Wooden hull for long term cruising

[Ghostrider421]

As a former wood boat builder I can tell you - unless it's a weekender - you don't want one. I worked with my Dad and Grandfather building canoes, cats, tris and gulets. Each one is more complicated than the one before. Oak is not the strongest wood, as my Dad discovered using Coyhaique Cypress - a tree that grows in the water. A wood extremely hard to cut. There are only a handful of boats built with this materiel because they are so heavy....as in 40k/kg for a 10m boat - truly a full displacement hull. It's not something you want to have in relatively shallow waters (as in marinas). It's perfectly at home in a thousand meters of water. The interior of the last gulet I worked on had beautiful teak, holly and cherry woods - no veneers - full boards - 13mm thickness. That's the difference btwn what is built in EU vs builders in the rest of the world. You'll find plenty of designers that did wood, but hardly any now. I saw a Buehler designed, Shibley built wood Duck - one of the very few today for sale. It's a beauty, but without a worm shoe it will have serious problems down the line.
My present 44 Cat is wood, but I'm going to glass the hull in/out over the winter. My next project is with welded aluminum - something my Dad was working on when he died.

[Poche]

I was chatting with a well known guy from Newport Beach CA who comes from a well off sailing family. They owned large wooden sailboats and cruised them around the world for many years. I mentioned that I was looking for a wood sailboat. He said, "Don't ever buy a wood boat".

[JBP]

Everyone chimed in about why not to buy a wood boat, but no one answered your question really. Having grown up on wooden boats, the biggest problem is rot, due to ship worms, dry rot, or wet rot. Planking can be fixed readily enough, but rotted frames can be a big job, and a rotted keel timber will usually condemn a boat. Get in the bilge and poke all the frames with a screwdriver as well as the keel. Rot also has a distinctive smell. Be ready to get dirty and crawl into tiny spaces. While there check for cracked frames or shoddy repairs.
Larger boats can also sag and distort, especially sailboats. Stand back and look at the lines. It can be hard to tell if you don't know what the shape should be, but if it asymmetrical or the planking is distorted that could be a problem. Of course used wooden boats tend to be really old, so you might just resign yourself to replacing the engine, rigging, sails, electronics, etc.

[Cadence]

Originally Posted by JBP

Everyone chimed in about why not to buy a wood boat, but no one answered your question really. Having grown up on wooden boats, the biggest problem is rot, due to ship worms, dry rot, or wet rot. Planking can be fixed readily enough, but rotted frames can be a big job, and a rotted keel timber will usually condemn a boat. Get in the bilge and poke all the frames with a screwdriver as well as the keel. Rot also has a distinctive smell. Be ready to get dirty and crawl into tiny spaces. While there check for cracked frames or shoddy repairs.
Larger boats can also sag and distort, especially sailboats. Stand back and look at the lines. It can be hard to tell if you don't know what the shape should be, but if it asymmetrical or the planking is distorted that could be a problem. Of course used wooden boats tend to be really old, so you might just resign yourself to replacing the engine, rigging, sails, electronics, etc.

Pillow blocks are also a good place to probe for rot.

[jjorgenson3]

We have owned our 1970 Alaskan 46 for about 6 years. Previous owner had her forty years. Would not trade her for anything well maybe the right price. Handles differently in the water than the plastic boats. Very stable. If you find a good one insurance won’t be any issue. Biggest trick is to keep them in the water and don’t keep her out on the hard more than two weeks so scheduling maintenance is a priority. Bottom paint every other year and get on a fastener change out plan starting forward at the hood every time you haul out for anything below the waterline.

[Cadence]

Originally Posted by jjorgenson3

We have owned our 1970 Alaskan 46 for about 6 years. Previous owner had her forty years. Would not trade her for anything well maybe the right price. Handles differently in the water than the plastic boats. Very stable. If you find a good one insurance won’t be any issue. Biggest trick is to keep them in the water and don’t keep her out on the hard more than two weeks so scheduling maintenance is a priority. Bottom paint every other year and get on a fastener change out plan starting forward at the hood every time you haul out for anything below the waterline.

I don't think I would agree with two weeks. I grew up on a couple of smudge pots. As I recall hauled in Oct. and splashed in Apr.. Insuring the boat soaks up
prior to using is important. That may take two weeks. What have the Maine lobstermen done let ice crush their hulls?

[Wotname]

I have stayed out of this thread so far because I'm biassed .

Having owned a carvel planked 1950's NZ built Giles Wanderer, a 1970's plywood Aussie built Van deStadt Dogger, a 1970's built steel Bollard Starfire and finally a small fibreglass 18' dayboat.

I would happily own another wooden boat if it was already in good condition. It is way easier to keep a good wooden boat in good condition than to try to repair one that has been let deteriorate.

You only need three items to survey a wooden wood; your nose, your eyes and an ice pick. The ice pick is essential IMO. OK, yes, you do need a light and your hands as well .

[jjorgenson3]

Two weeks there is a lot less torque on the fasteners. Drying the hull out like that every year flexes the fasteners of which they were not designed to do unless you have a robust fastener replacement schedule not good overall. All the planks are original on our boat.

[Pelagic]

Some projects take a huge commitment in time and funds

[Tmint]

I have owned both wood boats and fiberglass boats; if you have the resources, I say buy the wood boat.

