Winter storage prep for northern Great Lakes area

[MurrayC]

Lots opinion s on this - mine come from 30 year's experience onLake Ontario. You are not allowed to discharge any antifreeze ito the water. It's not the diredct toxicity necessarily but the abi8lity of the degredation process to alter the water. A cover is good but must have enough slope to shed rain and snow. I uyse a simple backbone of 2X4 ssupported with triangular parking lot barrier tpe frames in the cockpit anda, averlapping joints and saw horse bracket legs for two more section going to the bow pulpit. All tied down. A stout tarp silver on the outside with strap tiedowns make the cover - must be several feet longer th an the boat. Essential to keep it very tight - I use j jugs of sand not water and also tie it to the cradle in a few s pots. Ends are laced up. Mold occurs inside in summer around hatch frames from breath condensation and in lockers a bilge where moist su mmer air meets the cold hul. Clean out mold before storage. Dry the bilge out with a dedicated mp. Getting all the water out of the boat is the key to mold control. I have two dorades, a hatch vent and two 3 inch holes i n t he companionway doors - no mold. I leave all cushions onboard but turned up on sides. Dorades are screened. Batteries are charged well, and left onboard. Every month or so I hook up and charge for a few hours but this has proven unnecessary over 3 months away.. I like the mast off. Once I was on a stored boat in quite a wind. The energy of vibration and thrust from the mast was huge - can't be good for a boat. Check your boat after a snowstorm to make sure it is shedding the snow. I like toemnoty and cklean the engine water strainer before winterizing - collecting exhaust waterin fall and again in spring whemn flushing. Whenstoring the mast make sure to cover anyholes even very small that animals could get into - don't want a nest ful of baby bird falling out in the sopring!

[kmgiunta]

Originally Posted by Mike OReilly

So, you don't say where your boat is located. There's quite a range of conditions stretching along the so-called "northern" great lakes. I say that as a Canadian. None of the American side of the Great Lakes would be northern Great Lakes.

Regardless, the approach is the same anywhere where there is persistent freezing and possible heavy snow loads.

First, if there is going to be heavy snow loads I would definitely cover the boat. You can build a decent winter cover with PVC conduit and hardware tarps. I've always covered my entire boats.

Of course if you're in one of those northern areas that doesn't get a lot of snow, then you may not need the cover. But I always do.

Critically, you must winterize all the water-based systems. This usually means plumbing and engine. If it's an inboard engine, run antifreeze through the water intake side until you're spitting antifreeze. I use engine antifreeze for this.

On the plumbing side, I dump antifreeze a gallon of plumber antifreeze into the tank, then pump it out through all the faucets. Make sure you see it running pink through all the pumps and taps.

For the head, dump some in, first make you're you're pumped clean. Then dump some in and pump it back to the holding tank.

The principle with all this is to have antifreeze run through all the pumps and taps and small places so you've can be sure there is no water.

As for the bilge, unless you can guarantee it will remain water-free (and this is rare), then yes, dump a bunch of antifreeze in. This will ensure that the water that gets in won't freeze/thaw.

Oh, and make sure you are positioned properly on the stands. You want any water that gets to the deck to drain off, and not sit there. This will avoid the freeze/thaw cycle.

I wintered my sailboat on the hard in Maine. Yep, what Mike said plus make sure the supports under the tarp are spaced close enough to support a moderate snow load and sloped enough to shed the snow as much as possible. The yard that my boat was in actually had power near the boat and I had a few a hundred watt bulbs on during the coldest parts. Doesn't sound like much but it does heat the air up enough to warm the tarp a bit. Helps the snow slide off the tarp.

[Rightbrainer]

All good advice here, use pink antifreeze, not glycol. The better frame you build, the longer your tarp will last. They die from flogging in the wind. Weight the perimeter with milk jugs mostly filled with water to keep it taught. You can capture a pebble in a slip-loop of twine to attach a guy line to the tarp where you need it. I made a couple of A-frames to hold up a ridge pole (I used my flag pole) and secured them with guy ropes to various cleats and other deck hardware. I removed the lifelines and punched holes for my stanchions to increase the pitch of the tent to help it shed snow. I then duct taped around the stanchions. Put some scrap carpet pads on sharp corners and edges to ease the chafing.

