Bali 4.3 Loft

[Factor]

[QUOTE=o2basailor;1995792]

I just returned from the Paris boat show and La Rochelle, where the boats are made. As a person who has actually walked through the decks, spent a day talking with the design team, and seen the boat perform. ..I can say that a lot of the opinions given are just that, opinions.

Some may be assessments based in the laws of Physics and not opinions.

Nothing against that, but the facts are a bit different than you might think.
It ends up that the design team spent a lot of time considering weight balance and on water characteristics. The result amazed me. This boat is not only a screamer, reaching over 14 knots in a much wind and topping out at an unbelievable 21 knots in 25 knit wind, while being smooth, dry, and literally never slamming once. I have never experienced anything like it and I have been sailing cats for nearly 30 years.

Clearly you sailed the boat at speed, so I am struggling to say this, but I simply cannot accept those figures, faster than a more expensive larger Cat from the same company? I don't think so. Look it just isn't possible to achieve that performance with that sail area with that hull drag with that weight. Just not possible.

Their concept is more straight forward than you might think. With a solid bow, the trend to dig is offset by the greatly added boyancy. In other words, it's kind of like a power boat. The water stays below the hulls instead of coming over them or thru the tramp.

The flat solid foredeck adds absolutely nothing to bouancy, nothing, adds a lot to weight and windage though.

And the price was very good, especially given the long last of standard equipment like lots of tankage, refrigeration, smart technology, etc. Frankly, I wish I had seen this before I bought my boat.

What is your boat?

Let me be frank here - I have $1000 for the first person who can take me sailing on a Bali at a consistent no surfing boat speed of over 15 knots in 25 knots of wind, never mind 21 knots.

[monte]

Paypal accepted.
http://youtu.be/vzYE0sxqnvA

[Factor]

I will be keeping the $1000. Nothing in that video showed

consistent no surfing boat speed of over 15 knots in 25 knots of wind,

[Poozer]

Hey Factor, I'm sure your $1000 is safe! Although Catana does a nice job with their surf movies!

[Factor]

Yep, its safe, in fact I'll up it to $10K

[arsenelupiga]

Originally Posted by Factor

Yep, its safe, in fact I'll up it to $10K

dont increase any more.

at 75 true, app wind at 15 kn is 32 and app angle 48. i think this is actually doable with extra sail area however, risking some damage that your reward will cover.

[Factor]

Originally Posted by arsenelupiga

dont increase any more.

at 75 true, app wind at 15 kn is 32 and app angle 48. i think this is actually doable with extra sail area however, risking some damage that your reward will cover.

Not a snowflake's chance in hell. Those figures above are interesting but their own figures come in at 43 feet with a waterline length of 41 feet light displacement of 11.3 t (so a really light boat ready to sail with minimal bits on board but with 250 litres of water and 250 litres of fuel and a dinghy and enough gear to be legal in my part of the world (e.g. a second anchor) and the weight of the soft luff sails, its gunna be at least 12.5 ton - at least, I love to see one weighed on rated load cells.

Compare that with say catanas own C42 - its almost the same length and two and a half tonnes lighter According to their own polars (which I might say are more often than not fanciful - not Catanas but almost every designer) it has a top speed in 25 knots (effective top speed and sail area is being reduced after that) of 17-18 knots. Catana in their blurb talk about up to 20 knots down wind and 12 knots upwind.

So catana are making a lighter more powerful C42 which doesn't go as fast as the heavier less powerful Bali. I don't think so.

The C42 is more expensive than the Bali as well. So you pay more for a lighter more powerful boat that doesn't perform as well. Why would catana do that?

I am confident my money is safe.

Remember this is coming from a claim by o2basailor that:

It ends up that the design team spent a lot of time considering weight balance and on water characteristics. The result amazed me. This boat is not only a screamer, reaching over 14 knots in a much wind and topping out at an unbelievable 21 knots in 25 knit wind, while being smooth, dry, and literally never slamming once. I have never experienced anything like it and I have been sailing cats for nearly 30 years.

I call unequivocally untrue. I have sailed lots and lots of multis and some really really fast ones. And raced lots of them with good crews. Just not going to happen. To get those speeds it will have to have a hurricane up its posterior.

[kkostenko]

Hello!

I am taking Bali 4.3 for a two week charter in Greece second half of May, sailing Cyclades. Curious if somebody actually sailed it for more than few hours? Please share, mostly interested in areas requiring some extra attention.

