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Old 31-12-2017, 12:52   #1
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“We don’t know if it runs...”

Howdy folks,
Looking at a phenomenal deal on a Pearson 30 with the notorious Atomic gas engine. Owners say “we don’t know if it runs because we haven’t started it in several years”.

Naturally, I want to know if it runs (I know deep down it won’t/shouldn’t), if it’s close to running with some TLC, or if it would be best used as an anchor. How should I go about this? I know cranking an airplane engine that hasn’t been run in a long time can actually do significant damage until it’s been torn apart and prepped.

Should I just view the engine as inoperative to begin with during the inspection/pre-buy or shall I actually try it? Boat is in the water and it’s freezing so the prop is effectively impossible to get at. They’re only asking $1500 so I don’t think it’s worth a survey, but I would pull it out to clean/repaint/fix blisters if I buy it.

I am well aware that I could/will sink about 6k or more into that engine, so I may just mount an outboard on the back and be done with it. Thoughts on that route, too?
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Old 31-12-2017, 13:06   #2
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Re: “We don’t know if it runs...”

Quote:
Originally Posted by SeaplaneDriver View Post
Howdy folks,
Looking at a phenomenal deal on a Pearson 30 with the notorious Atomic gas engine. Owners say “we don’t know if it runs because we haven’t started it in several years”.

Naturally, I want to know if it runs (I know deep down it won’t/shouldn’t), if it’s close to running with some TLC, or if it would be best used as an anchor. How should I go about this? I know cranking an airplane engine that hasn’t been run in a long time can actually do significant damage until it’s been torn apart and prepped.

Should I just view the engine as inoperative to begin with during the inspection/pre-buy or shall I actually try it? Boat is in the water and it’s freezing so the prop is effectively impossible to get at. They’re only asking $1500 so I don’t think it’s worth a survey, but I would pull it out to clean/repaint/fix blisters if I buy it.

I am well aware that I could/will sink about 6k or more into that engine, so I may just mount an outboard on the back and be done with it. Thoughts on that route, too?
Purchase as if the engine is junk. If you can get it running, then good for you. If you cannot, then find a good used diesel (many available for under $2k) to install.

You will be dissatisfied with an outboard on the transom in the long run. Small used diesels are dirt cheap.
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Old 31-12-2017, 13:13   #3
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Re: “We don’t know if it runs...”

Universal made its diesel models with exact foot print of the gas Atomic. So your best bet would be to shop around for a used Universal 16hp or thereabouts for under $2K and if you are handy enough to swap the motors you can have a decent boat for short money. Otherwise it's not a deal at all even if the seller giveaways the boat for free.

A 30 ft boat with a gas Atomic means that it's over 35 years old. Unless the engine is in pristine shape such a boat without the working engine has a negative worth value. Meaning if you sink in $10-12K for a new diesel or $5-6K for a used one you will still have a boat which is not worth more than $4-5K. And then you'd have to calculate/add any storage, unforeseen or other costs. When you swap engines you always have all kinds of unforeseen cost/expenses. Plus your time whatever its worth.

You are actually better of getting a well found similar boat for $8-10K and go sailing from day one.
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Old 31-12-2017, 13:33   #4
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Re: “We don’t know if it runs...”

Do a compression test. Remove the plugs and use a normal automotive tester and see if all 4 cylinders are nearly the same. Take a battery with you unless you know theirs is good. A A4 will run with rather low compression, but if you have 3 cylinders reading one thing and one reading much lower you probably have an expensive project ahead. I went and looked at one for sale recently that was 'RUNNING GREAT' but there was no battery on the boat. I had put a battery in the back of my truck just in case. Cylinder 1 and 4 were about 95 PSI, but 2 and 3 were around 40 PSI. I walked away. If the engine hasnt been run for a few years the compression may be low, but if they are similar they will probably come up after a couple of hours running. Carbs and ignition systems are pricey, but not nearly as pricey as injection pumps and injectors. The real problem with replacing an A4 on a budget is the other changes that go along with an engine swap. Exhaust system, new engine beds, new fuel lines and filters, probably a different prop all add up. There is nothing wrong with an A4 if you follow the fuel safety rules. _____Grant.
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Old 31-12-2017, 13:48   #5
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Re: “We don’t know if it runs...”

I have heard some amazing stories of A4s but if it were me I'd plan on a diesel implant in the cost analysis.......
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Old 31-12-2017, 14:04   #6
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Re: “We don’t know if it runs...”

