Performance of charter cats?

[SV Coronado]

Part of the problem is that you're not going to learn to sail any boat well after a few days of chartering. It takes time to learn how to sail any boat well. I can easily sail my Lagoon 450 in all types of wind conditions, but it took me some time to learn how to sail the boat well. Every boat owner has their tricks for getting the best performance out of their boat. These "tricks" are learned from sailing many miles.

The other issue is that it's a rental boat, the sails and rigging are shot and there's no additional sail plan. I also have a Code 0 and Parasailor, neither of which you're going to have on a charter boat.

[HuffinPuff]

Originally Posted by SV Coronado

Part of the problem is that you're not going to learn to sail any boat well after a few days of chartering. It takes time to learn how to sail any boat well. I can easily sail my Lagoon 450 in all types of wind conditions, but it took me some time to learn how to sail the boat well. Every boat owner has their tricks for getting the best performance out of their boat. These "tricks" are learned from sailing many miles.

The other issue is that it's a rental boat, the sails and rigging are shot and there's no additional sail plan. I also have a Code 0 and Parasailor, neither of which you're going to have on a charter boat.

yeppers

[lestersails]

Originally Posted by SV Coronado

(some stuff deleted)
The other issue is that it's a rental boat, the sails and rigging are shot and there's no additional sail plan. I also have a Code 0 and Parasailor, neither of which you're going to have on a charter boat.

Is it just me or are those bareboat charters mandatorily equipped with small, baggy sails? Always seems that they are way below what I would like.

[chubby]

Originally Posted by lestersails

Is it just me or are those bareboat charters mandatorily equipped with small, baggy sails? Always seems that they are way below what I would like.

if i had a my sailboat in charter

i'd want the sails as small, tough and durable..as possibke.



..no reason to put delicate(and expensive) light wind sails on charter boats.. they'll just get destroyed.

[caradow]

Originally Posted by chubby

if i had a my sailboat in charter

i'd want the sails as small, tough and durable..as possibke.



..no reason to put delicate(and expensive) light wind sails on charter boats.. they'll just get destroyed.

From what I have seen through the years so will the boat.

[aqfishing]

Leopard 40, 50 deg, 16kts, 7.5kts. Not great, but works for me. Without the space, comfort and non healing qualities we would not be at sea or own a boat! Happy Wife, Happy life!

Lots of chirps about charterers not sailing etc, well the main reason many do motor a lot is time! You do not have all day or week to get to where you are going. If you want to maximise your charter time you just motor or motor sail to where you want to be if the winds are unfavourable.

Happy Holidays!

[Bullshooter]

Originally Posted by aqfishing

Leopard 40, 50 deg, 16kts, 7.5kts. Not great, but works for me. Without the space, comfort and non healing qualities we would not be at sea or own a boat! Happy Wife, Happy life!

Lots of chirps about charterers not sailing etc, well the main reason many do motor a lot is time! You do not have all day or week to get to where you are going. If you want to maximise your charter time you just motor or motor sail to where you want to be if the winds are unfavourable.

Happy Holidays!

Come on, Aqfishing,

You're never going to learn to boost your own ego as a great sailor, until you join the others and disparage people you know nothing about...

But I concede the point that charterers as a group are likely to treat the boats about the way people care for rental cars.

[Mapoz]

I did a week in Grenada on a charter Leopard 45, and while it felt slow, we hit 9+ knots SOG in decent wind and choppy enough seas.
It was not bad at all, imo, and the passengers/crew could make sandwiches and sit and read while underway. Our companion monohulls didn’t seem to have any more speed, nor comfort. It didn’t give the heeled over thrill that a monohull seems to, but we moved along just fine.

[Simi 60]

Originally Posted by aqfishing

Leopard 40, 50 deg, 16kts, 7.5kts. Not great, but works for me. Without the space, comfort and non healing qualities we would not be at sea or own a boat! Happy Wife, Happy life!

Lots of chirps about charterers not sailing etc, well the main reason many do motor a lot is time! You do not have all day or week to get to where you are going. If you want to maximise your charter time you just motor or motor sail to where you want to be if the winds are unfavourable.

