Frenchman sets record of circumnavigation in 49 days? How is this possible?

[yeloya]

Originally Posted by valhalla360

By heading as far south as possible, they actually cut the length of the journey down. Taken to the extreme, let's assume the north pole melts, would a quick 50' radius around the north pole in less than a minute count as a circumnavigation simply because they passed thru every meridian?

No this would not count as a circumnavigation.. You need to pass every meridian + cross the equator twice.

To cheat this rule, I remember a boat that turned around south pole than head north , passed the equator by couple of miles, then turned back again south hence passing the equator twice..

The so called flipper route that this guy did is a real circumnavigation for me .
The biggest challenge is to deal with sail combination changes (sometimes reported to be 4-5 times a day because of changing direction and strength of the wind) on yr own..

Cheers

Yeloya

[Just Another Sa]

Originally Posted by Polux

The average speed was a bit over 24K and it was not only a record but a very meaningful one even if compared with the absolute record that belongs to Peyron on a 40m trimaran with a 13 crew.

It depends how you calculate the average speed:
https://www.sailspeedrecords.com/offshore
Around the World Eastabout 21760nm
"Groupama 3" Franck Cammas FRA Mar 10 48d 7h 44m 52s
"Banque Populaire 5" Loick Peyron FRA Jan 12 45d 13h 42m 53s

The average speed of the latter along the course is 21760 nm / 1093.7147 h =19.895 knots.


On the other hand
https://www.sailspeedrecords.com/rou...world-non-stop
lists the average speed of the very same records as 19.75 knots which would require the distance used in the calculation to be 21600 nm, while the actual equatorial circumference of the earth is 40 075.017 km or 21 638.778 nm according to https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Earth


Of course the real distance sailed is longer for all records.
Tableau de bord - Sodebo - Tour Du Monde 2016
lists the sailed distance as 28400 nm for the new SOLO record with time 1179.127 h giving the average speed you wrote: 24.0856 knots.

But still https://www.sailspeedrecords.com is the official one.

[Just Another Sa]

Originally Posted by yeloya

No this would not count as a circumnavigation.. You need to pass every meridian + cross the equator twice.

The biggest challenge is to deal with sail combination changes (sometimes reported to be 4-5 times a day because of changing direction and strength of the wind) on yr own..

Cheers

Yeloya

I think the biggest challenge is controlling sleeping patterns and avoiding hitting anything hard.

As for the rules and course definitions, see: https://www.sailspeedrecords.com/the-courses-offshore

a. RTW - Round the World, eastbound and westbound 21600NM. 2 separate records.
To sail around the World, a vessel must start from and return to the same point, must cross all meridians of longitude and must cross the Equator. It may cross some but not all meridians more than once (i.e. two roundings of Antarctica do not count). The shortest orthodromic track of the vessel must be at least 21,600 nautical miles in length calculated based on a 'perfect sphere'. In calculating this distance, it is to be assumed that the vessel will sail around Antarctica in latitude 63 degrees south.
A vessel starting from any point where the direct orthodromic distance is too short shall pass one single island or other fixed point on a required side so as to lengthen his orthodromic track to the minimum distance.
No starting point will be permitted more south than 45 ° south.
1 degree of longitude at 63 degrees south will be taken as 27.24NM

I can't see any requirement to cross equator twice, but then how could you meet all those requirements without crossing twice? Can't figure any way to do that either.
This: "start from and return to the same point" is the tricky part, how accurately is that required to be done? It seems they mostly just use a starting and finishing line between France and GB, instead of same exact points.

[UNCIVILIZED]

Originally Posted by Just Another Sa

I think the biggest challenge is controlling sleeping patterns and avoiding hitting anything hard.

I don't know if it's allowed under the rules of this race. But for some of them, like Dame Ellen's solo RTW attempt (record) on Castorama/B&Q. They had her wired up to more biometric sensors than most astronauts. So that they could moniter her physical, & psychological condition, & tell her when to go down for a nap, etc. Though at times such just wasn't an option due to real world circumstances. But the crews/skippers get a good deal of sleep testing, & training as well, prior to events like this.

[sparau]

Apparently the shore team were studying satellite images and routing around icebergs to get as far south as safely (*cough*) possible.

Just an awesome feat of endurance and skill.

[UNCIVILIZED]

Several months ago, when Commanche set the trans atlantic record, a few folks asked when we would see boats consistently sailing at 35-40kts+. And somewhat in jest I stated that as soon as the teams could afford their own spy satellites so as to aid them in collision avoidance at speed, along with weather routing, then the boats likely could do it. Assuming that the crews can withstand the motion of the boat's for long enough...
The comment on satellites being more fact than fiction. Especially considering the consequences of hitting anything bigger than a tennis ball at 45kts. Even if it's "just a wave" ahead of them.

[805gregg]

Check out Vendee Around the world race going on now, single handed 60' mono hulls going over 25knts.

[Polux]

Originally Posted by Just Another Sa

It depends how you calculate the average speed:
https://www.sailspeedrecords.com/offshore
Around the World Eastabout 21760nm
"Groupama 3" Franck Cammas FRA Mar 10 48d 7h 44m 52s
"Banque Populaire 5" Loick Peyron FRA Jan 12 45d 13h 42m 53s

The average speed of the latter along the course is 21760 nm / 1093.7147 h =19.895 knots.


On the other hand
https://www.sailspeedrecords.com/rou...world-non-stop
lists the average speed of the very same records as 19.75 knots which would require the distance used in the calculation to be 21600 nm, while the actual equatorial circumference of the earth is 40 075.017 km or 21 638.778 nm according to https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Earth


Of course the real distance sailed is longer for all records.
Tableau de bord - Sodebo - Tour Du Monde 2016
lists the sailed distance as 28400 nm for the new SOLO record with time 1179.127 h giving the average speed you wrote: 24.0856 knots.

