Performance 50-55' Cats: Outremer vs Catana vs Swiss Catamaran

[2Hulls]

Well, the title of the thread was, "Performance 50-55' Cats: Outremer vs Catana vs Swiss Catamaran" and he specified dagger boards. But not to belabor the point.....

Dave

[alansmith]

2 Hulls, I understand your point. But different strokes for different folks kind of thinking....Derek Kelsall pops in with his opinions...man that is a pearl amongst the pig slop as far as I am concerned. I happen to agree with his philosophy 100 percent. Wouldn't have gotten such a thing if he hadn't been asked his thoughts on the nacelle. That is why it gets rich sometimes and I don't mind the drift at all. So, imo it is okay to drift. What is not okay is when people get mean, evil, and attack others on threads.

[downunder]

Originally Posted by beiland

Surprise, surprise, a few days ago I was driving around some dock areas here in St Augustine when I ran across this big catamaran, "Cat's Meow". I had forgotten all about this innovative design by Derek Kelsall way back in 1988. Now that I think about it I believe it was this design combined with the Prouts and the Stilettos that likely peaked my interest in the 'central nacelle' subject.

I went to her website,...
Sail Trekker - The Catamaran
...and extracted a few photos.

The owners wife has invited me down for a personal inspection (as soon as our weather clears up a bit). I hope to talk with the owners about their personal experiences with their vessel. Should be interesting.

Perhaps Derek could add a few comments here?

Lock Crowther used a central Nacelle on some of his faster racing cats. Attached E Doc formerly with another name

[downunder]

Greg Young designed Earthling (57ft) uses an central nacelle.

Young Yacht Design

She has been based at Mackay Marina (Australia) for a couple of years now.

[monte]

Originally Posted by Imprezza72

I believe this thread has strayed from his question. Re-read his original post... Monte do you own or have owned a Nautitech open? I was following this thread for the same reasons the OP listed and while I have found some end user posts (Archer I believe thanks!) if there are more I am interested in their perspectives. As such this thread is becoming useless from my point of view, do what you will, I won't be following it anymore and while I am not sure, the OP he may have done so as well.

I was actually just clarifying the previous posters advice, but since you ask, yes I've actually owned several nautitech open 46s which is really quite amazing considering they're still in pre production stage.

[Red Herring]

Originally Posted by 2Hulls

Well, the original post had nothing to do with a Nautitech open.

Regardless, the OP hasn't posted again on this discussion nor any where else. I offered first hand info on post #9. It is frustrating to sincerely answer questions and not even get an acknowledgement. Oh well.

Dave

I'll acknowledge your post as a newbie learning all I can. This stuck in my head from your post "If it's snotty at one helm, often it's quite comfortable on the other -" and made me think... so thanks!

[BigBeakie]

Originally Posted by Red Herring

I'll acknowledge your post as a newbie learning all I can. This stuck in my head from your post "If it's snotty at one helm, often it's quite comfortable on the other -" and made me think... so thanks!

Did you think about which direction the breakers are coming from?

It is in breaking seas that the AP usually can't cope and then you have to hand steer, sometimes for long periods. Been there, done that, 2 days and nights worth.

IMO, protected helms can be more than just a comfort factor (sun, wind, rain), they can be a safety factor.

So unless you can see the breakers (from the lee helm!) forming so that you can steer around them as much as possible, retreating to the lee helm could prove to be unwise.

[Red Herring]

Originally Posted by BigBeakie

Did you think about which direction the breakers are coming from?

It is in breaking seas that the AP usually can't cope and then you have to hand steer, sometimes for long periods. Been there, done that, 2 days and nights worth.

IMO, protected helms can be more than just a comfort factor (sun, wind, rain), they can be a safety factor.

So unless you can see the breakers (from the lee helm!) forming so that you can steer around them as much as possible, retreating to the lee helm could prove to be unwise.

Making me think some more... good!

[2Hulls]

Originally Posted by BigBeakie

Did you think about which direction the breakers are coming from?

So unless you can see the breakers (from the lee helm!) forming so that you can steer around them as much as possible, retreating to the lee helm could prove to be unwise.

It is a wonder I ever get back alive.

So, Mr. BigBeakie, why couldn't you see 360 when helming my boat model, like everyone else can?

Dave

[colemj]

I thought your comment "if it is snotty on one helm, it's often quite comfortable on the other" was about relationships.

One of the true advantages of catamarans.

Didn't occur to me to think of weather conditions, although I suppose it applies there also…

Mark

[2Hulls]

Originally Posted by colemj

I thought your comment "if it is snotty on one helm, it's often quite comfortable on the other" was about relationships.

[beiland]

I always liked the idea of a helm on either side of the vessel, but located partially behind the deckhouse in such a manner than one could duck down as that stray wave/spray came onboard. Sort of like this 42' concept...
Deck_view - Boat Design Net GalleryLayout_view - Boat Design Net Gallery

This is a nice idea also:
http://www.swisscatamaran.com/wp-con...iterranee9.jpg

Or the third photo down on this page
RunningTideYachts, Ltd. Photo Album of Design References Page 2

Or maybe a little more centrally located like this:
RunningTideYachts, Ltd. Photo Album of Design References Page 6

Or like this:
RunningTideYachts, Ltd. Photo Album of Design References Page 17




Early on I liked the idea of a central helm that could be made to raise or lower for visibility.
...like this early drawing:
RunningTideYachts, Ltd. - Archives

which probably was influence by this Lock Crowther vessel design, one of my personal favorites of his:
RunningTideYachts, Ltd. Photo Album of Design References Page 9

[beiland]

I subsequently provided for boat a central helm and two side helms. The central helm became sort of a flying bridge type, but NOT the full-standing headroom ones seen most often today. I wanted a 'sitting-headroom' so the mainsail did not have to be SO FAR off the water.
RunningTideYachts, Ltd.

Or aft of the sailplan with a full-standing headroom flybridge:
DynaRig Perspective Sketch

DynaRig Sail Plan

[beiland]

This was a powercat I saw in Thailand, that I labeled 'picnic cat'. It had a nice little flybridge affair....not overwhelming

http://www.boatdesign.net/gallery/showphoto.php/photo/20820/size/big/cat/

Picnic/Weekender Cat in Thailand - Boat Design Net Gallery

[ejlindahl]

Breiland,

That swiss cat in post 72 has the best cockpit/helm/seating layout I've ever seen. Never paid any attention to them before. Thanks for bringing it up

The inside looks good enough too but a bit too ikea for me. I can live with that, though, if the overall layout functions as well as it looks in the photos. I wonder how many have been made. None listed on YW. Can't afford a new cat that big.