Some swear by Bounty dryer sheets to keep the critters out...moth balls are popular, too. I put a couple of small buckets of charcoal briquettes down below. Who knows if it helps keep it fresh but why not? If you have the room to safely store fabrics, electronics, etc. off the boat, it's a good idea. Conditions are pretty rough on a boat over the winter. I cracked the front hatch and lazaret and opened all compartments to let the air circulate.

My current boat is only a 22 footer, but the principles are the same and scalable. I had a 28 footer in Michigan and we took the mast down. There is a lot of force in the wind and the boat can't roll to shed any of it. Make sure that your poppets are chained together side to side so they can't creep apart and spill your boat.

If you go mast-up, there is so much interference from shrouds and stays that a tent over the cockpit is probably the most you could manage. (And seal the boat up tight.)

FWIW, a friend visited his boat one February and found guy living on board! Bounty sheets won't help with that.

[Dave9111]

I'm on Lake Erie.

The winters around the Great Lakes can be severe at times.
Your ability to get to your boat to check on it can be limited by snow and hazardous weather.
1. Don't use blue tarps. If you are going to use a plastic tarp use the MUCH better silver tarps. There is a huge difference in durability. If you put a trap over the boom and over the safety lines there is a good chance you will break your stanchions. Many custom covers go over the boom and down to the rub rails and not over the stanchions.

2. Tie downs and ropes securing tarps oftentimes come loose. I have had excellent luck with using ropes to secure the tarps and also using plastic 1 gallon bottles (like antifreeze bottles) filled half way with sand as weights to keep the tarps tight regardless of the ropes loosening. Gravity can be a wonderful thing! :-)

3. Consider drilling a hole in your boat at the lowest point in your bilge (or as low as possible). I did this a few years ago and was going to install (epoxy in ) a bronze garboard drain plug and socket, but as I was doing it, realized that all I needed was a bolt with a big head to fill the hole. I now have a hole slightly larger than 3/8" in my bilge that I can reach from the inside. In the spring, after a bottom paint job, I install a stainless steel 3/8" carriage bolt which has the square at the head ground round. I use silicone sealant under the head. I put a tape flag on the bolt shank and push the bolt into the hull (the tape flag retains the bolt in the hull). The bolt has flats ground on the end of the bolt about 1/2" long. I climb into the boat, hold the bolt and put on a large flat washer, a lock washer, and a stainless nut and thread it on. I can hold the bolt via the flats on the threaded end and tighten the nut snugly. Removal is just as easy in the fall. Total cost was about $2.50 for the hardware. No more worries about damage from water leakage into the bilge. If you have large amounts of water get in the bilge, your antifreeze will dilute and the bilge WILL freeze and result in damage and may trash your boat. A simple 3/8" hole solved this issue for me. Make sure that you don't drill through a cored section of your hull, otherwise you will need to do more work to backfill the core with epoxy. My solution only worked since I could reach the plug location from the interior of the boat.
IMO, all boats should be sold with garboard drains installed at the factory. Using only antifreeze in the bilge is like gambling. Sooner or later you will lose. Ask your marina how many boats become trashed from water accumulating in the bilge during storage. Its a very big issue.

The best solution is to pull your mast and put your boat into heated storage, but at my marina that costs 3x what outdoor storage costs. Its very expensive.

[garyfdl]

All excellent advice, but I have a few obtw's:

Plastic shrink-wrap covering can be recycled. Our club has been doing it for years. We collect it in an old shipping container and some guy comes and picks it up. However IT MUST BE DRY! He has rejected loads where people put wet plastic in the container.

