Daggerboard catamarans

[rom]

Originally Posted by 44'cruisingcat

You'd be tacking through about 72 degrees. AWS about 32 kts, VMG better than 6 1/2 kts.

Yes but he has a very special L400:

Originally Posted by arsenelupiga

I bet can find conditions wind/vawes where my L400 will outrun outremer similar length.

Took me some time to find this one coming from an old thread, for some reason I still had it in mind.

[Barra]

Originally Posted by rom

Yes but he has a very special L400:


Took me some time to find this one coming from an old thread, for some reason I still had it in mind.

[44'cruisingcat]

Originally Posted by Seaslug Caravan

Data?? points are great. Thanx Mr "C"

A quick check of a true/apparent calculator reveals.....

With approx 30 knots of apparent wind at 45 , all the drag of the reefed section of the spar, the great lump of rolled up sail for a leading edge of the headsail and the considerable drag of a VERY high profile boat, you would have been making a MINIMUM of 5 degrees of leeway per tack (I'm being nice) , so your tacks would have been through at least 100 degrees over the ground.

So in the same conditions in unprotected water you too would have been in the 4.5 knot vmg territory:thumb

So in your private little universe, 5' of leeway costs you nearly 3 knots VMG?

Try a real boat one day. More fun than the pretend ones.

[arsenelupiga]

Originally Posted by rom

Yes but he has a very special L400:


Took me some time to find this one coming from an old thread, for some reason I still had it in mind.

Excellent, you have learned something

In meantime I have learned things too. Wont be light winds for sure. I would say 30-40 kn reaching or upwind.

[Seaslug Caravan]

Originally Posted by 44'cruisingcat

So in your private little universe, 5' of leeway costs you nearly 3 knots VMG?

Try a real boat one day. More fun than the pretend ones.

Sorry Mr "C" , once again I forgot who I was talking to.

It is a little complicated.

VMG UPWIND IS........

"net speed (directly) into the wind, called VMG upwind".

[weavis]

The mods are now having to issue a mild comment to enforce the be nice rule.
Excessive sarcasm, denigration and ridicule are all against the terms of agreement for membership.

We really try to leave the members to sort out issues between themselves, and we all learn from the factual exchange of data, but......... Should this continue we have no recourse but to issue infractions.

Jes sayin'

weavis, who was loving this up till now...

[yeloya]

Talking about the AWA, how close yr boat can go to wind and the speed you make; whether you have folding/feathering props or not, technological sails vs. radial cut dacron sails, yr pointing angle vs COG, boat speed vs. SOG, sea state (choppy vs quite seas, current , etc) and more importantly how loaded the boat is can make huge differences.
I would be curious to read some of the seemeingly excessive claims with these details..
The Outremer that I am refering sometimes has a rotative carbon mast, hydranet sails, folding props and not overloaded. Some other owner with the same boat may not have the same resaults if he doesn't have these features.

Cheers

Yeloya

[44'cruisingcat]

Originally Posted by Seaslug Caravan

Sorry Mr "C" , once again I forgot who I was talking to.

It is a little complicated.

VMG UPWIND IS........

"net speed (directly) into the wind, called VMG upwind".

It's pretty simple trigonometry.

In the scenario before, my VMG (not adjusted for leeway) was around 7.8 knots.

Allowing for 5 degrees of leeway, VMG falls to just over 7 knots. Not 4.5.

You say it's complicated, it's not though, it's just high school arithmetic.

However,if that's too difficult or complex for you there are VMG calculators online.

[django37]

Queensland Multihulls OMR says that a boat with daggerboards is 0.5% (not 5%) faster than one with fixed keels, the Texel rule says between 1 and 2.5% depending of depth of keel compared to waterline length!

[arsenelupiga]

Multihulls 2000 spreadheet says for appendage factor to add around 3% of speed draggerboard cat vs Lagoon. This is based on many races so pretty realistic. Here is a list of more talked about boats:

[django37]

Multi2000 is another Texel variation used only in Finland and France. I have owned 6 daggerbord cruising cats and think the Aussies know more about this.

[arsenelupiga]

You are probably right.

But cetrainly draggerboards have visual appeal that is why so popular.

[44'cruisingcat]

Originally Posted by django37

Queensland Multihulls OMR says that a boat with daggerboards is 0.5% (not 5%) faster than one with fixed keels, the Texel rule says between 1 and 2.5% depending of depth of keel compared to waterline length!

Must be tough racing a minikeel boat under those ratings!

[BigBeakie]

Originally Posted by arsenelupiga

You are probably right.

But cetrainly draggerboards have visual appeal that is why so popular.

Yep, they sure look good and that certainlyust be why multihull designers use daggerboards on performance boats, because of the eye candy factor. And no doubt that's why owners go for them too. Yep, sure thing.

[arsenelupiga]

Lagoon see this design idea for new L 420 S2

Leave boat as is, except add fake draggerboard like extension to be used instead of whisker pole. It will look cool and improve performance when reaching/downwind! If monos around the world race have it, why not lagoon ?!