Why so many Lagoons on the market?

[redneckrob]

Originally Posted by arsenelupiga

Prices for lagoons are up, and one adjust plans and sells while sun shines. We get harrased all the time to sell our boat by perspective buyers.

i was thinking prices will subside 2 years ago but proven wrong.

Prices are up because of huge inflation that official politics try to hide, estimated velocity at the moment at 20 - 30% pa.

Just to pause a minute for math, if "real" inflation was 30% then something you paid 100,000 for 3 years ago would now cost 1.3*100=$130,000*1.3=$169,000*1.3=$219,700! Not sure where you live or what kind of things you purchase, but here in the U.S. I can't think of anything I buy regularly if ever that's more than doubled in price in the last 3 years, not even close. Certainly my boat hasn't doubled in value during that time, I wish! There was definitely an uptick in demand for boats and RVs this past summer in many areas. Occam's Razor says a bunch of folks looking for safe alternate means of recreation during a global pandemic was the cause of that, rather than a conspiracy to hide eye poppingly absurd rates of inflation.

If you ever care to actually see the hundreds of pages of data and methods used to determine inflation in the U.S. I highly recommend reading excruciating detail that is the BLS Handbook of Methods on CPI (https://www.bls.gov/opub/hom/cpi/home.htm). I would be interested to hear the specific inputs in the Handbook that you think are being "hidden" or the specific calculation they spell out in detail that you believe the hundreds of civil service GS employees who do this for a living are purposely falsifying despite there being no benefit to them to do so and pretty huge risk given it's all out in the open on a public website for anyone to review? It gets vey detailed, just one detail that you believe is off by orders of magnitude to get us to 30% inflation would be incredibly interesting to me.

[JamesPNW]

Lagoon dominated the Cat market because people buy Lagoon and not the others. It is supply and demand. If Lagoon are so many (dump by charters) then see if you can find something dirt cheap as other posters suggested.

[75Driver]

I’m not really looking for some bargain basement deal as much as I’m looking for, and expect to pay for, a “turn key” (or mostly) boat. Power cat might work but could be challenging for the loop. If we bought a trawler or something similar it would be a one off and likely sold after the loop. There is always sea keeper for roll if the Admiral so chooses. I’m not interested in a project at this point. Done enough houses for a couple lifetimes and don’t want to start another with a boat. Handful of ongoing small projects and whatnot are fine but big, months long projects, no thanks. I’m done with anything like that except minor tweaks and weekend warrior work.

We’re definitely looking for something with space. She’s used to having lots of room as our plan is to buy the boat, live aboard AND have land accommodations nearby while getting her bearings and sea legs. Prior to Delta sending me packing we planned on selling the lake house after this past summer anyway so that’s still going to happen. Plus, now we’ll be selling our primary residence which is a new development and replaced with condo or something like that. Both are paid for and retirements fully funded so cash flow is solid unless the stock market crashes.

[JamesPNW]

The quality of all components on a Cat and add-on features (Watermaker, washer, electric winch, etc.) determine the price. Not all cats are created or maintained equal. Many Cat owners want a floating well equipped apartment for the Admiral to even consider stepping on board. Similar to when buying house, the wife is the decider. So unless one wants to be living on board alone, I suggest keeping the Admiral’s wish in mind. You can certainly get a lower price cat and put in money to replace the old equipments or adding things. The boat fiberglass shell is the same. I think a semi-turnkey with some minor TLC is good as you have to learn everything on the boat to use and maintain it. A happy wife is a happy life, someone had said that.

[JamesPNW]

Originally Posted by CatNewBee

Because they are great, have more space and carrying capacity, are quite rigid built and are more affordable than the other brands, so the demand on the market is high for them.

Makes them perfect for charter and liveaboard and CNB / Lagoon to the largest production catamaran builder in the world, followed by Fountaine Pajot and Leopard. Lagoon builds more catamarans per year than the next 3 or four competitors together.

Similar to the US pickup truck market, Ford got 32.4%, GM got 30% and the rest divided among 4-5 other brands for the market share. Ford wins the top spot because it builds the pickup people wanted. Someone will argue Toyota or Dodge are better, but wisdoms of the crowd said differently.

[Barra]

Originally Posted by JamesPNW

Similar to the US pickup truck market, Ford got 32.4%, GM got 30% and the rest divided among 4-5 other brands for the market share. Ford wins the top spot because it builds the pickup people wanted. Someone will argue Toyota or Dodge are better, but wisdoms of the crowd said differently.

I often hear this but I dont think its exactly right. The cat market is dominated by charter fleets. Somewhere around 3 of every 4 cats built are for the charter fleets.

Lagoon is the biggest as it builds the cat the charter fleets want not necessarily what the owner wants, unlike pickups which are more firmly targeted at the actual owner.