Shrink-wrapping does not mean you cannot access your boat. If you think you will need or want to get in, the people doing the job can put in a zippered door. Likewise they can install vents in the shrink-wrap to help control/minimize condensation.

From my observation at our club, shrink wrap can be reused IF it is carefully removed in spring. We have several members who do this and get 2-3 seasons out of it. (About as long as a cheap blue tarp.)

The OP mentioned water leaks around some rear stanchions. I would suggest this needs IMMEDIATE ATTENTION! The freeze/thaw cycle over the winter could result delamination between the deck and core and weaken the mounting. Not a good thing for something that supports a LIFE-line.

I'm in the 'un-step the mast' category. For one thing, it makes a good ridge pole for covering/tarping the boat. It is also my personal belief that having the mast down is better for the boat. In the water the boat can move (heel) in response to wind loads, even tied to the dock. Not so on the 'hard' when it is on stands or in a cradle. So all the strain is taken by the chain plates. As most shroud attachments penetrate the deck, I've always worried about about the sealant fatiguing/failing due to mechanical stress combined with the heat cold cycle. So I always pull the mast.

If you have scuppers/drains that go through the interior, make sure no moisture can collect in the lines - if it can? blow them out and winterize with RV anti-freeze. Most of them are a pita to repair/replace if they burst.

My old Hunter had a small shallow bilge and collected so much water over winter that it and the antifreeze would flood the cabin. I installed a 3/4" bronze drain plug, just aft of the keel. When the boat was hauled I pulled the plug and left it out all winter so the bilge could drain; there was always an icicle by Christmas. Only problem with this 'solution' was I could never remember where I put the plug come spring, and ultimately wound up with 3 or 4 of them.

A good solution to help hold down a tarp is to use 1 gallon milk jugs filled with sand or pea gravel (leave the tops off). Don't use water, it evaporates or leaks out if for some reason the jug gets a hole in it. In any case, as others have said, make sure the tarp is secure and can't flap around and damage your or another's boat.

[MurrayC]

for Newbies, don't just cover the boat with a tarp and no frame. water will accumulate in the cockpit area resulting in a disastrous weight. Try to suck tanks dry wit your water pump or arrange plumbing with a low spot that will drain tanks. Tanks will not be harmed by a little water freezing inside. If you have a bladder tank try to turn it so the lower outlet fitting is up and there or not containing water that can freeze. I don't use any plumbers antifreeze. One year it ate the new parts In the head. Best to pump through a lot of clean water and allow the last pumpout to suck it out. Use the little drain plug on the toilet to get rid of water. If you are determined to use Plumbers antifreeze please be aware there are different formulations. The RV crowd has some reports on them. One of them left a terrible taste and odour in my systems one year - never used it again. Another contributor noted that it does't take much water in pink AF to make it freeze easily or at least turn to sludge. By drying out the bilge you prevent that water from condensing and evaporating over and over again inside your boat. Dry out and enjoy no mold. If you visit in winter open up the boat and let the dry air in.

[StoneCrab]

I used to live aboard on the water in Chicago year round. In the winter I'd stay in the water, mast up, but put hoops of 3/4" pvc pipe over the deck and then shrink wrap the dome. This gave me a 2nd floor where I'd store all the sailing gear. It stayed dryer than being in the warm moist cabin. The dome has high enough for a small Christmas tree on deck.

I agree with all of Mike's advice on how to prep the boat if you aren't living on it. Personally, I like shrink wrapping the boat myself. Counterintuitively, it is easier to do it with the boat in the water since you can putter around the boat in the dingy and use the dock for the high stuff. In the yard on the stands, you need to work off a ladder. Sometimes it seems like you don't have enough hands for the torch, the ladder and the fusing. One year I got a cherry picker into the yard and did the job from a bucket. That felt like cheating it was so easy.

Best idea is to make some friends, split the cost of shipping, the torch, gloves and help each other shrink wrap. After the first boat, you'll be competent. The boat that is done last has to buy the beers. It is only fair.

