Full Throttle Use & Diesel Engines

[David M]

I cannot find in your link a description of tick over.

[Capitain Mike]

Originally Posted by David M

I cannot find in your link a description of tick over.

What is 30 hours at constant speed no ups no downs. It is the same as tick over no ups no downs did you read the rest?

Macmillan Dictionary
http://www.macmillandictionary.com/d...ican/tick-over

http://www.macmillandictionary.com/s...ct/?q=steadily

[hellosailor]

Originally Posted by David M

I cannot find in your link a description of tick over.

Tick over is a technical term referring to the engine decompression lever being engaged, and the engine spun by a vintage mechanical Timex coupled directly to the flywheel.

Not to be confused with IDLE SPEED.

[Starbuck]

Tickover is shorthand for the phrase "barely ticking over," referring to idling, when the running engine is at its slowest and quietest. The analogy is to a timepiece steadily and quietly ticking away.

Which makes me wonder: if my engine ticks over reliably, but never tocks, is there a problem?

[Pete7]

Originally Posted by Starbuck

Tickover is shorthand for the phrase "barely ticking over," referring to idling, when the running engine is at its slowest and quietest. The analogy is to a timepiece steadily and quietly ticking away.

Which makes me wonder: if my engine ticks over reliably, but never tocks, is there a problem?

Yes mate, tappets are too tight, they must tock.

Pete

[smurphny]

After reading the link posted by Capitain Mike, it is clear that newer lube oils and especially synthetics are not suitable for older designs such as my Yanmar 3GM30F. There are lots of these still in service so this could be critical info for many boat owners. My service manual does call for API service CD, an obsolete product. According to this article, it could well be that the oil burning problem I had was caused by using newer Rotella and not by the previous owners running at a low rpm. Rotella IS recommended in the manual but since there is no copyright date in the manual, there is no way to tell whether the Rotella then is the same as the Rotella now. I would think not. I have used Rotella in every diesel with good results but it is possible it is the culprit, as described in the link piece. Being that I have no desire to repeat the ring job, will be looking further into this.

[Capitain Mike]

Originally Posted by Pete7

Yes mate, tappets are too tight, they must tock.

Pete

Perhaps the tick is louder than the tock or the wind changes on the tock

[Capitain Mike]

Originally Posted by smurphny

After reading the link posted by Capitain Mike, it is clear that newer lube oils and especially synthetics are not suitable for older designs such as my Yanmar 3GM30F. There are lots of these still in service so this could be critical info for many boat owners. My service manual does call for API service CD, an obsolete product. According to this article, it could well be that the oil burning problem I had was caused by using newer Rotella and not by the previous owners running at a low rpm. Rotella IS recommended in the manual but since there is no copyright date in the manual, there is no way to tell whether the Rotella then is the same as the Rotella now. I would think not. I have used Rotella in every diesel with good results but it is possible it is the culprit, as described in the link piece. Being that I have no desire to repeat the ring job, will be looking further into this.

Get a ceramic magnetic oil pan plug.

YouTube - Magnetic Oil Sump Drain Plug In Action

TDI FAQ


In warm weather, a good-quality non-synthetic oil meant for diesel engines with CG-4 or CH-4 ratings may be used. They're not suitable in cold weather due to reduced cold-pumping properties, and it's prudent to shorten the oil change interval because non-synthetic oils may not resist breakdown at high temperatures as well as the synthetic oils (remember that turbocharger). These oils are much easier to find. These include:
Mobil Delvac 1300, 15w40
Shell Rotella T, 15w40
Chevron Delo 400, 15w40

Beware of other brands that claim to be diesel-rated or turbo-rated, but are actually just plain cheap. Use the good stuff. If you doubt this, ask transport truck drivers that own their rigs what they use. Chances are it will be Delvac or Rotella.

In cold weather, if CG-4 or CH-4 rated synthetic oil cannot be found, regular Mobil 1 rated CF in viscosity grades 0w30, 5w30, or 10w30 may be used, but with a shortened oil change interval because this oil doesn't have as much capability to handle soot.

So what's the deal if something else is used besides the expensive and sometimes hard-to-find 5w40 full-synthetic CH-4 rated oil?

