Lagoon 42 vs everything else

[sgl]

Hi, long time lurker, first time poster. After 6 years of planning, wife and I are about to jump into the sailing life in spring 2022. In order to save for our goal, our catamaran sailing experience has been limited to 3 days on a Lagoon 42 for our ASA 114 certification. We're planning on going to Annapolis this fall to finally look at boats with our own eyes instead of pics on the internet (we live in AZ so no easy access to marinas).

Our plan is to spend 1 or 2 years in the Caribbean's, getting some experience, and if things go well we'll go to French Polynesia.

Our budget is $ 350K to $ 450K, for a 39 to 42 foot cat, hopefully owners' version, less than 5 years old. Looking at Leopard 40, FP Lucia 40, Nautitech Open 40 and Lagoon 42, the latter seems hard to beat - inventory is good, and price wise it seems to offer the most bang for our buck - lots of space, we liked sailing it, interior is a bit bland but overall it definitely fist the bill. I've even found owner's versions close to $ 450K.

What's the consensus on this boat? I know it's on the heavy side, not the best sailing boat, but considering we'll spend over 90% of our time at anchor and will pretty much only sail down the trade winds, we're willing to sacrifice some sailing ability for comfort.

[Sand crab]

A Seawind 1250 is worth a look. I think some 1260s will be in your price range by then. You can save some bucks by looking at the older Leopard 40, 42, 43 etc as well as some of the older boats by just about everyone.

[Tin Tin]

Best boats for Caribbean and Tahiti for that budget and predominantly downhill sailing - Lagoon 440 fly bridge with biggest spinnaker that will fit.

[sgl]

Thanks for feedback! I like the Seawinds, just not sure about the galley located in the hull.

Is there much of a difference between the Lagoon 440 and 450? I've seen a lot of 450s in that price range, too.

[Factor]

Originally Posted by sgl

Thanks for feedback! I like the Seawinds, just not sure about the galley located in the hull.

Is there much of a difference between the Lagoon 440 and 450? I've seen a lot of 450s in that price range, too.

Have a read of this:

[Knot Safety]

Look at a Lagoon 400. Many say it is the perfect couples cruising catamaran

[ozsailer]

Gday SGL. Best advise I can give is sit down with you wife and work out what you both want in a boat. IE what are you plans, blue water or coastal cruising, galley up, galley down (purely personal choice). Protectioin from weather, helm position and storage (so so important)
We have owned a older model Lagoon 410 and at the time it suited our budget and our needs. We have moved up to a Lagoon 440, once again it suites us perfectly BUT is it the perfect catamaran - no, are there better cats out there, yes, but as stated it fitted our budget and all our needs and we are super happy with her.
Go to boat shows, compare cats side by side and keep asking questions



Ozsailer
L440.

[jbinbi]

a. Look at your timeframe to buy. i say this because there is very little inventory of cats on the market. New cats have 1 to 3 year wait list. Very few L42 owner models on the market. This might change after lockdowns/vaccinations get done, but not this summer. 350 will NOT get you a L42. 450 might get you a used charter one.

b. Because of a. above, prices of used are very high. I sold my 2015 380 last summer for same as my original purchase price. I had hoped for a seawind, new seawinds are delivered in 23/24! Good friend sold his 2016 Lagoon 42 owners for same price as purchase. 500k. 1100 hrs on engines. BTW, I sailed this boat a bunch, and in light air it requires the screecher to move. Or motor. Very comfortable for 2, great boat if spending 90% time at anchor. I think in the carrib with steady 15+, L42 sails well with self tacking jib until you are on deep reach.

c. I also looked at FP lucia 40. The boat is the same size as L380 length and beam, much more freeboard, but with newer design and much more room inside. Comes with a bit of a sailing sacrifice. Not as roomy as L42, but would be easier to handle with 1 person. As an example, docklines on L42 are a size up from 40' boat. Every time you need to coil them, more work, makes you more tired at the end of the day. These little things add up.

d. Personally, I really like the seawinds. I think they are now the best performing CRUISING cats available. The galley down is not really as much as an issue as people think, and the amount of space in the salon/cockpit, especially in warmer weather is just fantastic. Oh, did I mention how well they sail? I like a self tacking jib, but on the seawind, SA/D numbers are much better than Lagoon/FP, so you don't need the screecher in 10 kts.