I recommend wearing cotton Carhart-like construction clothing. Never nylon or other synthetic outerwear. A Harbor Freight weed burner with a piezo igniter and gas control handle can do the job for very little money. A small shop propane torch can be used for touch ups, but full disclosure, I bought the expensive Dr. Shrink torch with different length wands. It just works great. The different lengths are used at different stages... short for tacking and welding and the long one over the field. A perfect blue flame everytime. In thirty years, I've only had to fix it once when the o-rings dried up.

Shrink wrapping is not hard. If the mast is down, I could be done in a couple of hours. Shrink wrapping with the mast up is a whole day affair since you have to cut around the mast and standing rigging.

Once I moved off the boat and was wrapping it for the yard, I made hoops of 3/4" metal conduit with joints at the top running down the middle to replace the PVC pipe I used previously. Crutch tips on the ends that touch the deck help eliminate chafe. Numbering the hoops makes quick work of assembly the next year.

The trick to a good shrink job is your use of the fiberglass rope that they sell for this purpose. Tie bowlines on a good number of straps and then hang them off of all the stanchion bases with the Bowline loops approximately horizontal relative to each other. Then pass the fiberglass rope through all the hoops, running completely around the hull and cinch it up tight. You then need to run straps from the Bowline loops under the hull to the corresponding loop on the other side. These keep the dome from blowing off in a strong wind and can be used to cinch the dome even tighter when you are shrinking the plastic.

I'd then erect the hoops (pvc or metal) and tie them off to the stanchions as well. They are now standing and you can see the shape that the dome will have. This is a good time to make adjustments to the hoop heights if your shape isn't fair. The key here is that you don't want any areas where the shrink plastic isn't going to be drawn tight against the hoops. If you have a short hoop between two taller ones, correct the height at this point. You won't be able to do anything about it later. If you don't correct it, the plastic will draw tight across the two taller hoops, skipping the short one, in between, and when the wind blows, your plastic will flutter like a flag and flog itself to death. It is common for the plastic to fail where it batters itself against the short hoop.

Second trick to this is to take a length of fiberglass rope from the stern rail to the bow rail across the top of the hoops, making a knot on each hoop. This is your "cross-bracing" to keep the hoops from moving around. The knot tying can be tough and if you have helpers, consistent tension between hoops may allude your group, so alternatively, run the rope bow to stern and then come back with short lengths to tie the hoops to the brace line. That way you can bump the hoop back to vertical before tightening the knots. I have put duct tape over the bracing line and around the conduit and knot as a backup. Keep the knots off the top of the hoops to reduce chafing and pull these tie off ropes tight enough to prevent the hoops from working loose. Do this two times more, half way from the deck to the top of the hoop, one more on each side. You now have three brace lines, one at the top of the hoop and one on each side half the way down. Your frame is now complete.

Third trick should probably be first. Shrink wrap is expensive if you don't care about waste. It is very affordable if you measure your boat carefully and pick a size that either covers your boat perfectly or is twice as long. The point being they sell standard sizes. If you get a size that is 20% too long or 30% too wide, that plastic will just be cut off and put in the dumpster. I found a dimension that supplies me with a two year supply. It is twice as long as I need, so I cut the roll in half. It is slightly narrower than I'd prefer, but I just shortened the stanchion Bowline lines to raise the horizontal run of the rope which is where the shrink wrap will end. I find that the shipping bill is usually a large percentage of the cost so getting multiple rolls at the same time or a larger roll usually doesn't change the shipping cost much but saves you quite a bit of money. I put this tip after the dome frame construction because it would be reasonable to erect the dome and then pull a string over the tallest frame to get an accurate measurement before ordering the plastic.

My final trick is to not use tape. I haven't had much luck with the tape that they sell for shrink wrap. It is expensive as well. It looks good the day you put it on but generally doesn't last the winter. It is good for patching the occasional hole that you make from getting the plastic too hot, but for joining pieces together, it is useless in my opinion. A weld holds up much better.

