Are ignition keys pointless in the cockpit?

[Lordbaltas]

Only if you have a kill switch down below

Originally Posted by PerfectPirate

Am I the only one, or one of very few, who think that it is pointless to have an engine ignition key in the cockpit of a sailboat? The engine is running perhaps 5% of the time and the key is simply a vulnerability for all the rest of the time that you are out sailing. It is subject to being kicked, snagged by ropes, hit by flying gear, etc. This can either break it or knock it overboard, often at a moment of crisis and panic when the engine is most likely to be needed. If the skipper takes it out and puts it in his pocket, it is still vulnerable to loss. If that skipper happens to go overboard, the crew cannot start the engine to effect a retrieval. So why don't our engine instrument panels just come with a simple switch?

My previous boat had a simple push-pull ignition switch and a starter button. The boat was relatively safe from theft because someone would have to first gain entry to the interior and switch on the batteries and the appropriate breaker before any power was available to the engine. On my new boat, I will be replacing the keyed switch on the cockpit panel with a simple rotary starter switch and moving the keyed switch inside to the nav station, where the key will be sheltered and safe. This will also give me an alternative starter switch for testing the engine while working on it. Both switches will have to be "ON" for the ignition circuit to be active and for engine to start and run.


So, what's the general consensus? Does this idea make sense to other people or is it just my personal bugaboo?

[parkstone bay]

And not only in a sailing boat. When I can get around to it (after 15 years!), I intend to ditch the "ignition/start" switch on my little MB. Replace with two push buttons - one latched as power on/off (tho' even that isn't strictly necessary; use battery isolators as on/off) - or maybe a toggle switch, and one push-button for start. Pretty well idiot-proof, and saves a vulnerable key from damage. In fact, as my engine stops on a solenoid, rather than a pull-handle, I'd need a separate push-button for stop, as well.
But yes, good point, delicate things - like ignition keys - on a small boat are going to get broken.

[rls8r]

One thing to keep in mind when going from key to no-key is how to excite the alternator when starting. Usually (as I understand things) is that the 'start' setting of the key switch provides current to the alternator to get it charging and cuts the current to the alternator when it moves to the 'run' setting. With no "start" key - I installed an oil pressure switch that provides current to the alternator when there's no oil pressure (i.e., while the engine is starting, but before it starts) and cuts off the current after the engine starts and oil pressure builds.

[capn_billl]

No keys, i just have a battery disconnect in the cabin.

Never been an issue.

Thieves are more likely to steal power boats.

[dbraymer]

You are right, but you are also wrong. With a main battery switch below, an ignition key switch above is redundant, assuming that you secure the companionway while you are away from the boat. If you have a cockpit panel with a key switch, and you remove the key, then it could become lost, if you leave it in the switch, it invites theft.

But thieves are often dumb, drugged up, or drunk. If your engine panel in the cockpit has a button that says "start", and no ignition key switch, someone may be tempted to climb on board and give it a go.

Also the switch below is an important asset to turn off if you leave the vessel for long periods in humid climates. 12 VDC should not be left going up to the cockpit where the environment may cause some damage.

So after going thru all of the above and learning everything the hard way, You need a key switch below to turn off 12 VDC to the cockpit, but leave the rest of the vessels 12 VDC intact (think bilge pump here).

Then the cockpit engine panel should be in a recess with a key switch but also a plastic door that you can close to prevent rainfall entry (this with the key in the switch!). Then you leave the ignition key in the switch in dry storage locations (or under way), and take it with you while in harbor. You lock the companion way, and turn off the 12 VDC engine panel supply in harbor.

If some alert thief with a street smart electrical engineering degree decides he can hot wire the vessel from the cockpit, he will soon discover that there is no 12 VDC available in the cockpit, behind the engine panel.

My best advice from been there and done that episodes.

[Nicholson58]

It depends a bit on size. Roxy is approaching too big and complex to steal. We are always anchored and the windlass is disabled and electrically isolated. Heavy chain and big anchor. The prop is manually pitch adjustable and set to very low pitch at anchor. Not obvious how to deal with this for the uninitiated. Our key ignition is under a hinged Lexan cover, protected from water and abuse. A secondary cover with swing port access further protects the key. The key lives in the slot, never out. BTW, replaced the Lexan a while ago.

[merrydolphin]

I came close to loosing my 46 foot cruising sailboat to a damn key!

I was anchored off an island in the Sea Of Cortez when a squall came up. We drug anchor, rapidly heading for a lee cliff shore. Jumped up into the cockpit to save the boat and CRAP, WHERE’S THE KEY?! There was a few moments of panic until we found it neatly stowed in a drawer in the nav station.
Needless to say, that was the last time that the key ever came out.

Footnote: I also got rid of that damn genuine CQR that I had trouble setting despite lots of scope etc. have never had much luck with them in Caribbean either. Went to a 55# Delta which at that time was a very good alternative. Now use a Spade and love it.

