1976 yacht engine future, which way to turn?

[Foswick]

Originally Posted by Wotname

There are a thousand good reasons why 99.99% of cruising sailboats are fitted with a inboard diesel engine. No need to repeat them here except to say that say storing enough outboard fuel below decks is not an option for most of us.

I think that assumes a great deal about what Justin plans to do. No indication, here, that they have any plans other than daysailing. Maybe they do plan offshore cruising, but without knowing that, I think it is premature to summarily dismiss the outboard option.

That said, I am sure I would not convert an inboard to an outboard. But, that is not to say that it isn't a viable option for Justin. More specific information is needed to be able to make such a recommendation.

[Wotname]

Originally Posted by Foswick

I think that assumes a great deal about what Justin plans to do. No indication, here, that they have any plans other than daysailing. Maybe they do plan offshore cruising, but without knowing that, I think it is premature to summarily dismiss the outboard option.

That said, I am sure I would not convert an inboard to an outboard. But, that is not to say that it isn't a viable option for Justin. More specific information is needed to be able to make such a recommendation.

I guess I offered my advice based on what I have inferred from all of Justin's posts over the years he has been here. I have participated in a few of his threads.

One example

Originally Posted by JustinT

Last three days my wife and I took our Seal 28 from Fort William to Lochcarron (home). It took three days, we hit all the tides just right. Amazing journey. Saw an Orca, dolphins going under our boat, Gannets, seals. The west coast is amazing. Now we have the boat back in Lochcarron we need to do a few engine repairs/tweaks, then to carry on exploring the islands! Not bad for a 45 year old boat.

He is, of course, free to disagree or discard it.

[5BTM]

"Obviously, spending tons of cash on a 1976 yacht could be madness."

Owning a yacht is madness.

There are a lot of sailboats of your vintage that look and must fell like crap because the owners penny pinched from day one.

You seem to like and enjoy your boat, do what will make you happy.

It is only money.

[thomm225]

Actually it's the stern of your boat that makes the case for repairing or replacing your diesel engine.

Outboards work fine on many sailboats though. I removed my 1974 Bukh diesel over 12 years ago and replaced with an outboard. Then cleaned up all the sludge that was under the old engine plus removed all associated / supporting equipment.

The latest boat to do a circumnavigation with a small 6 HP Outboard was that Alberg 30 Lora which was refitted by the guy at Atom Voyages..

With today's small outboards, all you need are a few gallons of gas to cover 50-60 miles if the wind drops.

I've never had more than 5 gallons of gas onboard at any one time for my 5 hp 4 stroke outboard.

Last time I was 50 miles out and had no wind, I had 2-3 gallons and made it back to the marina.

Like many that sail, I'm usually am with 100 miles are so of my marina.

When I retire and if I sail longer distances I may carry extra on deck.

[PhilipL]

If you plan to keep the boat, a Beta 20kg would be a good idea. It weighs around 100kg while a Bukh weighs 220kg (minimum).


The only problem is the cost. The current cost of a Beta 20 is just under £6k to which you need a new prop and possibly a shaft.


I have done this twice with boats (1985 and 1993) and never regretted it.



It can be quite wild in the Moray Firth so I would not use an outboard unless you are going out in only the best of weather.

[Shaneesprit]

I am more than skilled enough to carry out a full rebuild on the vessel, but it makes no sense and less sense if your less skilled. Pull it out and either buy a direct replacement, or have your engine fully rebuilt. Or replace with new if your budget allows.
Any change in manufacturer or HP is likely to add complexity and cost.
I would expect 1 Day to remove Engine and 2 days to refit.
Maybe 1 weekend out and 2 weekends back in if it doesn’t go well.

Ensure the Fuel pump and injectors are included in the rebuild.

[parkstone bay]

The 20 hp Bukh is quite an old engine (I have a DV24, which replaced the 20, I suspect about 20 -25 Years back, in my little MB. BTW: Deblen is mistaken, the DV20 isn't manufactured, and the DV24 is a complete redesign). At the risk of being a real PITA, how much maintenance have you given the engine over the years you've had the boat? When pretty well any yacht engine dies, it dies not from over-use, but from under-use, and even worse, from chronic under-maintenance. If a diesel is given clean air, clean fuel, and clean sump oil, it will give 40, 60 or more years service: consider a cab or a truck. But a cab or a truck, or a piece of builder's plant like a dump truck or concrete mixer, will run for 40 hours or more a week. Many yachts don't run the engine for 40 hours a YEAR. And, of course - just to make life REALLY easy - most yacht engines are shoe-horned into the space under the cockpit sole, behind the companionway, it is extremely difficult to access the filters, and often nigh on impossible to check, less alone change, the sump oil.
Good Luck with the replacement/rebuild.