I agree L400 is a great boat.

Just my 2 cents from spending quite a bit of time on Lagoon/FP/Seawind.

[sgl]

Originally Posted by jbinbi

a. Look at your timeframe to buy. i say this because there is very little inventory of cats on the market. New cats have 1 to 3 year wait list. Very few L42 owner models on the market. This might change after lockdowns/vaccinations get done, but not this summer. 350 will NOT get you a L42. 450 might get you a used charter one.

b. Because of a. above, prices of used are very high. I sold my 2015 380 last summer for same as my original purchase price. I had hoped for a seawind, new seawinds are delivered in 23/24! Good friend sold his 2016 Lagoon 42 owners for same price as purchase. 500k. 1100 hrs on engines. BTW, I sailed this boat a bunch, and in light air it requires the screecher to move. Or motor. Very comfortable for 2, great boat if spending 90% time at anchor. I think in the carrib with steady 15+, L42 sails well with self tacking jib until you are on deep reach.

c. I also looked at FP lucia 40. The boat is the same size as L380 length and beam, much more freeboard, but with newer design and much more room inside. Comes with a bit of a sailing sacrifice. Not as roomy as L42, but would be easier to handle with 1 person. As an example, docklines on L42 are a size up from 40' boat. Every time you need to coil them, more work, makes you more tired at the end of the day. These little things add up.

d. Personally, I really like the seawinds. I think they are now the best performing CRUISING cats available. The galley down is not really as much as an issue as people think, and the amount of space in the salon/cockpit, especially in warmer weather is just fantastic. Oh, did I mention how well they sail? I like a self tacking jib, but on the seawind, SA/D numbers are much better than Lagoon/FP, so you don't need the screecher in 10 kts.

I agree L400 is a great boat.

Just my 2 cents from spending quite a bit of time on Lagoon/FP/Seawind.

Great feedback, thank you. We've accepted the fact that we'll probably need to spend the full $ 450K to get a boat we really like. I've seen a couple L42s owners version going for $ 480K, so not too far off. But as you said, I'm wondering if it's just too much boat for us. When we tried it we had 5 people on board for 3 days and it was VERY comfortable. We probably don't need that much space for just 2 people most of the time.

After reading these comments I looked at the Seawind 1260, that open area with the trifold door up looks fantastic, and everyone is raving about build quality and sailing ability. We're adding it to our list of candidates for sure.

I'm really hoping that the market gets a bit easier for buyers, looking into buying used just before 2022 hurricane season in the Caribbean, or since we'll be spending time with family in the EU this winter, if we find the perfect boat there, maybe that's where we'll start our adventures. Sucks that the Euro jumped up 10% during COVID though.

[Simon.Sails]

Can only agree that right now used prices are pretty crazy, there's just so little on the market and prices are inflated vs. new. Have you had a look at the Aventura catamarans? It's a smaller, new builder but they've done contract work for big boat brands for years before that. I really like the upcoming 37, but the 44 is worth a look as well. Much better S/D ratio than Lagoons but still very liveable and great price!

[Phyrcooler]

Originally Posted by jbinbi

d. Personally, I really like the seawinds. I think they are now the best performing CRUISING cats available. The galley down is not really as much as an issue as people think, and the amount of space in the salon/cockpit, especially in warmer weather is just fantastic. Oh, did I mention how well they sail? I like a self tacking jib, but on the seawind, SA/D numbers are much better than Lagoon/FP, so you don't need the screecher in 10 kts.

I agree L400 is a great boat.

Just my 2 cents from spending quite a bit of time on Lagoon/FP/Seawind.

