Serpentine belts ???

[bobsadler]

Hi,

My boat has a YANMAR 4LH-HTE marine diesel fitted with a BALMAR 60-100-SR-IG alternator. Over the years I have noticed a lot of black “dust” about the alternator and assumed it was V-belt wear (I replace the belt each year). An experienced YANMAR mechanic recently advised me that the belt wear was a result of the much higher torque requirements of the BALMAR alternator and similar belt wear would not have been experienced with the original YANMAR alternator.

He recommended I use a conversion kit - such as is supplied by ElectroMaax ( https://www.electromaax.com/product-...-upgrade-kits/ ) - and in future use a “serpentine” belt rather than a V-belt (he had done a number of these conversions).

A couple of questions:

1) Is the explanation for the belt wear I’m seeing probably correct ?
2) Can anyone who has installed of these conversion kits and switched to a serpentine belt let me know if they’ve been happy with the result or not ?

All advice gratefully received.

Regards,

Bob

[jamhass]

Don't know about serpentine belts, but Balmar regulators have a setting for managing belt loads which helps avoid belt dusting. Try here:
https://marinehowto.com/programming-...age-regulator/

[Stu Jackson]

Do you have an external regulator?

[john61ct]

Yes all that is true, assuming he looked at alignment, right belt profile for the pulleys etc.

Reducing max output drawn will be cheaper than the conversion if you don't need it, also help the alt last.

What battery bank, how big?

[bobsadler]

Thanks for the inputs

External BALMAR regulator and 3 x 220Ah batteries

Regards

Bob

[john61ct]

We can advise better if you give more precise details on what models.

[a64pilot]

I still scratch my head why someone would pay big $$ for a big alternator, then turn its output down to a cheap alternators level to keep it from chewing up belts.
I’d say you have a good, knowledgeable mechanic.

[NYSail]

I am installing a 150 amp balmar with mc614 regulator and the serpentine belt kit. Balmar has a serpentine belt kits that fits our engines perfectly. You will not have any dust and belts will last a long time. If you go on compass marine “how to by compass marine” he sells them and his price was the best u could find. I have the 4JH4E yanmar.

Good luck
Greg

[SV Bacchus]

Originally Posted by a64pilot

I’d say you have a good, knowledgeable mechanic.

Agreed, his advice was correct.

[john61ct]

Originally Posted by a64pilot

I still scratch my head why someone would pay big $$ for a big alternator, then turn its output down to a cheap alternators level to keep it from chewing up belts.

The serpentine conversion may be very expensive, and

the incremental power between where dusting occurs and peak production may not in fact be needed

and it is generally a good idea, if you have a bank that is trying to draw peak output levels,

to use the current limiting features of your sophisticated VR and

extend the lifetime of your alt.

A corollary - if you know your bank wants 150A for long periods, then install a 200A alt and derate it

[NYSail]

Less than $400 and worth every dime

[evm1024]

Short term:

1) switch to premium belts if you are not already using them (Gates Green strip and other top rated belts)

2) use the largest belt that fits your pulleys properly

3) verify alignment and belt tension

4) live with the dust (carry a spare belt of course)

5) Set the belt manager to a setting that reduces belt dust to an OK level.

Long term:

1) evaluate your charging needs

2) if your "short term" fix works then you are good to go.

3) if your "short term" fix does not cut it then consider converting to a serpentine belt and a higher output alternator e.g. Balmar AT-165.

Considerations:

1) the stock Yanmar alternator is designed to charge the starting battery. It will quickly heat up and only put (oh say) 35 amps out when hot as a guess.

2) Your existing Balmar alternator will also heat up and likely would only produce 70 or 80 amps for and hour or few. It will likely drop down to 50 or 60 amps out in a fully hot condition (hot alt and hot engine room)

3) de-rating your existing alternator with the belt manager could get you 50 or 60 amps for hours with minimal belt dust. And an overall higher charging rate.

4) the AT-165 balmars with a serpentine conversion will get you 90 to 120 amps for hours with very little dust (most likely no dust from the serpentine belt).

Lastly do not run any alt with an external regulator without a temp sensor on the alt.


Just a few thoughts for what they are worth. Searching for which vee belt to use on CF would be worth your while. There have been some very good discussions on them.

Regards

[jdazey]

Our catamaran with two 3JH2TE Yanmars was eating belts, regulators, alternators for years through prior owners. There was a ton of rubber dust from the belts. We have 800ah of batteries, and the loads were too much for the belts. Sooo.... We bit the bullet, bought two of the serpentine kits from Electromaxx, problem almost solved.


Almost means that the machine screws that attach the crankshaft pulley to the original pulley are too long and failed to hold the new pulley tight. Ordered a new pulley and will get shorter screws. For the cost of the kit, that's an almost inexcusable error, but as I said, the kit solves the problem.

[a64pilot]

Originally Posted by john61ct

A corollary - if you know your bank wants 150A for long periods, then install a 200A alt and derate it

I don’t think you can get anywhere near 150 amps out of a small frame Alt. continuously.
I keep asking and not getting answers. For instance, one well known and respected individual is apparently pushing a small frame for all its worth, had Mark Grasser I think remove the diodes and remote them.
However he didn’t start with a 200 amp Alt, he started with a 130.

[ggray]

I Had considered a serpentine belt system, but price gave me pause.

As mentioned, make sure you are using a superior belt. I use Dayco Top cog.

Can you install a larger alternator sheave? I did, to slightly slow down alternator speed, which should reduce the charge current (thus belt load), but more importantly give a larger belt contact area, and the belt will have more "leverage" on the alternator shaft. Lots cheaper than a serpentine belt/ sheaves.

One thing you probably can do is if batteries are deeply discharged, when you first start charging, charge only one bank (if you are set up this way). As charge current drops, switch to other bank, and after a while combine the banks for charging.