Summer Discussion: Diesel Heater Installation on Multihulls

[Chotu]

Originally Posted by rslifkin

If you want to go that far with zones, etc. then hydronic will likely be simpler as the heat source(s) can be in 1 convenient location and just water lines and thermostat wiring to the rest of the boat. It will likely be a little heavier than forced air heaters, but if you pick components carefully it shouldn't be a big difference (and still far lighter than a wood stove or something like that).

Yep. Now I see the light.

Once I add up the parts of a hydronic system, it probably won’t weigh that much in comparison to all of the other ways to do it.

That’s for a different year. Hopefully the running rigging will be done and I will be able to sail down south next winter

[Cavalier MK2]

Originally Posted by Chotu

Due to my boat being a little different, this would not make it warmer. It would make it colder. I have incredible solar heat through my windows. I would have to run the heat a lot more often if I were to block out the sun with that.

A good idea. But not for this boat

Unfortunately the plan is to just throw more heat at the situation with a third diesel heater and still have the electrics for back up on very very very cold nights

I think with this boat really needs is a bunch of heaters on different zones. That would be the ideal way to do it in the future I think. Maybe four diesel heaters.

Not quite sure how the plumbing would work with that. The diesel plumbing would be kind of weird. But may be a gravity feed from a higher day tank would work for that

I think I might be right as the solar gets shorter and gray days prevail. If you get desperate do a test with a cheap tarp. Your boat will be leaking heat 24/7 , the sun doesn't keep those hours. Furl when sunny and deploy for the rest? Good luck, this is a interesting challenge.

[Chotu]

Originally Posted by Cavalier MK2

I think I might be right as the solar gets shorter and gray days prevail. If you get desperate do a test with a cheap tarp. Your boat will be leaking heat 24/7 , the sun doesn't keep those hours. Furl when sunny and deploy for the rest? Good luck, this is a interesting challenge.

OK, continuing to think about this, I don’t see how it could possibly work.

Obviously you must not be talking about a boom tent because that wouldn’t do anything. The cold air would just blow below it across the boat.

So you are talking about laying a tarp directly on my deck house? Over my solar panels? The deckhouse already more than R7. Just the core alone has an R7 insulation rating. Remarkably it does not feel cold to the touch at all. The interior feels “room temperature “ thanks to the insulating qualities.

Then what about the top sides? They have significantly more surface area than the deckhouse roof. And The water underneath? Or All of the air blowing underneath the deckhouse (that floor is more than R10) and equivalent in size to the deckhouse roof. I don’t see how this could work. All this does is block the sun.

It’s a a big boat. 1250 square feet. It just needs more than 2 little toy heaters . 3 plus a little electric might get me by.

[Cavalier MK2]

Sorry, thought you were talking about windows not solar panels. The idea would be tenting over the boom with the ends closed off, traditional New England boat layup variation.

[Chotu]

Originally Posted by Cavalier MK2

Sorry, thought you were talking about windows not solar panels. The idea would be tenting over the boom with the ends closed off, traditional New England boat layup variation.

Oh, I see!

I already have insulated window panels that are from the blistering Florida heat. Those are R5 plus a foil bubble reflective side as well that was to reject Florida sun. I keep those up unless I’m looking to get some solar heat gain.

Tenting over the boom and closing off the ends would have the following effect:

*keep warmer air layer above deckhouse roof and windows on side of deckhouse
*Disable solar panels
*Require approx a 40ft wide tarp
*Represents about 1/8 to 1/6 of the area of hull exposed to the air
*makes it impossible to get to the bows, to anchor, etc
*to me, scary windage of that thing

[Cavalier MK2]

I worked through October with epoxy related things and found just the rain on the deck and cabin cooled things quite a bit. Tenting made a noticable difference. No rain on the deck and feet of wind proofed air for insulation, which is pretty much what insulation is, trapped air volume.

[Chotu]

maybe I can give it a try once I get to a dock. Because I won’t be able to generate any power if I do it at anchor. Not only will my solar be done, but so will my generators. I would be without any electrical power in that case.

Looking at your boat, it’s not that much different than mine. Although I do have more free board. I am surprised you had that much of a difference from doing it but it makes some sense. It’s just really difficult with this boat. Not an anchor. Absolutely zero ways to generate power if I did that

[Chotu]

God damn it!

After going through hell to get a fuel pump that’s not what’s broken!!

It’s the heater itself.

35 tonight. No fn heat.

Seriously annoyed.

“E-04 : fuel pump disconnected” after a few clicks of it pumping each time it starts up.

I guess this is where the “it’s so cheap I can buy a new one if it breaks” comes in. I got a good couple weeks out of this POS

[Chotu]

Working with Vevor on it and will post the solution

[rslifkin]

If these heaters end up being a long term solution, because they're so cheap it might make sense to just keep an entire spare heater on hand. Then if you have an issue you can swap it out and fix the problematic one at your convenience.

