Hypothetical: best engines to look for.

[stormalong]

Originally Posted by hpeer

Are there any production cats (circa 2000) with Beta or Kubuto engines?

When I went with Beta in 2003 I worked directly with the factory in England. I was wintering in London at the time.

Beta was much smaller then. They were repower specialists. They also specialized in narrow boats back then and are still in that business. I don't think they are in any production boats. The big name engine builders give production boat builders very good discounts so they can get their big markups on service parts.

[cottonsail]

I will not recommend Volvo Penta. 2019 we bought a brand new D2-50F complete powertrain. Volvo is terrible to deal with. There is no national tech support. You are referred to a local dealer. That's hit or miss. The engine itself is excellent, but support is non-existent!

[nofacey]

IMO outboards have very limited application for ocean going cruisers - in big waves, or tough bar crossings, they just don't go deep enough.

If you buy new, most modern diesel inboards will be good.

If used, then I'd stay away from Volvo; parts are just stupid. Yanmar slightly better....but if you're after an engine that endures, you want a slow turning unit - Perkins, Beta, Cummings.

[dannc]

Originally Posted by sailingharry

For whatever reason (maybe related to EPA regulations?) I don't think Beta/Kubota have ever been installed OEM. But I may be wrong, it's just a suspicion.

Beta Marine has some engines that are EPA Tier III that would work in boats with twin engines. Their higher powered engines are not EPA Tier III.

[Bowdrie]

Of the two, I prefer Beta mainly because of the mechanical injection.
Electronic controls just add to complexity, just another roadblock to peace of mind.
Another reason is personal; Yanmars exhibit all the appearances of an exoskeletal contraption, where the entire engine is covered with bolted on devices.
By comparison, the Beta engines appear simplistic and orderly.

[CarinaPDX]

I would caution on relying on past experiences with the different brands. Once upon a time smaller marine diesels were actually designed and manufactured with their application in mind, and there were many small manufacturers. Larger engines have usually been marinized versions of utility diesels. Today it is too expensive to design a line of diesel engines just for the marine trade; even Yanmar doesn't do it (they make utility engines that are also available marinized). For instance, Volvo used to make their own engines but hasn't for about a quarter of a century - they just couldn't afford new designs. Instead they buy Shibauru diesels, marketed by Perkins, and offer them in marinized form. These engines were originally marinized by Perkins-Sabre, who sold the designs to Volvo and agreed to stay out of the small marine diesel market. Beta, Westerbeke, etc. sell Kubotas and Mitsubishis. The point is that modern engines are only made by a few, large producers, which must meet emissions standards, and are all quite good. The differences are mostly in the marinizing, which is where repairs are most likely and also most costly. For me, availability of these parts is critical, and only Volvo and Yanmar have extensive service networks worldwide. I used to have a Sabb diesel, and after the US importer stopped support I received excellent factory support from Norway - but importing engine parts in much of the world is a giant PITA. Never again. So for me the choice was Volvo vs. Yanmar. I searched the prices of various replacemet parts for both and found them to be very similar, and shockingly high. Beta is apparently far more reasonable but back to importing parts.

BTW the newer D-series Volvos are not electronically controlled engines. They do have an electronics box that converts analog sensor inputs to digital, for output to the displays. They also have relays for start, stop, and glow plugs, operated from push buttons. If it fails, as seems to happen a bit too frequently, it does not stop the engine from operating. Those who have experienced such problems have often wired in simple switches and a 3rd party data conversion box. The engine itself is very old school and will happily run without electricity, although that is not a good idea without gauges.

Greg

[Adelie]

Originally Posted by pianopraze

I feel much more comfortable repairing/using an outboard. I can pick it up take it apart, and put it back together. You can swap dingy motor out in an emergency. Worst case it’s not a fortune to buy a new one. And not hard to take off boat and replace. Like I did on my Prout. Felt very safe with a new Honda when I was docking.

Weirdly, an inboard scares the crap out of me. I don’t work on cars. Just motorcycles and outboards.

What is best engines to look for if I have to get inboard?

Perkins? Yanmar? Not sure I would trust a Volvo. Everyone with a Volvo car I’ve known ended up replacing car when engine went out. Perkins sounds good but questionable getting parts? Yanmar sounds good as you can get parts…

Going to buy another Catamaran (hopefully 2000 or newer), just starting the search. If I can get dual Yamahas out boards I will, but if they have to be inboards what is the best?

If you have to have an inboard, a BetaMarine would be a good bet. They are marinized Kubota tractor motors so regular parts are available round the world. It would probably not be OEM though, it would be a replacement motor.

I am partial to outboards. Going down that road I would get a Yamaha high thrust. A high thrust motor is optimized for displacement speeds rather than planing speeds so you get slightly better top displacement speed or significantly better fuel economy compared to a regular motor of the same HP. The tradeoff is a lower planing top speed if you put the motor on a dinghy.

[Statistical]

Yanmar

parts are easily available and reasonably priced

[SailingHarmonie]

Originally Posted by Adelie

If you have to have an inboard, a BetaMarine would be a good bet. They are marinized Kubota tractor motors so regular parts are available round the world. It would probably not be OEM though, it would be a replacement motor.

I keep hearing this, over and over again, "They are tractor engines. You can get parts anywhere in the world."

There is a catch... You can get parts anywhere there are tractors. You might not have noticed but sailboats and tractors do not overlap in a lot of places. How many Kubota tractor dealers are there stocking parts in the West Indies? (Hint: Less than 2). How about in Oceania? Are there any Kubota tractor dealers stocking parts between the Panama and New Zealand? But, hey, if you are sailing in Iowa, you are all set!

And, as somebody has pointed out above, the parts most often needed are the marinization bits, which don't come from the tractor dealers anyway.

I complain as much as anybody about the price of Volvo parts, but every time I have needed a part for our 26 year old engine, they have had it in stock and on the shelf in Martinique, Sint Marrtin, Florida, or Annapolis. In the grand scheme of things, parts costs for our diesel are lost in the rounding errors for all the other maintenance costs. We put 400 to 500 hours on our engine a year, and if we spend over $1000 on engine parts in a year that's exceptional.