Older, Quality Cats

[cupofjoe]

I know that newer cats, especially newer lagoons and fontaine peugeots, get a lot of hate for being horribly built boats that can barely sail, so I've been looking at cats from the 1990s which seem to be more solidly built. My requirements are a liveaboard catamaran built to handle passage making with good bridgedeck clearance.

The Lagoon 42 TPI looks really interesting to me, as does the Privilege 39. Anyone know of some other older cats makes that might be worth considering and discussing?

ps: no Prouts

[Tupaia]

Some of the older FP's were nicely built Venezia 42 was a follow up to the Marquises 56 FP's flagship at the time or Bahia 46 (a bit later) but IMO probably their best all round boat.


The Lagoon 42 TPI has stood the test of time and is a really good buy performing well if not better than the current offerings along with Pro Kennex 44 and 38 that were also using innovative technology for the period.

[HeywoodJ]

Danson Outremers. Built like a brick $$# but still relatively light and performance oriented. Watch out for unsealed wood in bulkheads and beams, delaminated tabbing on the bridgedeck stiffeners. Not going to give you the condo-feel, but very well suited to passagemaking.

[SV_FlyingTigress]

I have a privilege 39 , they are great. The 435s are better

[Snowgoose35]

I know you said no Prout's but maybe look at the Quasar 50 -unlike all other Prout's but solidly built, fine hulls so very quick, forward stepped mast so big main, lots of room and low windage.

[neilpride]

Voyage 44 , i know some older Catanas are really well built.

Outremer to.

[singlespeed]

The TPI's are great strongly built boats. They aren't fast and their windward ability is hampered by the full length bulky keels, but it will get you there. The steering station is ideal, with more than adequate protection under the bimini. The boom isn't ridiculously high, making maintenance underway easy. The self tending jib is a real plus when short tacking up a channel or when sailing solo. Those huge rudders make tacking a breeze. I have never had to back wind or use the motors to make a tack. Put on a rigid vang and you can eliminate most of your potential problems getting the main up. Keep the anchor chain locker open while raising the anchor; the locker is shallow so the chain will pile up right under the windlass. Make yourself hook to move the chain out from under the windlass as you raise the anchor. If the boat still has fixed props, change them out to Kiwi Props feathering prop. The boat will back up in a straight line and changing a damaged blade can be done with snorkel gear.

[Wilyum]

Im glad you added no Prouts, lets keep their value down so I can pick one up cheap when the time comes to sail around the world.

[chris mac]

Originally Posted by singlespeed

The TPI's are great strongly built boats. They aren't fast and their windward ability is hampered by the full length bulky keels, but it will get you there. The steering station is ideal, with more than adequate protection under the bimini. The boom isn't ridiculously high, making maintenance underway easy. The self tending jib is a real plus when short tacking up a channel or when sailing solo. Those huge rudders make tacking a breeze. I have never had to back wind or use the motors to make a tack. Put on a rigid vang and you can eliminate most of your potential problems getting the main up. Keep the anchor chain locker open while raising the anchor; the locker is shallow so the chain will pile up right under the windlass. Make yourself hook to move the chain out from under the windlass as you raise the anchor. If the boat still has fixed props, change them out to Kiwi Props feathering prop. The boat will back up in a straight line and changing a damaged blade can be done with snorkel gear.

I agree with most everything you say here, except for the comment of "they aren't fast and their windward ability is hampered by the full length bulky keels"
Our 42 tpi matches pace or beats most other cats around us, short of performance built models. A big reason for that is the sa/d ratio.
The exception is downwind. With the small jib, it doesn't work well. A Spinnaker of some sort is a must .
We also typically outpoint even most cruising monohulls.
I'm curious why you have a different experience with that.
Everything else, I agree with. Great boats!

[cupofjoe]

Originally Posted by Snowgoose35

I know you said no Prout's but maybe look at the Quasar 50 -unlike all other Prout's but solidly built, fine hulls so very quick, forward stepped mast so big main, lots of room and low windage.

My concern is the bridgedeck clearance. I'm sure apart from that it's built fine but I am worried about excessive slamming basically.

Thanks for the suggestion!

[cupofjoe]

Originally Posted by singlespeed

The TPI's are great strongly built boats. They aren't fast and their windward ability is hampered by the full length bulky keels, but it will get you there. The steering station is ideal, with more than adequate protection under the bimini. The boom isn't ridiculously high, making maintenance underway easy. The self tending jib is a real plus when short tacking up a channel or when sailing solo. Those huge rudders make tacking a breeze. I have never had to back wind or use the motors to make a tack. Put on a rigid vang and you can eliminate most of your potential problems getting the main up. Keep the anchor chain locker open while raising the anchor; the locker is shallow so the chain will pile up right under the windlass. Make yourself hook to move the chain out from under the windlass as you raise the anchor. If the boat still has fixed props, change them out to Kiwi Props feathering prop. The boat will back up in a straight line and changing a damaged blade can be done with snorkel gear.

Thanks for the advice and comments! It's a shame there's so few TPIs out there

[Snowgoose35]

Originally Posted by cupofjoe

My concern is the bridgedeck clearance. I'm sure apart from that it's built fine but I am worried about excessive slamming basically.

Thanks for the suggestion!

Well in 5 years with mine I've not had any real slamming at all - now I will admit that I rebuilt mine very light so she sits 3 or 4 inches higher in the water but its also about the fine hulls and gap between - because the hulls are fine they had almost the ideal ratio

This means less slamming and good in to wind - we recently did Dunkirk to Dover (44 miles) in 4 hours from dockside to dockside , making an average of 12 -14 knots at 35-40 degrees to wind in about 15 knots true wind (24 apparent with our speed) and in the whole trip I can remember feeling a slam maybe twice - it was quite comfortable all the way which I had never had in to wind before.

[cupofjoe]

Originally Posted by Snowgoose35

Well in 5 years with mine I've not had any real slamming at all - now I will admit that I rebuilt mine very light so she sits 3 or 4 inches higher in the water but its also about the fine hulls and gap between - because the hulls are fine they had almost the ideal ratio

This means less slamming and good in to wind - we recently did Dunkirk to Dover (44 miles) in 4 hours from dockside to dockside , making an average of 12 -14 knots at 35-40 degrees to wind in about 15 knots true wind (24 apparent with our speed) and in the whole trip I can remember feeling a slam maybe twice - it was quite comfortable all the way which I had never had in to wind before.

Wow that's amazing! I will take your advice and add it to my list then, thank you!

[jerrypeters]

I sailed my TPI 42 on a circumnavigation and beyond - 35,000 NM. She pointed well and regularly returned 200 NM days. I would/did trust her with my life. Later I changed boats to a Lagoon 410. Nice boat but not one I would want to trust on a circumnavigation. (Currently sail a Voyage 480.)

[BVIbrian]

Antares