My wood boats:
14 foot Enterprise, plywood,
26 foot Blanchard Sr., planked
26 foot Thunderbird, plywood,
35 foot Monk sloop, cedar planked.

My last two boats were plastic:
26 foot Westerly Centaur,
31 foot Dufour 31 (Still have).

Wood boats, if they are in good condition, are much more pleasant to work on, nicer to be on, warmer, quieter, than plastic. Also, they are mostly biodegradable at the end of their life. An old wood boat, if kept up, can last almost forever, but every bit of wood may have been replaced a piece at a time! If it has been well maintained, the maintenance may be slightly higher, but easier and more pleasant. Just one example, painting with marine enamel is easier, cheaper, and less toxic than Urethane.

Fiberglass boats, on the other hand, can be neglected for longer and still be worth restoring, are cheaper because there are so many out there, possibly take less skill to repair, and are easier to find.

I own a fiberglass boat now because I could not find a wood boat within my budget that did not need more work than I was willing to do, and was not more expensive to bring up to cruising standards than I could afford.

[Hardhead]

It's been almost a week since the OP posted last, so maybe he's made a decision.

[JMaav]

Originally Posted by NicBeeee

Hi, we have been looking at wooden hull yachts of around 40ft. Has anyone got some tips on what I should be on the lookout for condition wise. Very naive still compared to you guys on here. I will be paying out for a survey but would prefer not to waste money or anyone's time if I can see if it's worth or not worth pursuing.
Thanks

As a wooden boat builder for many years (it’s been a while ago now, granted), I’d advise not steering clear of wood - but focus heavily on the boat’s history. Good builder? Well maintained? Was it ever in the southern climates (worms)? Can you do deep investigations and survey/inspections before purchase?
If any of the above are not good / or not available to you - I’d look for another.
Wooden boats have a character that cannot be matched in another material. How they handle, how they ‘sound’, how they feel. Even sleeping aboard is greatly different. Wooden boaters tend to want to stay wooden boaters, or miss what they had (ok, maybe just the good parts).
Yes, you will find your ongoing maintenance list is more urgent. You can’t ‘leave things for later’ as you could with some other materials, but.., you might enjoy the trade-offs, as others do.
Enjoy the search!

[boatpoker]

Originally Posted by NicBeeee

Hi, we have been looking at wooden hull yachts of around 40ft. Has anyone got some tips on what I should be on the lookout for condition wise. Very naive still compared to you guys on here. I will be paying out for a survey but would prefer not to waste money or anyone's time if I can see if it's worth or not worth pursuing.
Thanks

This article does not discuss wood however it contains many tips of the hundreds of other things to look for when inspecting a prospective purchase.

Marine Survey 101, pre-survey inspection

[CapnCrunch]

Originally Posted by boatpoker

My experience is that a very very few wooden boat buyers know what they are getting into and often purchase what they see as a bargain. It is hearbreaking to see these people whirling down a financial toilet.

I have often found it difficult to get buyers to understand the scope of what they are getting into....... none of them do it twice.

It takes a very rare, dedicated wooden boat person with unlimited time, skil, knowledge and money to keep these old boats alive.

The above describes my own experience perfectly. I soon realized that restoring/maintaining my 1967 42' Trojan woody was going to be well beyond the amount of time and money I was willing to accept. That being said, I lived on her in a covered freshwater slip for 8 years, doing only doing the maintenance required to keep her afloat.

I also found that getting even liability insurance was difficult and hull coverage quotes were astronomical. When I finally decided to get rid of her, I found that I couldn't even give her away because the reputable marinas here in Little Rock no longer accept wood boats. I ended up having to haul her out and dismantle her.

If you really want a wood boat to love, I'd suggest finding one of those old "runabouts."

[roland stockham]

[QUOTE
About the worst that can happen from neglect on a solid hull fiberglass boat is you get a bad case of blisters. Unsightly, expensive to fix and hurts resale value...but otherwise, largely cosmetic unless you let it go for decades and most newer boats use better materials to avoid it in the first place. I can't recall ever hearing of blisters taking a boat to the bottom.

The next worse thing is rot in a cored deck. A bit of wet core while better to fix, again is unlikely to cause a major problem if you aren't meticulous about maintenance. Typically, you can pick your time to repair it and unless it's bad, it isn't that hard to do.[/QUOTE]


Have to disagre on this. While GRP has some excellent properties for boat building it is not free from problems. When it is stressed there is microscopic movenet within the structure that can break the bond between the glass and resin, especially with polyester resins. If the boat is then neglected and gets water in the bilge cappilary action draws water alond the strands and lubricates them. The result is that the boat looses all its stiffness. Hull to keal joints deteriorate and fail as does the internal framing that speads keel loads to the hull. Many boats rely on wood or wood cored GRP as part of the structural integity and either the bulkhead or the tabbing fails. Stress cracks in gellcoats can lead to moisure penitration that can rot out deck cores or sofen the glass. Decks are almost always a laminate of some kind in order to be stiff enough and with neglect and standing water on the deck you can get sevear loss of structural integrety. One of the most common ways for GRP boats to die is through failing to maintain the caulking around deck fitting leading to water in the cores in lots of places. While it is possible to repair minor areas if it is widespred it would be cheaper to replace the hull than fix it.

Not saying any of these are common just that the idea that you can leave a GRP boat without maintainence and assume it will be fine is not nessasarily true. All depends on how well designed and built the boat was in the first place.