asking price VS realistic price.

[Red Sky]

Originally Posted by mutant

Thank you for all the inputs. I really apreiate A little joker in my budget is currency. I hope that it will change in 2-3 years in my favor. (should bought for 5-7 year ago) So i startet with the elimination prosess. I got at lot inputs in LGM this year in france. (my wife is in one of cruising off duty latest rewievs.) So i hope that i will be well educated when i buy my new home I we will probably renta a cat in Croatia a couple of times so we have some referesnes.

Remember, in Croatia, as well as other countries, certification is required to charter. We chartered with Sunsail out of Marina Agana, Croatia, just North of Split. We had a Leopard 45, they call it a 444, loved it and Croatia.

[mutant]

Originally Posted by Red Sky

Remember, in Croatia, as well as other countries, certification is required to charter. We chartered with Sunsail out of Marina Agana, Croatia, just North of Split. We had a Leopard 45, they call it a 444, loved it and Croatia.

I have D5L and ICC but no sailing experience. So I will be renting a cat with captain in the beginning of renting periode. Is your experience to rent a cat in Croatia easy. And would you recommend sunsail service/pricing?
Mutant

[Red Sky]

Mutant,

Being the only charter experience I’ve had, I can’t compare it, but it was no problem. 4 couples, plenty of room due to the layout of the boat. Provisioning was limited near the base due to how small Agana is, plan on either having them provision or head to Trogir. It wasn’t cheap, but in line with the other charter companies in the area. We picked Sunsail because they offered the nicest cats. As I said, we loved Croatia. Great food and very nice people. Enjoy.

[Be Free Sailor]

Welcome Mutant,
I have owned 3 Lagoon catamarans, over the past 3 years (410, 380, 440).
All of them "owners version".
My recommendation would be to buy from a well known brand e.g. Leopard or Lagoon, and to get an owners version, one that was never chartered.
I have some experience buying internationally, and I am happy to help you via PM or you are even welcome for a cup of coffee, and to see my boat. I am located near to Copenhagen.
Cheers,
Niels

[toolbar]

Originally Posted by Be Free Sailor

I have owned 3 Lagoon catamarans, over the past 3 years (410, 380, 440).

I know a number of people who don't change their underwear that often... no kidding, why did you upgrade so quickly?

If you are in Copenhagen, do you come to the IMM in Karlskrona this year?

Paul

[mutant]

Originally Posted by Red Sky

Mutant,

Being the only charter experience I’ve had, I can’t compare it, but it was no problem. 4 couples, plenty of room due to the layout of the boat. Provisioning was limited near the base due to how small Agana is, plan on either having them provision or head to Trogir. It wasn’t cheap, but in line with the other charter companies in the area. We picked Sunsail because they offered the nicest cats. As I said, we loved Croatia. Great food and very nice people. Enjoy.

Great tip. I will send them a message

[Red Sky]

Mutant,

If you do go, don’t miss going to the walled city of Korcula if you go that far South. Even if you have to rent a car and drive from Vela Luka, it’s more than worth the trip. A home Marco Polo lived in is there...it blew me away.

[thinwater]

In my experience, much has to do with condition. If it needs a lot, the price is probably soft. If it is impeccable, they probably know damn well what it is worth and have other offers. And by the time the dust settles, the impeccable boat will probably be the better value!

[mutant]

Originally Posted by Red Sky

Mutant,

If you do go, don’t miss going to the walled city of Korcula if you go that far South. Even if you have to rent a car and drive from Vela Luka, it’s more than worth the trip. A home Marco Polo lived in is there...it blew me away.

I put that on my "to do" list Is that the place where they filmed part for Game of thrones?

[dcstrng]

I don’t worry too much about hurting the seller’s feeling, but I do get incensed with wasting my own time chasing around some financial mulberry bush just to satisfy the seller’s ego. Usually I won’t even look at the photos of the boat unless it is very close to what I’m willing to pay – and I suspect I’m what you’d call a bottom-feeder. But I much prefer to let the seller do all the work, dickering with themselves, and then if the price gets into my neighborhood, I’m ready to write the check -- then… I’m sure I’ve missed out on some good deals with my pathological distaste for bartering, but time and inertia are excellent allies… Some buyers enjoy the bartering contest, and know all the tricks required to overpower their prey… I’m more of the “lurk, stalk and pounce” predator.