[JamesPNW]

Originally Posted by Barra

I often hear this but I dont think its exactly right. The cat market is dominated by charter fleets. Somewhere around 3 of every 4 cats built are for the charter fleets.



Lagoon is the biggest as it builds the cat the charter fleets want not necessarily what the owner wants, unlike pickups which are more firmly targeted at the actual owner.

There are more Lagoon Cat owners than any other brand. The price for a 40ft+ basic equipped new boat is ~$500K and more. Charter or not is irrelevant in build quality as majority of charter boats are individual investments manage by charter companies. People do not pay for junks at that price. They are luxury vessels, not Uhaul trucks for rent.

Many cats are put up for sale after 5-7 years of service because their equipments start to breakdown from heavy uses and or owners realize the ROI is not great with expensive repairs and lower rental price as the vessel ages. The private owner version used Lagoon cats still command premium price.

[Barra]

Originally Posted by JamesPNW

There are more Lagoon Cat owners than any other brand. The price for a 40ft+ basic equipped new boat is ~$500K and more. Charter or not is irrelevant in build quality as majority of charter boats are individual investments manage by charter companies. People do not pay for junks at that price. They are luxury vessels, not Uhaul trucks for rent.

Many cats are put up for sale after 5-7 years of service because their equipments start to breakdown from heavy uses and or owners realize the ROI is not great with expensive repairs and lower rental price as the vessel ages. The private owner version used Lagoon cats still command premium price.

No I beg to differ. The use the boat will get determines the build quality. Because the majority of the big 3 wind up in charter (something like 90% of these 3 i think based on the production numbers) then they are built and designed for that purpose. Corners are cut quality wise but often where you dont see it.

The smaller operators typically build much higher quality with stronger longer lasting materials and equipment. But of course you pay for it.

Lagoon etc by way of charter fleet production numbers gets economies of scale these smaller guys dont get. Owner versions kind of benefit from that scale but dont kid yourself the tail isnt wagging the dog here - the charter fleet determines what and how well lagoon leopard and FP build.

[Yihang]

One glaring compromise is the coring. Lagoon has always used balsa core above the waterline but apparently the whole hull is balsa cored now.

https://www.themultihullgroup.com/la...-by-phil-ross/

Lagoon 46

[Barra]

Originally Posted by Yihang

One glaring compromise is the coring. Lagoon has always used balsa core above the waterline but apparently the whole hull is balsa cored now.

https://www.themultihullgroup.com/la...-by-phil-ross/

Lagoon 46

Yes case in point but you will find no shortage of lagoon owners telling you full balsa cored hull is a good thing. We all love our particular boats i guess but the ability to self delude never ceases to amaze me.

[Factor]

Originally Posted by Yihang

One glaring compromise is the coring. Lagoon has always used balsa core above the waterline but apparently the whole hull is balsa cored now.

https://www.themultihullgroup.com/la...-by-phil-ross/

Lagoon 46

You have to wonder why they are able to make them so bloody heavy in that case

[Pizzazz]

I can understand the large numbers of Lagoons on the market (charter boat owners selling) but I do not understand the high asking prices. The cat is perfect for charter but as a private boat it has high docking fees. These times people like the idea of owning a boat (driven by the notion to get away from it all) but once the have a boat they just end up with the monthly slip payments and visit the boat twice a year. It is a high price to pay for notional freedom, so they should be putting the boat back on the market soon.

Having said that, all assets are inflated and that lifts the boat prices as well.

[75Driver]

Never really considered the charter angle to this whole affair. I suppose we could buy a power cat, sail or trawler/etc and turn it into a charter later but seems like it might be short term capex expenditure at best. All good for sure so maybe, who knows.

Reading more and more here has exposed me to the charter angle of owning a boat. Even so I don’t consider it to be a primary factor in buying. MY guess is buying a boat for future charter is a possible fools errand and only delays the inevitable of money loss when selling. Maybe I’m wrong and maybe there are some redeeming qualities for hanging on to a boat for charter but at least our first is not going to be judged/used/chartered as a primary factor in long term decision making.

Cheers all...

EDIT: I really don’t care about losing/gaining money on a resale. A boat is not a hard asset like a house, I’m in tuned with that. Our boat purchase is more for enjoyment, fun and happiness with virtually nothing in the “smart” corner. Hahaha

[Yihang]

Originally Posted by Factor

You have to wonder why they are able to make them so bloody heavy in that case

Plywood furniture and bulkheads. Atleast according to guick google search.

After researching Neels I've actually come to appreciate where they cut cost. haha. By the looks of it the NEELs actually has good bones. You just have to redo all the fittings yourself.

[Tillsbury]

Originally Posted by Dooglas

Oh geez, not another one!

I'm not at all worried about Covid-29.

Things may be different in a few years though...