Installation of the shrink wrap consists of unfolding the plastic shrink wrap over the top of the frame you created with the hoops. A couple of friendly helpers keeps the frustration down at this step. You want to keep the plastic clean while you do this. Don't drag it through the gravel. Try to do all of the unfolding on top of the dome frame or on deck (if your deck is clean) If you are mast down, this goes very fast. Mast up and you will need to run the plastic sheet stern to bow on one side of the mast and tie it down temporarily. Then find the fold that is the center of your sheet, side to side. With a sharpie, make some marks where you want to cut for the mast access. This is important because once you start cutting and moving the folds aside, it is real easy to loose your cut line unless you've drawn it onto the plastic first. Then take a box cutter and slice your opening on one side along your line. At that point you can lay the entire sheet down flat over the hoops and pull it tight bow to stern. Unfold the other side and your boat will be fully draped. What I am describing is cutting a slice for the mast on only one side. The other side will not be cut except for the standing rigging access. I think doing the job as two pieces would be harder, but I haven't ever tried it.

The next step is to fire up your weedburner and start tucking the sides under the horizontal loop that you ran around the hull. Start in the middle below the standing rigging and work your way forward or aft. Alternate sides as you work out the middle section and then the end sections to keep in touch with were the plastic is going or if it shifted on you.

With welding gloves on, pull the plastic down around the rope and then up, behind the rope, making a fold with about six inches of overlap. If you have an excess, it can be cut off later. Direct your torch at the face side to warm it up. When you see it start to move, slap your two hands together to fuse the front side to the folded side underneath if the rope isn't against the hull. If it is against the hull, slap it against the hull.

This happens quickly, keep moving along tacking down the entire edge of the plastic to the horizontal rope. It doesn't have to be perfect or a 100 percent weld, at this point. Your goal is to anchor the plastic and draw it as flat and tight as possible over the hoops. Mast down, this is a piece of cake. Mast up, and you still need to deal with the standing rigging slits and the big mast slit. This fussy work is what makes a mast up job take so long.

Since generally the widest part of the boat is by the mast, as you go toward the bow or stern, you will have extra plastic that will need to be cut off. You will also have a gentle curve at the top of the hoops from the mast to the bow and stern. This leaves extra plastic where you slice for the standing rigging. Use this extra plastic to your advantage.

If you are careful and thinking a head, you can over-lap these slits by pulling the two sides over each other when tacking down the base. Where you are heating over the hull, the overlap can be fused by warming the overlap and slapping the plastic against the hull with the back of your hand...since the back of your gloved hand is fairly flat, you get a nice smooth bond quickly. Higher up, above the toe rail, having a helper hold a 2ft x 2ft piece of plywood against overlap allows you to continue the welding all the way up to the mast. Since the ends of the boat are lower than the middle, you are taking up the excess plastic with the overlaps. Mast down, you can either make a fold in the middle or try to shrink out out the excess....

At this point, I should mention that how you seal the dome to the mast is a creative effort. I think I've done this differently each and every time I've done it. Generally I will try to pull the slit upward at the mast and get some tape around the mast creating a seal and a downward slope for the water coming off of the mast. I usually also fashion up a skirt of plastic that I wrap and tape around the mast higher up, followed by my welding the skirt to the dome plastic with a helper holding the 2x2 board while standing with my upper body poking out of a part of the slit I haven't yet welded shut. Once I get the skirt welded and shrunk to some degree, I finish the mast slit weld, go back outside and finish heating the area.

This area of the dome is subject to compromise. If you leave flaps of plastic from your welding job on the skirt and overlap, the flapping is liable to work the joint loose or develop a leak. So a good edge weld and moderate shrinking is the most effective. Wrinkles are pride busters perhaps, but I haven't had wrinkles fail on me if the overall piece is snug. So around the mast, go for functional, not necessarily for beauty. It will be the last couple of touchup passes with the torch that burn the hole. The mast area is tough to fix, so its better to live with a wrinkle than deal with a hole. You'll be better next year. As you are shrinking the field, if your weld job isn't good enough, (you see puckering) you can give it another slap if your helper is still inside. If the plastic is clean these welds are very strong.