[CarlF]

The real price of a boat is not the check to the seller. It's that check PLUS what's spent on the first 18 months of ownership getting it the way you want it.

Obviously this depends on boat size but ask around and you'll find people who say they spent $50,000 or more during the first 18 months of ownership.

There are exceptions. A few people have the knowledge, experience and time to restore a boat. If they don't charge for their own time, it can end up pretty cheap. But that's not me - and I don't think it's the OP

Once in a while, someone wins the lottery and get an incredible price and a perfect boat. They'll brag about it for the rest of their life. But that's never happened to me in buying 10 boats - or to most people.

A large discount almost always means a lot spent after the sale. You decide to replace the obsolete 10 year old electronics - that work - for new models. New sails because the boat is slower than you like. New berths cushions because your wife thinks they smell of mildew (that you can't smell). There are always a few expensive things the surveyor missed. And so on. It adds up fast.

Most of the time a fairly young "in demand" boat from a good builder that that is in great shape and has had a knowledgable and meticulous owner will go for very close to asking (like 95%).

Some advise to the OP:

If you feel you should offer less than about 90% then it's not the boat for a first time purchaser. Leave it for someone with more experience. Maybe the problem is the boat. Maybe the problem is the owner. But it's not the boat for you.

Be sure to talk to the owner before making an offer. A good owner is worth a lot both before and after the sale. No one knows the boat better. The sign of a good owner is one who won't shut up telling you about all the things he's replaced on the boat and how great a boat it is. Again, if it's not the right owner, leave it to someone with more experience.

Be realistic about the 18 months cost and keep budgeting for it. Don't buy more boat than you can afford to maintain the way you want to. You'll just end up with a broken down boat that you'll end up selling -- at a large discount from asking

[Red Sky]

Originally Posted by mutant

I put that on my "to do" list Is that the place where they filmed part for Game of thrones?

I know they did a lot of filming around Dubrovnik, not sure about the walled city of Korcula. Have a great time.

My wife and I were walking around a back “street” of Vela Luka and we came to a “T” and I looked up at the 3 story building in front of us and wondered out loud how old it was. A second floor window shutter swings open, a smiling man appears and tells me, in perfect English, 600 years. He lived in a 600 year old building! For those of us born in the USA, 600 years is almost unfathomable.

Like I said, an awesome place with awesome people.

[mutant]

I love how you turn the tables You try to sell me something and if it is good. I will consider buying it I got a lot of time so I can wait on the fence and watch offers pass by. And seize the right one when it appears. That is what I love with this forum. There are millions of years of experience here

[catnap892]

There is another alternative to brokers for the initial contact. There are knowledgeable people, out there, who will check out the boat for you. Instead of flying from Wisconsin to Florida and staying in a motel, find someone who will, for a resonable fee, go look at the boat, take lots of pictures and send you a report with an opinion of yes, it is a good boat, or no, don't bother. Usually a buyer is anxious to find something but an independant set of eyes can be very helpful. This person has no financial interest in the sale of the boat. I have performed this service for potential buyers, in the past, but am NOT soliciting my services.
Bill

[tomfl]

Originally Posted by CarlF

The real price of a boat is not the check to the seller. It's that check PLUS what's spent on the first 18 months of ownership getting it the way you want it.

SNIP

Most of the time a fairly young "in demand" boat from a good builder that that is in great shape and has had a knowledgable and meticulous owner will go for very close to asking (like 95%).


SNIP

Good advice. But the real trick is finding an 'in demand' boat in great shape with a knowledgeable and meticulous owner. As a rule of thumb is the owner is living aboard or using it on a regular basis, like at least every week, it will most likely have all, or at least most, stuff working.

As several posters have noted the boats with a soft price often have been for sale for some time and are showing the results of neglect. Often times the owner has not used the boat for months, or even years. Maybe the owner is dead and it is an estate sale. Sure you can wait around on these boats and watch the price drop. Problem is that as a rule the more the price drops the condition of the boat also drops.

There are people who walk the docks and make offers on boats out of the blue at absurdly low prices hoping to find deals. I have had a couple of offers out of the blue on my boat at what I would call half of what it is worth; maybe less. All this when the boat was not listed and not for sale.

Another huge consideration is opportunity cost. It takes time, effort, and money to check out boats that are, or maybe for sale. Time you could have been sailing off into the sunset if you had simply spent the extra money right now to buy a boat ready to sail.