Excess 14 new design

[arsenelupiga]

Originally Posted by Giova

Thanks mgholt,
Nice to finally hear some hands on feedback.
Could you elaborate on the performance figures you provided?

Something like sea state (I take perfect conditions considering the response), but also details on TWA, Heading, Leeway ...

Also, what about visibility and hulls noise while cruising?

Thank you

there is very little or no leeway in smooth waters, that is suburban legend. Leeway is issue only when you have surface current in strong winds and when you let hulls to slam. In this case daggers truly help. Even extra 0.5 VMG upwind makes large difference after you consider 1.5kn current against you, which is quite common. My now famous test in 10 kn true in no currnet conditions produced less than 2 degrees leeway and true upwind VMG 3 kn and tacking angle of around 88 degrees. Lagoon 400.

[Chrisatlantic]

[3cdad]

Originally Posted by mqholt

To cover a fair amount of misinformation in this thread, let me add my 2¢. I have been on Excess 14 hull #1 a number of times, including on a three hour test sail where I was at the helm for 1.5 hours. (As full disclosure, based on seeing the boat and sailing it, my wife and I placed an order.)

The boat sails incredibly well. Where it really outperforms some other cats in its size is in light wind. In 6 knots of wind, it happily went 4 knots upwind. In 8 knots of wind it went 7 knots at 90° wind angle. We never had winds over 12 or 13 knots, but at 12 knots it sailed 8.5 knots at 120° wind angle. And it is a joy to sail.

It was specifically designed to be fun to sail, and it really is. With two aft helms, right over the rudders, and dyneema mechanical steeering, it is extremely responsive, and the helmsperson is very close to the water with excellent visibilty all around. This plus a generous sail area/weight ratio makes for very good performance. The boat I was on was fully equipped for cruising, and even had a generator and AC.

As far as the asymmetric hull shape goes, its biggest advantage is reducing interference drag. A great amount of testing was done. For those interested, read the article in No Frills Sailing: https://no-frills-sailing.com/vplp-a...lls-excess-14/ . The Excess team is very happy with the hull shape. I have attached tow phones of how it was displayed a few days ago at the Miami Boat Show, with bow facing forwards.

The Excess 14 has been very positively reviewed in a number of sailing mags: Sailing today Dec. 2022; Yachting World Feb. 2023; Multihulls World April/May 2023. I have attached the specs printed in Multihulls World, as well as an info table on what they think the competition is.

As far as the Excess/Lagoon discussion goes, the first two Excess models, the 12 and the 15, were built on Lagoon hulls. These two models will be discontinued. The two newer models, the 11 and the 14, are original desings by Excess, and use no Lagoon elements at all.

Apart from Performance, my wife and I found the Excess 14 to be extremely comfortable to be a live-aboard. It is roomy with wonderful light in the saloon. We chose the three cabin owner's version, but it is really a 3 1/2 cabin boat--the forward section of the owner's hull is a storage/work area that has two coonvertible single berths.

If anyone has any questions about the boat, just let me know.

The question I would have when doing a test sail with a dealer or a mfg rep is "How is the boat weighted now vs how will it be weighted with typical options and with gear, etc...?" Weight will have a big impact on sailing performance of a cat.

[Mpetri]

Hi everyone. I was on an Excess14 last Saturday afternoon, for a short time trial. Excellent quality sails (lamintao for the mainsail and twaron black for the code 0; the self-tacking jib was less sophisticated). Excellent speeds about 85% of the TWS with quite varied gaits: from 75° to 120° of TWA. With 7.8 real knots at 99° du TWA we were traveling at 6.54 SOG. All with a cat with air conditioning, water maker, etc...etc... and incredible spaces both in the dinette and on the side hulls. If I could I would buy it immediately.

[Tupaia]

Originally Posted by Mpetri

Hi everyone. I was on an Excess14 last Saturday afternoon, for a short time trial. Excellent quality sails (lamintao for the mainsail and twaron black for the code 0; the self-tacking jib was less sophisticated). Excellent speeds about 85% of the TWS with quite varied gaits: from 75° to 120° of TWA. With 7.8 real knots at 99° du TWA we were traveling at 6.54 SOG. All with a cat with air conditioning, water maker, etc...etc... and incredible spaces both in the dinette and on the side hulls. If I could I would buy it immediately.

This "sounds" good and you obviously had fun, BUT.

Was there a current?

Speed through the water?

Corresponding apparent wind data?

How was the boat loaded?

What sails were flying?

