopilots of various brands have been easy, reliable and cheap for decades now. use very little power - and power drain rarely a problem on cats due to normal large solar panel systems anyway

most can steer to wind angle (ours does) if that's your thing...but will also steer to waypoint. will a vane do that ?

and please don't say the vane is more reliable...imho & experience they are not

cheers,

They do work for Wharrams which don't have an apartment on top..

[wingssail]

Originally Posted by chrisr

usually, no...but what is so special about a wind vane steering system ?

autopilots of various brands have been easy, reliable and cheap for decades now. use very little power - and power drain rarely a problem on cats due to normal large solar panel systems anyway

most can steer to wind angle (ours does) if that's your thing...but will also steer to waypoint. will a vane do that ?

and please don't say the vane is more reliable...imho & experience they are not

cheers,

Windvane vs Auto pilot.

We have a light, fast, and simple boat.

We've chosen a windvane for several reasons. Complexity, Reliability, Power usage, Cost and Weight

Complexity.
Autopilots have several components, electronic and electrical, and often hydraulic, with pumps and cylinders. This is more stuff to keep operational. Windvanes are simple, no wiring or electronic components to fail. We like to keep out boat simple, less to repair, less to worry about.

Reliability.
As we've cruised the world's oceans almost everyone we meet with an autopilot has had a failure. If they don't carry a spare they wind up hand steering, sometimes for days. So carrying a spare autopilot is fairly common. We do have an autopilot, a simple tiller pilot, and we carry a spare, and we have needed it. The need for reliability in self steering is essential for us.

Power usage.
Even though the power is "very little" it adds up. 3 amps for 24 hours is 75 amp hours, or 900 watts. That 75 amp hours adds 50% to our present daily usage. To replace that with solar we'd need an additional 150 watts of panel. Where to put it? And the panel is heavy as well.

Weight.
Two complete heavy duty autopilot systems will often weigh more than the windvane. Weight costs us speed. We like a fast boat.

Cost
A good autopilot which can steer in heavy winds and big waves isn't cheap, and the need to have a spare makes it more expensive.

The windvane just sits back there silently working away mile after mile, year after year. So, for us, dedicated monohull folks, a windvane is the right answer.