[contrail]

Originally Posted by jimba

This one ?

on the title page, in French, it says "average speed 7 knots". Ssiling full time in the BVI's I do see these boats, and they don't have a reputation as some super speed demons.

Cheers,
Tim

[schoonerdog]

Be interested to find out what you think. I've lived aboard on catamarans since the mid 90s, and I've replaced many refrigerators and freezers on board. This is obviously an attempt to give a sailboat the same experience in terms of comfort as a trawler, which is not a bad concept. Realistically that could mean a family of 4 would be able to live at anchor for a month before reprovisioning. I'd want a ton of solar panels to keep up with the demand. For those at a slip (which face it is the vast majority of live-aboards) it would be ideal. You spend all you time in the saloon, that's where you talk, where you do home schooling, where the kids read, where you do everything. Doubling that space so you can live in comfort and privacy is gold. I'd say this is less aimed at charter and more for live-aboards. Charter's can be in areas where the weather is temperate (at least when people are coming down to do the charter). Living aboard, in the best location maybe only 1 day in 3 is ideal enough to be in cockpit opened up. Here on the Chesapeake we get hotter than Tampa in the summer and have a good 5 months of cold weather (as snow this weekend can testify to).

Originally Posted by kkostenko

Hello!

I am taking Bali 4.3 for a two week charter in Greece second half of May, sailing Cyclades. Curious if somebody actually sailed it for more than few hours? Please share, mostly interested in areas requiring some extra attention.

[kkostenko]

Originally Posted by schoonerdog

Be interested to find out what you think. I've lived aboard on catamarans since the mid 90s, and I've replaced many refrigerators and freezers on board. This is obviously an attempt to give a sailboat the same experience in terms of comfort as a trawler, which is not a bad concept. Realistically that could mean a family of 4 would be able to live at anchor for a month before reprovisioning. I'd want a ton of solar panels to keep up with the demand. For those at a slip (which face it is the vast majority of live-aboards) it would be ideal. You spend all you time in the saloon, that's where you talk, where you do home schooling, where the kids read, where you do everything. Doubling that space so you can live in comfort and privacy is gold. I'd say this is less aimed at charter and more for live-aboards. Charter's can be in areas where the weather is temperate (at least when people are coming down to do the charter). Living aboard, in the best location maybe only 1 day in 3 is ideal enough to be in cockpit opened up. Here on the Chesapeake we get hotter than Tampa in the summer and have a good 5 months of cold weather (as snow this weekend can testify to).

A boat was comfortable indeed, no complains here. Saloon is very big and very comfortable. The sliding door in our cat was misaligned and could not close reliably and completely. She sailed all right, but nothing really exiting here, it is a big ugly brick (due to dodge/bimini used to protect flybridge) . Her handling of the slightly rough conditions upwind was worse then I would like to. Sitting in a flybridge certainly gives a nice visibility. All in all if you want a house on water this is a good option to consider. For my taste I am going to keep experimenting with other cats, but generally will avoid Bali due to unexiting sailing and huge surface area. My next experiment is going to be Helia 44e charted @ US/BVI end of June 2018. Any comments on Helia 44e BTW?

So far designed wise I still really like Sunsail 444/Leopard 43.

P.S. We were making up to 9knots ~ 17knots wind on beam reach at same point if someone if interested. A boat generally could make 5-7 knots at ~12 knots winds broad reach.

Yours,
Stan.

[Simi 60]

Originally Posted by serpa4

That residential fridge is actually a marine one... Nice! That was a concern of mine. A residential one is not the way to live off the hook for years.

Plenty of us out here with residential fridges living on the hook for years.

[higginslake]

Does anyone have an owners manual for the 4.3 or 4.5 they could share (in pdf or otherwise)?

[ssmoot]

I guess since this thread is back to life, for anyone curious, it looks like the 4.3 is getting similar updates the 4.1 debuted. There's a couple teaser images on their Facebook page of the new transom seating. It's very large and u-shaped. Looks like a nice place to be, but I'm not sure if there's accommodation for a built-in grill or anything. It seems possible that they give you a couple cavernous storage lockers there, but no action shots. yet.

The 4.1 upgrades some interior finishes (look at the top of the nav-station "dashboard", or the microwave area for examples) and has much larger port lights in the owner's hull as well, so I'd expect to see the same with the new 4.3 but I don't think they've released any shots yet.

Either way, these seem like some of the most significant "mid-cycle" updates I've seen on a catamaran. Good to see them evolving/refining the design. These look like pretty big upgrades to me.