Short test sails in very mild conditions with only limited data are a poor indicator of overall performance. If conditions don't allow you to reach and maintain double digit speeds at some point then you really have no idea about how well or badly a cat sails. Test it again in 18-20knots and then again in 25-30knots.

[Mpetri]

Sorry but most of your requests are included in my post
Anyway:
- No current (we make more legs in opposite direction and the speed was very nearly the same) almost appreciable.

- Speed I have reported is SOG (=GPS); by the way, I believe only to this!! the speed on the water - by paddle wheels sensor for me is useful ONLY in a race, to better understand the acceleration/decell., not the absolute speed!)
- The apparent wind was (I don't remember well but I have a video) about 9,5 knots (true wind about 7.8 knots)
- The boat was really full loaded (12 people on board / buffet and food / and the water/gasolin tanks nearly to full - by display... I don't know if there was a generator and aricond...
- About the sail, as i have already written: mainsail really super (laminate), code-0 really super (twaron black), self tacking jib I don't know...but good I suppose.

I am agreed with you: this is not a real test sailing
As I write so many times, I can say to have understood really my boats only 1 year after having using them not before, but for what may give us, the trial was that: I was really impressed for the performance.

[MountainKing]

Even the earlier Excess models with Lagoon hulls should sail somewhat better than their Lagoon brethren due to the much lower boom and lower center of effort, giving them the ability to carry a larger sail plan too.

[Giova]

Had a 90 minutes trial on the Xcs 14.

Now, I must say that I have never been in love with the Lagoon and similar, so despite the fact that it is a new design, it still looked to me extremely bulky and not what I expect to be a "sporty" cat. So, went to the trial with no much expectations.

The trial was in super flat sea, 5 to 6 kn of TWS, 11 people on board. I am sure that the weight was stripped down to the minimum. The result has been a 3.8kn of Boat Speed in 5 knots with Code0 (Pulse Line version) with AWA=50 degrees. We also tried the overlapping Genoa (110% ?) and tacked with ease despite being in only 6kn TWS (no way to find out the possible leeway, Garmin plotter I am not familiar with and the captain seemed to know less then I do in terms of plotter).

All in all I was pretty impressed. The helms position in nice weather is superb especially for the feeling you get at the helm, with true direct steering sensations.

Inside, IKEA style but no creaking (brand new boat by the way) and nice space.

So, despite my initial skepticism, I came out of the trial considering the cat a possible candidate for living aboard. I know that there will be all possible comments about perfect conditions, 90 minutes is not enough time to have an opinion ... sure before buying anything I will spend at least two weeks (hopefully) in all kind of conditions, but let me say the cat made me a good impression, till .... till, on the brochure they gave me I found this ( I hope I will translate it into a decent English):

" ... Hull made of sandwich with low density BALSA structure ... Bulkheads in laminated plywood with infused PET foam and carbon reinforcements"

Hold on, didn't they say that they got rid of Balsa and plywood?

I leave it to the experts to comment on the construction materials.

Waiting for the feedback

Gio

[Damir36]

I only looked at an Excess 12 in the Netherlands last year, 2 years old but was the ship that was displayed at the boatshows, so nearly new. Nice ship but im my opinion they are only build for the charter market. Very big cabins, very bright with big windows, build quality a bit like Ikea, but the most Important point for me was that there was no storage space because the cabins and the heads are so big. My Girlfriend asked me where I would put my tools and I looked around and tried to imagine where to put all the things you need if you spend some month on the ship.

So for Weekends or Holidays OK, but as a liveaboard not suitable. Is the 14 so much bigger than the 12?

...oh and it had that terrible cabrioroof that you could retract. And how do you get your sailbag closed or work on the sails/boom?

[donradcliffe]

I really feel sorry for those who are shopping for a new 42-44 ft cat. There is entirely too much money chasing this market, and I suspect most of them are first time sailors who don't know what to look for. I wouldn't trust a glossy magazine's test sail articles, because these are whores who know that their John's are virgins.

The sheet comparing the Excess's competition is telling. Every one of these boats weighs more than a comparable size mono, and the mono has at least 10,000 pounds of lead ballast. That Ikea pressboard furniture is heavy stuff, and beware the square corners. These boats will all sink.

I looked at the Excess video and pictures. Does the saloon really have wide open spaces with no handholds? Would you expect the liferaft to still be there when you need it? Do you really expect the davits to hold a dinghy at sea? Have you looked at the square sterns underway to see if there are little waves of pure drag following them? What happens when the vertical forward windows are hit by a breaking wave? What happens when a following wave takes out those huge doors and swamps the saloon?

I think there is a need for an unbiased panel of experienced multihull sailors to compare and review these boats. Something like Practical Sailor.