[Carl-T705]

Originally Posted by sailingabe41ds

I have a 2015 Jeanneau and there is no ignition key . I iam worried about someone stealing the boat I swithc the starter battery to off. If they do steal better I have insurance and 7 knotts wiyh a limited range i am sure the athoriries will find them soon.
Abe

. If someone is going to steal a sailboat,they are going to steal a sailboat. No one boat hops through the marina or anchorage looking for a boat someone left the key in to steal... It's not like being at the 7-11 store and leaving the key in your car..I would worry more about a seacock sinking the boat .

[j.g.evans]

I have rescued half a dozen boats that dragged anchor with nobody aboard. All had keys in the ignition. There would have been a lot of damage if the engines had not started.
My Yanmar ignition fell apart and I replaced it with a simple ON-OFF switch with a rubber boot for weather protection.

[glenn.225]

The key is not a problem, I don't have one. However the the push button for engine on/off failed in my 80's Volvo panel. I replaced it with a toggle switch because it was what I had on hand. It works but it is possible to snag with a line and turn the engine electrical off without pulling the fuel cutoff (bad for alternator).



Before I replace it with another push button does anyone know of a small quarter turn low profile switch that I could use?


The main reason is I would like something that would be very easy to see which position it is in as one time I left the push button on and added more than a few hours to the hour meter.

[Summer Madness]

I sail a 1989 Hunter28 and what always baffled me was the engine shut off is in the companion way. Yes I too am thinking of relocating the key switch, I have broken it twice at a cost of 30 dollars to replace it.snag once with a line and once with my knee. I also thought about putting a cover over the control panel, kind of like a plastic box, not to protect from the panel from the elements but from breaking the key off. The previous owner must have been worried about losing a key as I have 6 of them on different lanyards and floats.

[Nicholson58]

Originally Posted by glenn.225

The key is not a problem, I don't have one. However the the push button for engine on/off failed in my 80's Volvo panel. I replaced it with a toggle switch because it was what I had on hand. It works but it is possible to snag with a line and turn the engine electrical off without pulling the fuel cutoff (bad for alternator).



Before I replace it with another push button does anyone know of a small quarter turn low profile switch that I could use?


The main reason is I would like something that would be very easy to see which position it is in as one time I left the push button on and added more than a few hours to the hour meter.

Allen Bradley makes a multitude of waterproof industrial switches that might work well.

[Calif.Ted]

Had a dockmate who'd retired and decided to "live the dream" and bought twin Yanmar powerboat. Asked him why he hadn't taken the boat out after a month, he said "Can't, my ex-wife threw the key for starboard engine overboard". So after showing him that the "port" key worked both sides we went to local hardware store and had half a doz made up using blanks for a cabinet lock. Almost all the flat Yanmar keys are identical.
No keys on a fire engine for obvious reasons, but anyone with skills to start and drive isn't going to steal one.

[Traumerei]

I agree with you. I discovered the keyless option when I installed a new Beta engine in our boat two years ago.

To my surprise Beta offers an equal number of keyed and keyless engine instrument panels.

On previous boats the keyed ignition has always been a source of problems and frustration. Keys get lost or are not locatable quickly in a critical moment.

In a discussion with Beta technical support prior to making a selection, I learned that water egress into the keyway is a common source of failure on all keyed ignition panels. My own experience validates this in that I had an ignition/engine control panel under a recessed cover near the helm on a prior boat and water on a long wet passage rendered it inoperable as I approach my destination, forcing us to sail into a tight anchorage though a narrow pass as the sun was setting. This was not hard because the crew was thoroughly briefed before but non the less a stressful experience.

For my new engine I chose a keyless panel and I strongly recommend this for any boat where the battery switches and circuit panels are inside a lockable cabin.

My new engine panel is on the starboard side of the companionway, visible to anyone in the cockpit. Additionally, I’ve added a second set off start/stop switches next to the chart plotter at the helm so that the helmsman can start the engine without leaving their position.

This may not be for everyone. Configuring your boat in a way the suits and addresses tour needs and preferences is your choice. But I would strongly recommend that a keyless panel might be an desirable option to consider.

Best regards to all, Steve

[Tx J]

Keep in mind that there is a new USCG requirement (overly complicated and riddled with arcane details) that 'all motorized boats under 26 feet and having around 3hp+, built after 2020' must have an Engine Cut-Off Switch (ECOS), and the operator must use it.

https://uscgboating.org/recreational...ff-devices.php

https://www.uscgboating.org/


The law is unlikely to apply to most sailboats, but in the "FAQS" section they give a rather 'interesting' example. I'd kinda like to see a planing 26foot sailboat with 50hp .:
"Q21. My 26-foot sailboat has a 50 horsepower engine that allows me to travel on plane / above displacement speed. Do I need to use an Engine Cut-Off Switch?
A21. No. Regardless of when it was built, a boat 26-feet in length and greater does not require use of an engine cut-off switch, even if equipped.".