Happy Holidays!

Power boats
Perhaps you've heard of them

Hell of a lot more affordable than cats with masts that need to motor to make miles.

[Jweyndling]

Bali are generally known to be the worst performing of the production cats. My FP 44 would sail upwind at over 7 knots in 15 knots of wind and on a beam reach would would happily do 9 knots in flat water. Once hit 22 knots surfing down giant swells😂. I think that Leopards and Fountisn Pajot will generally be better sailing boats than Lagoons and Balis.

[joecai]

My wife and I chartered a Fountain Pajot Astrea 42 last week. It's our first catamaran charter. We are not experience sailors but did charter various monohulls for a few years and have no expectation of a performance from a chartered boat. However we were not expecting this. The boat could not steer under 4.5 knots. Pulled to the wind does not matter what you do. We thought the rudders was broken so we took the boat back to the marina for them to take a look. It sails about 5 knots in 15 knots of wind on the beam! So what this means is it's engine was on 99% of the time. It does has a genoa (maybe 120) and fairly large main. No matter after only 2 years in charter the engines already have 3700 hours on them. Even with the engines on the boat steered with a 10 seconds delay. The autopilot broke a while ago which is not surprising. We were told the Bali 4.2 docked next to our boat can be steered in 2 knots of speed.

We are wondering if all the "production" cats, with a reasonable price tag are similar in performance. Wife always wanted a cat to live on now has totally changed mind

[dcondit]

Originally Posted by joecai

My wife and I chartered a Fountain Pajot Astrea 42 last week.

We are wondering if all the "production" cats, with a reasonable price tag are similar in performance. Wife always wanted a cat to live on now has totally changed mind

I’ve sailed many of the production cats out there. I’m not sure what FP did with this model, but my experience on multiple trips is that the Astra 42 is about as bad as it gets for sailing performance. It tacks like a shipping container and is very difficult to keep up to speed. I’ve had no similar problems with the newer FP 40s, 45s and 47s.

[Chotu]

Originally Posted by dcondit

I’ve sailed many of the production cats out there. I’m not sure what FP did with this model, but my experience on multiple trips is that the Astra 42 is about as bad as it gets for sailing performance. It tacks like a shipping container and is very difficult to keep up to speed. I’ve had no similar problems with the newer FP 40s, 45s and 47s.

It tacks like a shipping container! Ha ha ha. Best description ever.

[HuffinPuff]

The biggest issue I see with Charterers is that they don't have time to learn the boat. After I purchased my Bali, I initially was not able to match the speed the captain did on my trial run, how ever after quite a bit of experimenting with different sail settings I was able to nearly match his speeds. Mind you my boat is fully loaded. The Bali sails well but setting the sail right makes a huge difference in boat speed. It is funny how one click on the jib track noticeably increases the speed in upwind sailing.

I have sailed many monohauls in my time, but this cat sail configuration was much more challenging.

[HabibiDah]

And herein lies the rub...

I think many people look at cats like they are easier to sail, but in reality, they are not. A cat doesn't give the sailor the clues that a monohull does and the sailor needs to pay very close attention to more subtle, sometimes imperceptible clues regarding trim in their current situation.

I started sailing on a sunfisher when I was 10 yo, and sailed a bunch of monohulls in my life. I thought I knew a thing or two about trim. When we bought our cat, I too thought it would be easier to sail. I was humbled to find out that I had to learn all over again how to pay attention to details. (And I'm still learning!) In a monohull I Never looked at my wake or looked at the standing rigging to help me understand my trim and power. In a cat, it's part of my constant scan.

It's true that "charter cats" are built more for comfort than speed, but my experience is that they aren't the dogs some people make them out to be. (Well...most of them. I've never sailed an astrea.)

Sure, we get left in the wake of an Outremer of the same size that has all racing sails, and by that I mean that they are maybe 4-5 knots faster. But I'll trade those 4-5 knots for the comfort of my boat against that of an Outremer any day. Oh wait...I already did!