Would You Buy A Boat That Hasn't Been Used

[rajsach]

Thank you all for the info and the advice.


Sent from my iPhone using Cruisers Sailing Forum

[TacomaSailor]

I'd be concerned about the internal status of the engines.

Have the engines been sitting for 2 or 3 years with old oil in them? Diesel oil can be rather corrosive if it is not properly maintained.

And the compressor seals in the refrigerator do not like to sit un-lubricated for years and years in a very hot environment. They need coolant circulating to keep them soft and pliable.

It is a pretty good deal if you can find a really good
- engine mechanic for the two Yanmars and the Northern Lights
- refrigeration mechanic

to verify the status of all the soft parts and the corrosion that might be present due to non-use.

A marine surveyor WILL NOT tell you about those problems - they will just tell you stuff runs or doesn't run. You need to know the long term effects of non-use.

Has any one mentioned US import duties? Do you know what they will be?

I am trying to buy a European built catamaran with a 220V system. The original owner used the boat in Florida for five years and decided the hassles and problems of constantly adapting that 220V/50Hz to US power was too much. He spent a small fortune installing a parallel 110V system.

Bottom Line - there are not many REALLY GOOD DEALS. The broker is experienced and knows what the boat is worth and will make sure the owner gets that amount.

My list of 42 to 50 foot owner cabin catamarans shows quite a few deals that are within $80,000 of the US $357,000+import duties being asked for the boat in question.

For example the following have the same equipment as the Lagoon 421 and:

Lagoon 400 $449,000 2012 830 engine hours in Jaret, NC - it has watermaker, spinnaker, air conditioning

Fountaine Pajot Lipari $419,000 2011 1050 engine hours in St Augustine, Florida - has a spinnaker

Lagoon 440 $403,000 2008 1300 hours in the BVI - has gennaker and air conditioning

Manta 42 $390,000 2008 1100 engine hours in St Lucia - has watermaker and air conditioning

[boatman61]

Then again... they could have been 'Winterised' in which case...

[rajsach]

Great info Tacomasailor...


Sent from my iPhone using Cruisers Sailing Forum

[rajsach]

Originally Posted by boatman61

Then again... they could have been 'Winterised' in which case...

I'm checking into that now. Sent him an email today


Sent from my iPhone using Cruisers Sailing Forum

[CarlosDJackal]

Originally Posted by boatman61

Damn... gonna have to get my eyes tested... don't look trashed to me..

Me too. I had to go back and take a closer look. That boat looks damned nice!!

[gjordan]

I am glad to see that you are going to fly down and look at it. I would recommend that you line up a surveyor ahead of time, but have a day or two to look it over before the survey. It is always a bad idea to use a surveyor that the broker recommends, so you probably should find out about as many surveyors as you can, and tentatively line one up before you go. You might decide to fly a surveyor up from the Virgins, or down from Antigua, or we have members in St Martin that might have good recommendations. Remember that brokers are there to make as much money as they can. They dont have the best deal for you as a priority. I must say that from the photos the boat looks to be in very good condition, and an Atlantic crossing is a good shake down cruise to get rid of the "just built screw ups". Best of luck with it. _____Grant.

[Sand crab]

US import fees are only 1.5% on boats assuming that you want to document it. I read that you can register it in the USVI and cruise locally on that without documenting it plus they are duty free with no sales tax. I wonder what Puerto Rico's stance is on this?

[valhalla360]

Originally Posted by boatman61

Damn... gonna have to get my eyes tested... don't look trashed to me..

Trashed or not, the pictures may have little relationship to current reality.

[valhalla360]

Originally Posted by rajsach

Yea I saw that. Is there a work around?
I plan to use it in the Spanish, US & British virgin islands. I plan to keep it in Fajardo, Puerto Rico
I'm sure that there are many European specs boats sailing around in those areas
I also noted that there's no aircon. Don't think I will be able to add it to the entire boat and run it with the 4.5kw gen that it has. Maybe just add it to the cabins and not the salon??

Not sure the power in the islands but if you get into 60hz/120V areas it is a bit of an issue. Wire is sized based on voltage, length and amperage. Double the voltage and they can reduce the gauge of the wire.

If you go from America to Europe, you can swap out outlets and panels and use the existing wires. If you go the other way, there is a good chance you need to replace all the wires also (or downgrade what you can run on each circuit).

[Dauntlessny]

Thanks for Sharing.

Looks like a great opportunity, BUT it all depends on the $price$.

It's been sitting for two years, so it is a bit of a pig in a poke, for all the reasons listed above, but it gets back to price.

Make a really low ball offer and go from there.

[rajsach]

Originally Posted by valhalla360

Not sure the power in the islands but if you get into 60hz/120V areas it is a bit of an issue. Wire is sized based on voltage, length and amperage. Double the voltage and they can reduce the gauge of the wire.

If you go from America to Europe, you can swap out outlets and panels and use the existing wires. If you go the other way, there is a good chance you need to replace all the wires also (or downgrade what you can run on each circuit).

If the battery charger charges on both could I just run the shore power to the battery charger and run everything from battery & good inverter ??? Would that work with the aircon too?



Sent from my iPhone using Cruisers Sailing Forum

[boatman61]

I bought a USA built Cherubini in Oriental and took it across to the UK.. it would have cost a bomb to re-wire etc so I cheated and bought one of these secondhand on E-Bay... saved a ton of work and worked a treat..

Site Transformer 2 Outlets 1500w 110v

[valhalla360]

Originally Posted by rajsach

If the battery charger charges on both could I just run the shore power to the battery charger and run everything from battery & good inverter ??? Would that work with the aircon too?



Sent from my iPhone using Cruisers Sailing Forum

Yes, that's actually our plan for when we get the boat to Europe but...

To run the air/con would need a rather large expensive inverter along with a large expensive charger.

The other issue is if the move is semi-permanent, what happens when the coffee maker dies (pick am AC powered device)? Do you import a European model at 10 times the cost of a cheap Mr. Coffee?

We aren't planning to be there permanently and we aren't planning to sell the boat there, so it's an acceptable trade off. If we were looking to take the boat permanently across, having a boat that is wired to the local standard starts making a lot more sense.


The transportable transformer shown is another cobbled solution. OK for a short term visit with some potential problems but not a great long term solution.

[Dockhead]

Originally Posted by valhalla360

Yes, that's actually our plan for when we get the boat to Europe but...

To run the air/con would need a rather large expensive inverter along with a large expensive charger.

The other issue is if the move is semi-permanent, what happens when the coffee maker dies (pick am AC powered device)? Do you import a European model at 10 times the cost of a cheap Mr. Coffee?

We aren't planning to be there permanently and we aren't planning to sell the boat there, so it's an acceptable trade off. If we were looking to take the boat permanently across, having a boat that is wired to the local standard starts making a lot more sense.


The transportable transformer shown is another cobbled solution. OK for a short term visit with some potential problems but not a great long term solution.

How much could it cost to convert to 110v? Does Groupe Beneteau really install different cabling for Europe when so much of their production goes West? If you dont have to change cabling, the cost will be trivial. Even with cabling, I doubt that the cost will be material in the context of a $300,000 boat.

As others have said, the fact that the boat has been sitting unused for two years is just the average situation for a used boat. You are guaranteed to have issues, but you have those even with brand new boats. Much depends on whether it was laid up properly or not - like with any used boat. I'd much rather have a used boat with 150 hours than one with 1000.

I would expect it to be priced like a used boat, not a new one, but some premium for low hours would be reasonable if the boat was properly laid up and surveys well.

Sent from my D6633 using Cruisers Sailing Forum mobile app