As you fuse the bottom edge of the plastic around the rope, you should be trying to shift and pull the plastic for the best fit over the hoops. The plastic shrinks quite a bit, but careful work at this step will make the job turn out much better. The less you need to shrink, the less danger there is for holes, so get it tight and flat at this point. As you cut off the excess at the bow and stern, keep it clean for repairs, for closing up the stern opening and for the mast skirt.

With the perimeter fused down, check again that your shape is fair and make any corrections before you start shrinking the field of the plastic.

I do not recommend heating the plastic from the inside of your dome. This is a bad idea for several reasons. One reason is the fumes that the plastic puts off will make you feel ill. Another is that the heat builds up inside, making you hot and keep the plastic hotter than needed for longer....ie it is hard to control the temperature from the inside. And lastly, if you use metal conduit, the metal will absorb this excess heat and weaken the plastic that passes over it... ask me how I know. I didn't appreciate that one until mid winter when the dome started failing directly over the conduits. That is a hard spot to tape or repair.

You can tack down your plastic in a wind but don't try to shrink the entire dome on a windy day.

Heating should be done like spray painting enamel. Thin coats of enamel are usually sprayed down and allowed to flash off and then another coat until you build up the thickness of paint you desire. With the plastic, paint the plastic with the weedburner just like you are laying down paint. Go with broad gentle stokes. Don't stop moving.

Don't expect the plastic to move on the first pass, but it will a little. Make a second pass. It is still hot from the first pass, so it will get hotter the second time and move some more. Move on to another area, drawing the plastic tight slowly and over wide areas.

You want to keep moving around the boat because as it smooths out, it is putting tension on the still loose areas. If you draw it down evenly, the plastic will have a more even tension on it and no thin areas.

The plastic shrinks in proportion to the temperature that you bring it to. It will keep shrinking until it thins out and leaves a hole. In my experience, it continues to shrink for a bit after you move off of the area you were working on. So by continually moving around the boat, you will create a tight smooth cover.

I have a bow sprit so my bow is open from below. I have never bothered to install vents and never had a problem with mold or other growths. I weld to the horizontal line around the stern but leave a big flap until the end. When I am completely done, I fold over the flap and pat it down welding the job shut. There are doors that you can tape on and then cut the opening. I've used them when I plan on winter projects on board, but don't bother normally. If you saved your extra, didn't buy a door and still need to get onboard, you can cut a slit for access and then repair the slit with the extra plastic and some welding, or even stitching the opening closed with some of the fiberglass rope.

I know you are only storing the boat but if you wanted to dome it as a liveaboard, buy the glue on doors and some household window shrinkwrap.
The patio door sized shrinkwrap is a bit thicker than the window wrap. It works very well if you want to cut in some windows in your dome. Just cut out the window hole, tape the household wrap over the hole and shrink it with a hair dryer. As thin as that plastic is, I've never had it fail.

Sorry this turned into a how to and got long. I got a little caught up in the memories.

[Bill Silver]

Originally Posted by rslifkin

Propylene glycol is theoretically non-toxic. It's used as a food additive in some cases. Also, both propylene glycol and ethylene glycol are biodegradable, just with the caveat that ethylene glycol is highly toxic until it biodegrades.

Realistically though, I almost never hear of anyone (including marinas and boatyards) making an effort to capture the propylene glycol stuff during winterizing or de-winterizing.

These are links to two types of “ non toxic” RV antifreeze.

BUT if you read their SDS sheet they warn you:

“Environmental Precautions: Do not allow into any sewer, on the ground or into any waterway.”

The concentrate antifreeze should be collected in the spring and properly deposed as hazardous waste.

Absolute Zero contains 30 – 60% Propylene glycol

Which I would not say was safe to spill into the environment in this concentrated form.