If the boats in good shape and all together, suits your needs w an outboard, then go for it. Remove the old lug and free some primo space up while lightening her up a bit for your gear stashing. If any parts are good you may be able to recycle it for a couple $$ anchors aweigh, and cheers!
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Old 31-12-2017, 14:09   #7
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Re: “We don’t know if it runs...”

Atomic 4 is a great engine, perfect for a boat that is day sailed or cruised locally.
Compression ratio is 6:1, it's a low stressed engine.
If the engine has been dormant and wasn't winterized the valves may be rusty.
I'd squirt some marvel mystery oil in the cylinders let it sit and try to crank it over.
Low compression could be as simple as the head gasket. It's a flathead so removing the head is easy.
Check Moyer marine website for everything you would want for an atomic 4.
I have the original atomic 4 in our 1973 Pearson 10M.
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Old 01-01-2018, 06:35   #8
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Re: “We don’t know if it runs...”

Check the rigging, make sure all the seacocks are functioning, look for leaks in the deck (a moisture meter is worthwhile) and look at the wiring. Those things can set you back (almost) as much as a new engine.
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Old 01-01-2018, 07:37   #9
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Re: “We don’t know if it runs...”

Let me translate for you...

"We don't know if it runs" means "It doesn't run, but we don't want to admit it."

Bottom line, the only sane thing for you to do is to proceed the same as you would if they had told you the engine is just a big pile of non-functioning rust.

Good luck.
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Old 01-01-2018, 07:46   #10
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Re: “We don’t know if it runs...”

Owners say “we don’t know if it runs because we haven’t started it in several years”.
"So we are looking for someone (you) to PAY us to make this your problem."
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Old 01-01-2018, 07:53   #11
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Re: “We don’t know if it runs...”

Maintenance records what's that? Try to get any records you can for her. Are you handy or familiar with boats at all? Deck leaks can be a nightmare and are way to common. Even if the engine will run the prop, shaft, strut, and bearing could all be toast from not being maintained properly. Look carefully in and out and run the hose on deck for a while looking for leaks inside and bilge level.
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Old 01-01-2018, 08:03   #12
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Re: “We don’t know if it runs...”

For comparison, a guy just bought a Pearson 26 up here for about $3,000.

It was in very good shape with a good running 8-9.9 2 stroke outboard.

But if this boat is the one you want, disregard the engine at this point especially on a $1,500.00 boat and concentrate on whether the boat leaks, is structurally sound, etc

Boats with running engines on the same lake that can be had for probably :$2,500 - $4,000

1981 United Sailing US Yachts US27 sailboat for sale in North Carolina

1991 Helms Helms sailboat for sale in North Carolina
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Old 01-01-2018, 08:06   #13
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Re: “We don’t know if it runs...”

Is this really a "phenomenal" deal on a Pearson 30, or is it a derelict Pearson 30 that is either appropriately or over priced? Is the rigging up to date, the deck solid with no water penetration, seacocks are good, sails are fresh enough to serve for many seasons, etc.?

What can you tell us about the rest of the boat?

If the engine is the only issue, it's worth considering. Depending on how you're going to use the boat (on Lake Norman?), an Atomic might be just fine.

Reading between the lines, it appears your means are limited, because if they weren't, a prudent person would have a survey done, and would haul the boat for an inspection of the bottom, prop, and cutlass. Whether or not to have a survey done has less to do with the price of the boat and more to do with what the boat could cost you after acquire it.

If you decide to roll the dice on a possibly derelict vessel, you should have a good cushion in the bank. If enough of the systems are compromised, $10,000.00 would be a good start.
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Old 01-01-2018, 08:16   #14
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Re: “We don’t know if it runs...”

Do some research on Moyer Marine Atomic 4 Engine Rebuilding and Parts. The forums are a wealth of information and help. The A4 is pretty tough, and can be brought back to life from pretty dismal condition. That said, if you are not up to doing the work yourself, you will quickly find your self in a very expensive endeavor, which can easily exceed the value of the boat. Same for a diesel conversion, you may get the motor cheaply, but if you have to pay someone to do the swap you will easily pay thousands more than you did for the boat.
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Old 01-01-2018, 08:51   #15
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Re: “We don’t know if it runs...”

Assume the engine is junk, be very careful on inspecting everything you can get to and offer or reject based on your findings. Factor the cost of an outboard installed into figuring your sail away cost. You might check local mechanics to see how much an engine inspection might cost.
I suspect this is one of those 'great deals' that turns out to be awful and would keep looking.
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