But still https://www.sailspeedrecords.com is the official one.

Yes , you are right and the average speeds considered should be the ones regarding the distance needed to circumnavigate according the rules and not any other and therefore the 19.6k average speed for the absolute sail record and for the solo record an average of 18.5K, are the average speeds that count.

[Polux]

Originally Posted by 805gregg

Check out Vendee Around the world race going on now, single handed 60' mono hulls going over 25knts.

And the most impressive thing is that they do that under autopilot (95% of the time). Sailors are there mostly to do the routing, adjust the sails to the conditions and to respond when something goes wrong (and that's plenty of times).

The improvements that these particular sailboats have brought to the cruising sailboats in recent years are simply huge, from the hull design to sail/rig design to autopilots.

[barnakiel]

Originally Posted by 805gregg

Check out Vendee Around the world race going on now, single handed 60' mono hulls going over 25knts.

Yep. In blasts. But the leader is averaging what? About 15 maybe, I think.

Cheers,
b.

[SV DestinyAscen]

Originally Posted by valhalla360

It's still shorter and still very artificial, as down in the 40-50's, winds are drastically higher than along practical circumnavigation routes allowing for much higher average speeds.


The run up and down the Atlantic may get it to "approximate" a circumnavigation but that's like saying I drove 25,000 miles last year commuting to work, so I circumnavigated the earth last year.

The ones "recognizing" it have a bias towards new records. If every year or two, they get a lower record they get hype for their business. If there are no records set for a decade or more, it's hard to drum up interest.

How is it shorter? Circumference of the globe is about 25,000 miles at the equator. Circumference of the globe at 45 degrees south is about 18,000 miles. Estimate each way down the Atlantic is about 5,000 miles - which they do twice over.

You're talking about the classic non-stop circumnavigation route like it is a new thing that people made up. You do realize this has been understood as the "standard" route based on the Clipper route from the 1870s right?

All the records have used the same route. You're pretending like prior records went south, then north, weaved through the equator, dealt with the Malacca strait or Coral Sea, somehow crossed the Pacific at the equator, then south along Chilean coast and then north again?

Then complaining about the high winds as if it is an unfair advantage - no one is saying your quick cruiser circumnavigation is **** because season and tradewinds mean you can only do it in 15 months with the Panama canal - but this is just an absurd pedantic argument that the circular route doesn't count in your grand opinion because all the solo circumnavigating sailors follow this route. It isn't novel or new.

[Polux]

Originally Posted by sparau

...
Just an awesome feat of endurance and skill.

Coville is not a great writer neither I believe he had much time for writing but on the blog he told about one time he had "some" difficulties. The big geenaker touched the water when he was changing sails and was immediately pulled on the water by the boat big speed.

He tells how hard it was pulling it back on board soaked in water not far to 0º temperature. I guess we can all imagine how hard that was

[barnakiel]

Originally Posted by valhalla360

While very fast, it could be argued if it is truly a "circumnavigation". A true circumnavigation should pass thru two antipodal points (exact opposite sides of the world).

(...)

Negative, Sir!

Or do you want to say Maghellanes faked his ;-)

Setting off from California and ending up in Florida is a circumnavigation too. As is setting off from Rio sailing Eastwards and ending up in Chile. Basically cross the three oceans and end up on the same continent. Coming back to the same spot is nice but just an optional extra. Crossing the equator (twice?) is not required either. Nor is crossing all meridians.

The plain language for circumnavigation is sailing around the world. Just that. The optional extras are always added by those who want to tell me their dick is bigger than mine, much as we know they are all about the same length, when you consider the vastness of the universe.

I think the track accepted for records says nothing about the antipodes.

Cheers,
b.

[barnakiel]

Originally Posted by yeloya

No this would not count as a circumnavigation.

(...)

Yes. It could.

Do not get hung up on definitions created by others, for specific purposes.

One thing is beating records and playing along the rules set by the organization that certifies them. Another matter is circumnavigating.

Circumnavigation is simply sailing round the world.

We are beginning to be nearly religious here. Suddenly there is a bible where all the definitions are set in stone and some sort of sailing popes have an absolute power to tell the dark crowds what is good and bad and whom to stone. ;-)

C'mon. Circumnavigate more, trust authorities less.

b.

[Polux]

Originally Posted by barnakiel

Yep. In blasts. But the leader is averaging what? About 15 maybe, I think.

Cheers,
b.

That is a 60ft monohull versus a 102ft multihull.

After several capsizes they stopped using on the Austral seas 60ft multihulls for racing or record breaking and a circumnavigation like the Vendee globe done with 60ft trimarans would be deadly dangerous. That is why they never attempted it when they had the ORMA class trimarans (60ft).

Regarding monohulls that's also why there is not a 40ft class on the Vendee Globe: too dangerous. There was however a circumnavigation with 40 ft class racers but one with several stops, a bit like the Volvo but solo. I am not sure if that is not also too dangerous if raced, as it was on the Austral sea.

However there is a solo circumnavigation record for 40ft sailboats or smaller. It did not attract any of the top sailors on the 40 class, I guess they also find it too dangerous and would be absolutely crazy to try that on a 40ft racing multihull.

The record belongs to a Chinese, Guo Chuan (2013) that made it in 147days and 20 hours on a 40class racer. Recently Guo Chan disappeared at sea while he was trying to beat another record, this time on a trimaran, the transpacific solo sailing record. They found the boat, not the man.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S37ea5lhXWA