From SDS: “Environmental Precautions: Do not allow into any sewer, on the ground or into any waterway.”

SDS:
https://www.uapinc.com/msds/PDF/FICH...REEZE%20EN.pdf



Winter proof contains 10-30% Ethanol, 1-5% Propylene glycol

From SDS: “Environmental Precautions Do not allow into any sewer, on the ground or into any waterway.”

https://www.uapinc.com/msdsapp/PDF/F...0052017_EN.pdf

[David Mathis]

Winters in northern New York commonly see temperatures far below zero with a few feet of snow so winterization and covering is mandatory here unless one wants to demonstrate repair and replacement skills or check writing ability in the spring.

Winterizing my powerboat is a bit different than a sailboat but the same basic procedures are followed.

Putting a box of moth balls into a hollow mast then sealing it tends to keep critters away. The same repellent properties of moth balls can be applied to the interior of the boat by opening a couple boxes of them and leaving them in areas that might otherwise be attractive to wildlife. Animals do not like the vapors emitted by the mothballs and tend to avoid areas where the odor is detected.

Unlike many boats that are completely sealed with shrinkwrap, simply pulling a 40' wide shrinkwrap piece over the top frame, made from 2x4s with a 2x6 center top piece, and securing it to both sides works well for the 43' express cruiser. The ends are left open which seems to reduce the condensation and mold. Pulling the plastic wrap over the boat perpendicular to the axis eliminates waste and allows the same wrap to be used for about three years, four if the wind doesn't wear holes or weaken the wrap. If it isn't completely shrunk and tight, it's easier to get on the next year. Tons of this plastic end up in landfills every year; reusing it makes mother nature smile.

All systems that have water must be winterized, this includes the fresh water system, air conditioners, toilet, generator, and main engines. Be aware that some engines are raw water cooled. If your boat has engines with anti-freeze and heat exchangers, running ethylene glycol through until it has a strong pink color at the discharge will adequately flush the cooling system. However, engines with raw water cooling will have the clock and heads filled with water that will not be displaced with the ethylene glycol until the thermostat opens ar normal operating temperature. This is impractical for boats on blocks. For those engines, remove the block drain plug or plugs near the bottom of the block. This should drain out the water. Now replace the plugs and fill the block and the cooling passages in the head(s) with the glycol by removing the upper coolant hose or thermostat housing, whichever is higher, and pouring in enough to fill it. Now replace the hose or housing and start the engine for just a few seconds to circulate the glycol into any passages that might still contain water.

Now do the air conditioners, toilet, fresh water system, etc and your boat will be ready when the flowers bloom in the springtime.

[JimJohnston]

Some types of rudders, especially on C&C yachts, and their vintage peers, can accumulate water inside. A small hole 3/8" drilled in the bottom will allow them to drain. The hole can be plugged with 'life caulk' (or similar) and a bolt just before launch the following spring.

[SuW]

Originally Posted by DarwinHolmstrom

I'm going to have to store my boat on the hard this winter (and I'll be following Mike's excellent advice!) but for next winter is it feasable to live aboard anywhere on the Great Lakes?

Hi Darwin,
Iroquois Marine Services is where I keep my boat (out of the water in winter). They have had liveaboards at the dock in the winter for the last few years. Two last year. Both 36ft + sailboats.
The marina is just above the first Seaway lock on the St. Lawrence, downstream from the 1000 Islands, on the Canadian side.
Robert Houze is the owner. 613-652-2666.

Sue.