[Chotu]

2 on the way already. One for the extra boost needed to make the bridge deck comfortable and one for parts

Also, somewhere in this thread somebody was saying that it’s OK to install them inside the boat. You’ll never have a problem with diesel. It’ll never smell. Yeah right. Lol. He even went so far as to say my installation would be faulty and that is the only reason that I would have any kind of smell. OK. Well, no. They were wrong. Anytime you have to service the thing diesel sprays out of the fuel hoses. So if they are installed inside you are getting diesel inside your boat. Mine will be staying outdoors

[rslifkin]

Originally Posted by Chotu

2 on the way already. One for the extra boost needed to make the bridge deck comfortable and one for parts

Also, somewhere in this thread somebody was saying that it’s OK to install them inside the boat. You’ll never have a problem with diesel. It’ll never smell. Yeah right. Lol. He even went so far as to say my installation would be faulty and that is the only reason that I would have any kind of smell. OK. Well, no. They were wrong. Anytime you have to service the thing diesel sprays out of the fuel hoses. So if they are installed inside you are getting diesel inside your boat. Mine will be staying outdoors

For that service related reason (even if they didn't spray there's always a risk of making some drips or mess) I'd say they should be at least installed in a space without any absorbent materials and where any mess from servicing can be easily (and thoroughly) cleaned up.

[markxengineerin]

Anytime you have to service the thing diesel sprays out of the fuel hoses. So if they are installed inside you are getting diesel inside your boat.

Having a diesel heater inside is no different than the vast majority of diesel engines, also installed essentially in the cabin. Use absorbing rags, paper towels, little cups, etc to catch the diesel if it's making a mess during service- same as when you service an engine. "Spray" is not an accurate description, there is nothing in the system to allow that kind of pressure to build up. "Drip" should be what you're observing when you remove a line unless you have a blockage somewhere, which sounds possible based on your other symptoms. Have you tried running the pump with the outlet line disconnected, to make sure it's pumping normally into atmosphere rather than into the heater, which may be blocked with carbon? That'd be my next step.

My heater is installed in a closet- both air intakes are drawing from there too. Exhaust out a thru-hull. I use exhaust putty (from any auto parts store) to seal the exhaust connections to heater unit, muffler, and thru hull. No smells, no action on the CO detector.

[Chotu]

Originally Posted by markxengineerin

Having a diesel heater inside is no different than the vast majority of diesel engines, also installed essentially in the cabin. Use absorbing rags, paper towels, little cups, etc to catch the diesel if it's making a mess during service- same as when you service an engine. "Spray" is not an accurate description, there is nothing in the system to allow that kind of pressure to build up. "Drip" should be what you're observing when you remove a line unless you have a blockage somewhere, which sounds possible based on your other symptoms. Have you tried running the pump with the outlet line disconnected, to make sure it's pumping normally into atmosphere rather than into the heater, which may be blocked with carbon? That'd be my next step.

My heater is installed in a closet- both air intakes are drawing from there too. Exhaust out a thru-hull. I use exhaust putty (from any auto parts store) to seal the exhaust connections to heater unit, muffler, and thru hull. No smells, no action on the CO detector.

Everything is working fine. Well, not the heater. But there’s nothing wrong here to diagnose. I’m talking about when I changed out the heater pump and I had to cut the lines and they spray diesel all over the place. Spray I guess being drip but it’s quite a bit of diesel. Stinky, stinky stuff. Why 99% of boats smell bad (along with mold).

There is no carbon blockage after 2 weeks of very part time running. The other heater is going strong with way more than double the hours.

I did the best I could to catch it but it’s inevitable you’re going to drip diesel around and have to clean it up.

Sooooo glad it’s not inside the boat. It’s very important to me to have good air quality in the boat.

Diesel engine installation in the cabin is why boats stink. I designed mine to have nothing like that inside the boat. You can’t smell a single thing in my boat. No mold, no diesel, nothing. Planning on keeping it that way

[Chotu]

Was just about freezing last night.

One little heater.

I was relying on my electric blanket even though the one heater would actually keep my stateroom at 80F if i wanted it to. But I throttled it back to its lowest 10% settings so I didn’t cook in the stateroom. The exit of the duct points into the stateroom and can heat that really well. I leave it all open during the day to let the heat rise to the bridge deck from the stateroom(s - when both heaters are working).

Woke up at 5AM pretty cold but it was from my air mattress. Good lord it was like sleeping on an unheated waterbed. Even with electric blanket on.

Had to devise more insulation between me and the mattress while very cold last night. Got it sorted with a closed sleeping bag and sheet below me.

Got up today and no chance in hell of the single heater warming the bridge deck area. Thankfully, I’m pointing east today. Very few clouds. Perfect day to add solar heating. I did, starting a couple hours ago WOW is it nice!

This is the result of the solar heating in the bridge deck salon.

After a freezing night and bad sleep with cold air mattress, I’m basking like a seal in the salon today. Lol