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IsaakOker · 06-07-2019, 16:52

Quote:

Originally Posted by Geoff54

Are you sure it was coolant or was it raw water. If it was coolant there is a problem with heat exchanger. Raw water and coolant should never meet.

No. When assembling, just slacken off the tappet adjusters and make sure the rocker arms ends are correctly engaged with the push rods. Then reset the clearances once you have torqued the head.

Good to hear regarding reassembling the head.

As for the heat exchanger, it has two exits, one which much go to the muffler (still attached) & one that went to the mixing elbow.
The one going to the mixing elbow released a liquid, not fuel but I would say that it wasn't water or maybe it was water that had been sitting in there for 5 years and smelt strange but it was too "silky" to the touch and smelt liek water with some type of additive that's why I suppose it's coolant.

**Wotname** · 06-07-2019, 16:52

Quote:

Originally Posted by IsaakOker

........

It's a supposition but we did try to start the engine 10 days back & we probably made it turn 25-50 turns without getting it started so it might well be hydrolocked.

Another possibility considering how long the engine has sat unused it a frozen valve. Take the rocker cover off and remove the rocker gear.

Scenario is: engine sat unused, oil drained away from the valve gear, then turned over 25 - 50 times causing sea water to enter cylinder via exhaust valve (classic hydrolock). Same valve now rusts onto head and prevents camshaft from turning thus preventing engine from turning.

IsaakOker · 06-07-2019, 16:54

Quote:

Originally Posted by Wotname

As an aside, did the starter motor actually spin when you tried testing off the engine?

I realise this is not you priority right now!

No, the "part with the teeth" engaged/came out but didn't go any further and the moment I looked at the battery I noticed that the pos & neg were extremely hot, nearly melting plastic surround.
This was obviously only a few seconds.

Geoff54 · 06-07-2019, 16:57

Quote:

Originally Posted by Wotname

Another possibility considering how long the engine has sat unused it a frozen valve. Take the rocker cover off and remove the rocker gear.

Scenario is: engine sat unused, oil drained away from the valve gear, then turned over 25 - 50 times causing sea water to enter cylinder via exhaust valve (classic hydrolock). Same valve now rusts onto head and prevents camshaft from turning thus preventing engine from turning.

Good point. Not sure about the TE but the regular 4JH2 uses cast iron guides - sintered, if I recall correctly.

IsaakOker · 06-07-2019, 16:58

Quote:

Originally Posted by Wotname

Another possibility considering how long the engine has sat unused it a frozen valve. Take the rocker cover off and remove the rocker gear.

Scenario is: engine sat unused, oil drained away from the valve gear, then turned over 25 - 50 times causing sea water to enter cylinder via exhaust valve (classic hydrolock). Same valve now rusts onto head and prevents camshaft from turning thus preventing engine from turning.

OK, can't get a picture of that in my head but I'll look at the manual to get a better idea of each part.

I'll first try the water pump in a few hours & then I'll see from there.
If need be I can pull the engine into the saloon/galley tomorrow and disassemble the head.

So I should definitely exclude the gearbox as a possible issue right?
I can move the lever to put it in gear but I'm obviously not sure if it is actually doing something within the housing.
I know that it's extremely rare that the gearbox locks up that way but who knows...

**Wotname** · 06-07-2019, 17:05

Quote:

Originally Posted by IsaakOker

.....
So I should definitely exclude the gearbox as a possible issue right?
I can move the lever to put it in gear but I'm obviously not sure if it is actually doing something within the housing.
I know that it's extremely rare that the gearbox locks up that way but who knows...

Anything is possible but not all things are probable.
First rule of troubling shooting - do the easy things first.

That puts the gearbox way down the list.

So far from this thread and since you have removed the injectors and flooded the cylinders with oil, next pull the sea water pump.
If no change, then the rocker gear.

IsaakOker · 06-07-2019, 17:13

Quote:

Originally Posted by Wotname

Anything is possible but not all things are probable.
First rule of troubling shooting - do the easy things first.

That puts the gearbox way down the list.

So far from this thread and since you have removed the injectors and flooded the cylinders with oil, next pull the sea water pump.
If no change, then the rocker gear.

Hahah OK!
I agree on that one but right now the engine paint is all lifting off and it's not very clean so to be able to take the rocker arm off, I will want to pull the engine out of the engine room to give it a good clean that's why I thought gearbox is easier haha.

**Wotname** · 06-07-2019, 17:55

Quote:

Originally Posted by IsaakOker

Hahah OK!
I agree on that one but right now the engine paint is all lifting off and it's not very clean so to be able to take the rocker arm off, I will want to pull the engine out of the engine room to give it a good clean that's why I thought gearbox is easier haha.

Nooooooo.

Pulling engine at this stage is too hard.