[cdcorl]

Lots of options, we are on the North Shore of Lake Superior, and get colder than most great lake locations. We have done different things depending on the boat. With our older boat (30 years), we put 2 Bubblers on the boat and left it on the dock. Take care of your engine and water systems, put a 1500W heater inside, a trickle charge battery charger, and run the bubblers. We would cover the cockpit, and sometimes shovel out to do a December or April sail (followed by re-winterizing the engine). With a more valuable boat, we had a custom canvas cover built, Winterize the engine, and all water systems, put it on a cradle, and that is about all. Winters are dry. No moisture issues at all over the past 40 years, but we do stand our cushions on end just in case. We don't have a large freeze thaw season like many of the lakes south of us, so we don't worry about the mast. If you are in an area of constant freeze/thaw, getting the mast down is good idea. There have been issues with water going down the chainplates or other areas, and then freezing. Repeat that a few times and you can have trouble. Plus, wind on a mast when the boat is on the hard is more difficult on chainplates than wind on the mast when the boat is in the water, so issues can surface that weren't there before.

[Tanqueray]

Originally Posted by DanielPerry

No antifreeze into the water or on the ground, guys.. doesnt matter what kind in my opinion. Take care of what we love.

I think there should be enough diy videos and such to reference online, but what you should look for is winterizing anything that has had water in it that cannot completely drain by gravity alone.

Use the pink stuff (propylene glycol) in potable water systems and whatever in the bilge. However, I have read elsewhere to use NON-prediluted in the bilge so that, if water gets in it does not over dilute what is in your bilge.

I use a tarp over my mast when its down, otherwise I make a ridge-pole out of a small dead-standing cedar tree or something like that. Attach some weights to the edges of the tarp that hang down over the sides (ideally the tarp overhangs the sides by a couple feet. If you weight it down sufficiently you most likely wont get a 'cave-in' situation. I never have, and my set-up has seen some pretty good freezing rain and heavy, deep snow. I live in northern Michigan.

Just out of curiosity, how do you drain the pink stuff out of your water lines and engine in the spring?

I am against polluting, but seems pretty impractical to capture the pink stuff from the engine when starting it in the sling and somehow capturing the AF in the water lines.

Greg

[SuW]

On the subject of winter covers; we always take the mast down and we made a frame with galvanized electrical conduit using a system called "Kover Klamps".
This US-based company ships a set of components to make really strong frames using conduit.
You then cover with reinforced plastic material from Reef Industries (we used TX-1200). Edges are tied down with shrink-wrap tie down and a product called "Kover Klips" to grip the edges of the cover.
We use nylon webbing clips on webbing loops to allow us to quickly open the cover to get on board.
We invested in a pipe cutter and conduit bending tool to make the frame.
We made the cover in 2015 and the plastic is still good.
This system stood up well through lots of snow and ice. We go in to the boatyard once a month or after significant freezing rain to knock off the ice.

[Tanqueray]

I live and store my boat in NW Indiana, just south of Chicago. Gets plenty cold, windy, and snowy here.

I did not cover my first boat a 1998 Hunter 280. But I did not like the potential freeze/thaw cycles on the deck, ports, etc.

I covered my second boat, a 1988 O’Day 322 with a home made frame and tarps. Took forever to set up, looked like crap, but it did keep most of the freezing ice / snow off the decks. Second year of ownership, bought a canvas cover for her. Uses the boom and no frame. Works well, should have upgraded to get the cover a bit lower than the toe rails, but it also keeps most of the ice and snow off the boat, it goes inside of the lifelines, so it does not cause any damage to them.

I do not drop my mast. I do remove my wind instruments if I can get up the mast at the end of the season. If I cannot get up (no help), then they stay. I could not find my chair last year, so they stayed up all winter.,.,still worked this spring.

I use pink AF in the engine (fresh water cooled) and water systems. I do not fill the water tanks, but drain them as well as the water heater. I bypass the water heater, pump pink AF through the water systems. I also pump pink AF through the toilet pump, bowl and into the holding tank.

I usually put some AF into the bilge in case I get water in there over the winter (I usually do).

I make sure the batteries are topped off before I haul out, and once she is put to bed, I disconnect the leads to the batteries. They stay reasonably charged over the winter.

I usually change the oil n my Yanmar diesel,every other year....just before haulout.

6 years using this economical and common sense approach without incident.

Greg