Conventional oils that are meant for diesels are usually viscosity SAE 15w40. That's okay in warm weather, but not in cold weather. You want oil to reach that turbocharger as soon as possible after a cold start, and it takes longer to get there if the oil won't pump easily. Synthetic oils have many advantages over conventional oils, not the least of which is better cold pumping characteristics, and hence the common 5w40 viscosity grades.

It is possible to get some non-synthetic oils with viscosity's such as 0w30, 5w50, etc. In non-synthetic oils, these can only be achieved by heavy use of viscosity-index modifiers, a type of additive, whereas synthetic oils can easily achieve a viscosity range like 5w40 with little or no use of viscosity-index modifiers. For various reasons we'd rather not get into, it's better to have the viscosity right in the base stock, than to tinker with the viscosity using additives.

Oils that lack the CG-4 or CH-4 rating don't have the same level of anti-foaming and soot-dispersing capability. The best quality diesel-engine oils deal with it and render the soot as harmless to the engine as possible. Oils that don't meet the CG-4 or CH-4 ratings can't handle as much soot, so you need to change them sooner.

Finally, cheaply made oils (not the same as cheaply priced ...) usually won't have the same resistance to breakdown at high temperatures, that good quality oil does. High temperatures are found in the turbocharger. When oil breaks down at high temperature over a period of time, it "cokes" or builds up deposits in the high-temperature area, which then restrict lubrication. Bye-bye, turbo. There has been one reported turbo failure which was traced to lubrication failure. Do a search of the forums for "turbo failure" to find out what oil he was using...


Many oil additives contain PTFE, also known as Teflon, and touted under many other different names after the manufacturer of Teflon filed a lawsuit to prevent oil-additive companies from using that name. PTFE is a solid. The job of the oil filter in your engine is to collect solid particles down to about 10 microns in size. Where's that solid PTFE going to end up? In the oil filter. Which may cause the filter to plug prematurely, causing the bypass valve to open, and now your engine is running on unfiltered oil. Not good.

[ehh]

I have started using Rotella 30 weight in my betamarine 10 for exactly this reason. It carries a CF rating, or at least something less than what Rotella 15W40 carries. (Betamarine does list straight 30 weight as acceptable for my engine). For years I used regular Mobil 1 10W30 (not there "Diesel oil") in my Kubota tractor because it had a CF rating, which my tractor required. I wrote to Exxon/Mobil and they advised that if your motor specifies CF oil (as engines of the older era did) then you should not use oil with rating over CF. They didn't explain why exactly but I think now I see. BTW Betamarine is insistent that you should not use synthetic oil in their engines. I'm not sure why, but maybe they are thinking of the new diesel formulations with high ratings and not regular Mobil 1.

If you want to read some astoundingly over-the-top discussions about oil visit the "BobsTheOilGuy" forum. You would never believe how much people have to say about oil. Not much on marine engines though.

[Weyalan]

This might be a silly question, but how high do the revs need to be to avoid glazing problems? Our Volvo MD2003 is rated at something like max 28 hp at 3200 rpm. We typically motor at between 1600 (motor sailing) and 2300 rpm (motoring into breeze / chop). Is this high enough to avoid glazing?

[smurphny]

Get a ceramic magnetic oil pan plug.

Mike,
The Yanmar has no oil pan plug which is a major design problem because there is plenty of room to easily drain the oil from underneath. Instead, I always need to pump it out through the darned straw-sized dipstick.

A magnetic plug would be great. My last Subaru had one and it collected plenty of potentially abrasive material. (Subaru has now stopped using these for some reason) That car went 363,000 miles and was still running fine when I traded it in for another.

Thanks again for the great info. The more I look into this, the more opinions that cancel each other out I encounter. The consensus seems to be that the oil I have been using, the Rotella, with CF-4 API rating is about the best, so will continue to use this and hope the liners don't glaze again. Ran it for about an hour up in the yard last fall after re-ring/pre winterization and it had 0 smoke. Crossing my fingers it remains like that.

[Capitain Mike]

Originally Posted by Weyalan

This might be a silly question, but how high do the revs need to be to avoid glazing problems? Our Volvo MD2003 is rated at something like max 28 hp at 3200 rpm. We typically motor at between 1600 (motor sailing) and 2300 rpm (motoring into breeze / chop). Is this high enough to avoid glazing?

(80% = 2560 revs) Go 80% (85% is recommended top revs =2720revs)