[Dockhead]

Originally Posted by Cheechako

Having the diesel is much better than an outboard. Maybe take it out and see if someone can rebuild it? You dont need a lot of HP. Not sure what small diesel options are out there cheap... but maybe...
If your seagoing trips are few , the OB is OK. Not convenient in a seaway though.

I agree with this.


Those old Bukhs are dead simple and extremely reliable. Eminently worth rebuilding. You can do it on your kitchen table actually (after sufficiently wrapping it). Or send it off somewhere.



Or just buy a Yanmar. If you don't plan on selling the boat it won't matter that this will create negative value. You will enjoy using it -- isn't that worth the price?

[Foswick]

Originally Posted by Shaneesprit

I am more than skilled enough to carry out a full rebuild on the vessel, but it makes no sense and less sense if your less skilled. Pull it out and either buy a direct replacement, or have your engine fully rebuilt.

I am confused by this advice. It seems like you are saying that a rebuild is a good plan, but not if you can do it yourself?

I have found the opposite to be true - that a rebuild tends not to be very cost-effective unless you can do much of the work yourself.

Maybe I'm misreading?

[lifeofreilly57]

My only reservation about stern mounted outboards is that they tend to come out of the water when your boat encounters larger waves. In inboard engine with a shaft mounted prop will stay in the water and not spin free.
I don't know about your neck of the woods, but here in the states I can usually find decent used small diesels. If it's in the same power range the shaft should be fine, depending on the rpm range you may have to switch props.
I recently talked with the owner of the marina that I do winter storage at, like most yards they have a couple boats every year that owners have abandoned, they get cut up and the valuable parts set aside. Several had perfectly good, serviceable engine/trans units.
Check with marinas in your area, you never know what's available for a fair price. I've also gotten a few boats that way.

[Wotname]

Originally Posted by Foswick

I am confused by this advice. It seems like you are saying that a rebuild is a good plan, but not if you can do it yourself?

I have found the opposite to be true - that a rebuild tends not to be very cost-effective unless you can do much of the work yourself.

Maybe I'm misreading?

I was also confused but after re-reading SS's post a couple of times, it made more sense (I think). I've emphasised the key words below...

I understand the post to mean - it makes no sense to try rebuilding the engine in situ even though it is possible. It is better to pull the engine out and either rebuild it at home or replace it.

Originally Posted by Shaneesprit

I am more than skilled enough to carry out a full rebuild on the vessel, but it makes no sense and less sense if your less skilled. Pull it out and either buy a direct replacement, or have your engine fully rebuilt. Or replace with new if your budget allows.
Any change in manufacturer or HP is likely to add complexity and cost.
I would expect 1 Day to remove Engine and 2 days to refit.
Maybe 1 weekend out and 2 weekends back in if it doesn’t go well.

Ensure the Fuel pump and injectors are included in the rebuild.

[Foswick]

Originally Posted by Wotname

I understand the post to mean - it makes no sense to try rebuilding the engine in situ even though it is possible.

Ah ... yeah that makes sense.

[JustinT]

So my outboard is now working. The morse cables were the problem, stopping the engine starting.
That will do to get it from Skye to Inverness.

After that it will be on a pontoon in fresh water on the Caledonian Canal, right near the sea lock.

Once there we'll use it as a caravan while we decide how to move ahead.

From the new mooring we can either:
Pootle up and down the canal (which does open up to Loch Ness, which can be a brutal loch) this canal also leads to the west coast.
Or, go out on the east Scotland coast.

I'm inclined to use the outboard for the canal and the Bukh for the sea.

However the bracket I used for the outboard means I can tug it out of the water completely and have it tucked up the stern.

I'm definitely thinking I'll get a professional or three to look at the engine and advise me on the problem. Either fix it or I will. It seems the Bukh is probably worth fixing anyway as it ran ok when it did run.

Having the outboard as backup wouldn't be a bad idea even if the Bukh was used mainly.

Anyway, we'll see. Once the yacht is on the new mooring I have time to breath.

[dlj]

Great update! I have to say, I'd love to sail where you are one day...

dj

[JustinT]

Originally Posted by dlj

Great update! I have to say, I'd love to sail where you are one day...

dj

Thanks.
Yes, the west coast of Scotland is something else, can be very scary waters. The wildlife is amazing. The Caledonian Canal is actually very nice, interesting. Lock Ness can be as rough as the sea. I don't know so much about the east coast yet. You can get a bunch of actual sailing done around here and the lochs are plenty big enough for sailing.