I really really want to like the Seawinds... but just can’t get past some of the design “features” I really don’t like. Reputation as great sailing boats. Awesome value for the dollar. But hate the helm locations. Looking through the cabin or hanging around the side . Can’t convince me that looking THROUGH the cockpit, between mullions is anywhere near as pleasant as an unobstructed 360° view over the cabin top. And night time with wet windows from rain or spray?! Just nope! Dual helms are an unnecessary addition of complication and more parts on a cruising boat. Give me a single raised helm - like the Anteres with a real windscreen and wipers. Or a compromise like the Balance.

Yes - that’s a huge linear galley. And the cook is stuck down there while the rest of the party is in the cockpit? No thanks... I’ll settle on a slightly smaller “up” galley. Redesign the cockpit while you’re moving the helm to a good location... and get rid of that fiddly tri-fold, winch-it-open patio door. You’ll have my perfect boat.

I think that folks convince themselves that “it isn’t so bad” when they want to overlook a feature - especially when they’ve decided the other features are what they want. I bet if they sat down with prospective buyers and a clean sheet and offered them the option of dual helms vs a better protected helm such as Anteres or Balance... the twin helms would be outvoted by a wide margin. But... to each their own.

[Simon.Sails]

Originally Posted by Phyrcooler

I really really want to like the Seawinds... but just can’t get past some of the design “features” I really don’t like. Reputation as great sailing boats. Awesome value for the dollar. But hate the helm locations. Looking through the cabin or hanging around the side . Can’t convince me that looking THROUGH the cockpit, between mullions is anywhere near as pleasant as an unobstructed 360° view over the cabin top. And night time with wet windows from rain or spray?! Just nope! Dual helms are an unnecessary addition of complication and more parts on a cruising boat. Give me a single raised helm - like the Anteres with a real windscreen and wipers. Or a compromise like the Balance.

Yes - that’s a huge linear galley. And the cook is stuck down there while the rest of the party is in the cockpit? No thanks... I’ll settle on a slightly smaller “up” galley. Redesign the cockpit while you’re moving the helm to a good location... and get rid of that fiddly tri-fold, winch-it-open patio door. You’ll have my perfect boat.

I think that folks convince themselves that “it isn’t so bad” when they want to overlook a feature - especially when they’ve decided the other features are what they want. I bet if they sat down with prospective buyers and a clean sheet and offered them the option of dual helms vs a better protected helm such as Anteres or Balance... the twin helms would be outvoted by a wide margin. But... to each their own.

Agreed, I want to like the Seawinds but don't really like their layout and cockpits. A large outside table is just such a nice feature in warmer climates and Seawinds waste too much space with that back bench and grills.

[Alistair242]

With the trifold doors and large opening ports your salon table is really as good as a cockpit table. No need for two smallish dining areas. You have one inside that is bigger than any on other cats up to around 48 odd feet as well as a smaller area on the transom.
The cockpit layout is what attracted me to the Seawind, along with the performance and build quality. Each to their own of course but its unwise to judge the layout before spending time on board a boat.

[jbinbi]

Having sailed quite a bit on the seawind, coming from my lagoon, i was very hesitant about no cockpit table and no galley up.

Usually you just bring up the food that you are going to eat. Yes, a PITA to have to go down 3 stairs to get another bottle of beer from the fridge. But not too terrible. There are 2 HUGE hatches the open in the front and the trifold door opens to cockpit so it is like one massive area.

Regarding the helms, never get wet, you are protected from the top and side. We are in FL, so we always take the inner window out. Newer large models it slides down like a car window.

Depends on how you sail for the sailing part. If you daysail for fun, having 2 helms is great. If you are on a longer passage, AP is on anyway, so not really important.

I was unaware of Aventura. Looks interesting. I will start a separate thread (if one already not going) rather than taking this OT.

[CatNewBee]

Lagoons are great for price, performance and space, the 42 is really a nice cat for a couple. We have the slightly smaller 400S2, absolutely sufficient for ocean crossings. We crossed the Atlantic recently and enjoyed it a lot.