Rocker gear is at the very top so easy to keep dirt away - gravity is working for you

and if you plan to remove the head, it has to come off anyway.

Anyhow, good luck in finding the root cause of way it isn't turning over.

Geoff54 · 06-07-2019, 17:56

Quote:

Originally Posted by IsaakOker

Good to hear regarding reassembling the head.

As for the heat exchanger, it has two exits, one which much go to the muffler (still attached) & one that went to the mixing elbow.
The one going to the mixing elbow released a liquid, not fuel but I would say that it wasn't water or maybe it was water that had been sitting in there for 5 years and smelt strange but it was too "silky" to the touch and smelt liek water with some type of additive that's why I suppose it's coolant.

OK, so this is confusing - there is no direct connection from the heat exchanger to the muffler. It's not an immediate issue buy it should be resolved before you reassemble things.

There are two separate circuits within the heat exchanger - raw water and coolant. There is a tube stack inside the exchanger body. The raw water goes through the tube stack and the coolant stays outside of the tube stack. These are kept separate by o-rings within the heat exchanger. Therefore the connections are raw water in, raw water out, coolant in and coolant out.

I don't have the manual available and I am on a slow connection so I can't confirm the details but I'm pretty sure this is correct on your engine. The coolant inlet and outlet are on the front body of the exchanger and connect to the thermostat housing and the coolant pump. The raw water connections are on the back cap of the exchanger. The raw inlet comes from the raw water pump via the transmission oil cooler. The raw outlet goes to the small connection on the mixing elbow and, if the engine is below the water line (almost always is on a sailboat), it should go through a vented loop first and then to the mixing elbow.

The mixing elbow directs the mixed exhaust gas and raw water into the muffler.

Hope that helps.

Geoff54 · 06-07-2019, 18:01

Quote:

Originally Posted by Wotname

Nooooooo.

Pulling engine at this stage is too hard.

Rocker gear is at the very top so easy to keep dirt away - gravity is working for you

and if you plan to remove the head, it has to come off anyway.

Anyhow, good luck in finding the root cause of way it isn't turning over.

Yep!! Also while the engine is still on the mounts, you have something to lever against when you try to turn it over with a socket and bar.

Only thing is that the lifting points are on the head so you may need to bolt it back on to lift it into the cabin later.

IsaakOker · 06-07-2019, 18:07

Quote:

Originally Posted by Geoff54

OK, so this is confusing - there is no direct connection from the heat exchanger to the muffler. It's not an immediate issue buy it should be resolved before you reassemble things.

There are two separate circuits within the heat exchanger - raw water and coolant. There is a tube stack inside the exchanger body. The raw water goes through the tube stack and the coolant stays outside of the tube stack. These are kept separate by o-rings within the heat exchanger. Therefore the connections are raw water in, raw water out, coolant in and coolant out.

I don't have the manual available and I am on a slow connection so I can't confirm the details but I'm pretty sure this is correct on your engine. The coolant inlet and outlet are on the front body of the exchanger and connect to the thermostat housing and the coolant pump. The raw water connections are on the back cap of the exchanger. The raw inlet comes from the raw water pump via the transmission oil cooler. The raw outlet goes to the small connection on the mixing elbow and, if the engine is below the water line (almost always is on a sailboat), it should go through a vented loop first and then to the mixing elbow.

The mixing elbow directs the mixed exhaust gas and raw water into the muffler.

Hope that helps.

OK, so Im at the boat and going to pull the raw water pump out in a minute.

I checked and the smell and silky feel I had in mind corresponds to what came out of the elbow(smells like clean engine oil with water).

I stuck my finger In the outlet of raw water of the heat exchanger and it indeed is just water & fresh, not salty.

Also, from the three connections at the back of the exchanger, one goes to the elbow, another goes or comes from the turbo and the other comes from the oil pump which I confused with the muffler as from the elbow the exhaust dissapears aft.

There is though a coolant connection from the thermostat to the bottom of the turbo.

Hope this sounds about right!

IsaakOker · 06-07-2019, 18:08

Quote:

Originally Posted by Wotname

Nooooooo.

Pulling engine at this stage is too hard.

Rocker gear is at the very top so easy to keep dirt away - gravity is working for you

and if you plan to remove the head, it has to come off anyway.

Anyhow, good luck in finding the root cause of way it isn't turning over.

Copy that!

I'll give the pump a try as if it's that I'll call it a day but it seems to simple to be that..

IsaakOker · 06-07-2019, 18:09

Quote:

Originally Posted by Geoff54

Yep!! Also while the engine is still on the mounts, you have something to lever against when you try to turn it over with a socket and bar.

Only thing is that the lifting points are on the head so you may need to bolt it back on to lift it into the cabin later.

Hmm! That's a point.. OK, I'll try it in here then but I'll first try with the pump now and then I'll post an update