Are the days of satellite GPS navigation numbered??

[coopec43]

Good points. I don't want to get into a detailed discussion right now.

BUT you say

"Google is not the only major tech company to face increased emissions due to AI demand. Microsoft reported in May that its total carbon emissions rose nearly 30% since 2020 primarily due to the construction of data centers.

Sure the tech companies have increased emissions but what about AI benefits to the global environment? AI will help the world reduce global warming!

(Sorry I haven't got time right now to argue constructively but here is a link that would seem to contradict your post)


9 ways AI is helping tackle climate change


The World Economic Forum
https://www.weforum.org › agenda › 2024/02 › ai-com...

12 Feb 2024 — AI tools that predict weather, track icebergs, recycle more waste and find plastic in the ocean are helping to combat climate change.

[CaptTom]

Originally Posted by coopec43

Your comment amuses me! You make a mockery of AI . But I'm not surprised because all new developments have had their doubters...

You missed the point. I was trying to make a mockery of the BS techno-babble in that (and so many) articles these days. And the fact that they need to plug the abbreviation "AI" into just about every sentence, whether it's relevant to the issue or not.

Articles written by Tech bros for the benefit venture capitalists are among the most humorous to be found.

Now, about AI. I'm by no means a doubter. I dabble with it, and I can see a lot of very real benefits. But I see even more hype and BS. Will it profoundly change our world? Most certainly. Will it change our world in exactly the way all the hype suggests? Doubtful.

There will be winners and losers. Pros and cons. Benefits and challenges. But in the end it's a tool, and we'll learn to use it in different ways. Or it'll learn to use us. The thing is, at this point we just don't know.

But there is a LOT of money out there chasing it, and a lot of people trying to attract that money. Hence the mockery.

[coopec43]

My apologies! (Maybe I need a bit of AI?)

Your comment struck a chord

"There will be winners and losers. Pros and cons. Benefits and challenges. But in the end it's a tool, and we'll learn to use it in different ways. Or it'll learn to use us."

There's AI and AGI. It is the AGI that is the worry.

"AI is thus a computer science discipline that enables software to solve novel and difficult tasks with human-level performance. In contrast, an AGI system can solve problems in various domains, like a human being, without manual intervention."

[SeanPatrick]

Expectation: The internet will change the world. Everyone will have all the information they need or want, right at their fingertips.

Reality: Mostly porn and pointless social media posts.


... We'll see about AI.

[thinwater]

If a boat has a flux gate compass (probably do to run the autopilot) and a clean, functional speed sensor, is seems like setting up an automated DR system would be a simple matter of coding. It won't know about leeway or currents. A manual correction could be input (for example, you can estimate leeway by looking at your wake). A periodic true up with known positions could be included, which in theory would allow the DR program to get a little smarter.


Not a solution, but adequate for short runs and probably adequate to get around periodic outages.



An improved TTW speed sensor would help. Current will always be a problem, since it is extremely variable in some places.

[sailingharry]

Originally Posted by thinwater

If a boat has a flux gate compass (probably do to run the autopilot) and a clean, functional speed sensor, is seems like setting up an automated DR system would be a simple matter of coding. It won't know about leeway or currents. A manual correction could be input (for example, you can estimate leeway by looking at your wake). A periodic true up with known positions could be included, which in theory would allow the DR program to get a little smarter.

Not a solution, but adequate for short runs and probably adequate to get around periodic outages.

An improved TTW speed sensor would help. Current will always be a problem, since it is extremely variable in some places.

It's been a minute or two since I stood watch on the bridge of a Navy ship. But I have this dim recollection that in the 80's, the Navy used just what you describe. It was an automated arm (or pencil, or whatever) that would move over a chart on the table. It used the gyro compass and (presumably-- I forget) some sort of speed sensor (or maybe the "speed sensor" was a 3rd class petty officer turning a knob based on the last engine order). That was in the cutting edge of technology (ie, 1980-something...LOL).

[Icarus]

Paper charts, sextant, compass, nautical almanac and sight reduction tables?
Or a Tamaya NC 2000 nav computer?
Works everything...

[Dr. D]

Chech this out:
https://www.wheresyoured.at/pop-culture/

[SeanPatrick]

Originally Posted by sailingharry

It's been a minute or two since I stood watch on the bridge of a Navy ship. But I have this dim recollection that in the 80's, the Navy used just what you describe. It was an automated arm (or pencil, or whatever) that would move over a chart on the table. It used the gyro compass and (presumably-- I forget) some sort of speed sensor (or maybe the "speed sensor" was a 3rd class petty officer turning a knob based on the last engine order). That was in the cutting edge of technology (ie, 1980-something...LOL).

At least as far back as WWII, ships like the Fletcher-class destroyer had what was called a "DRT", or "dead reckoning tracer". It was a table that had a transparent top, underneath of which was an illuminated compass rose attached to a set of rails that could move. The rails were controlled by a mechanical computer that was being fed the ship's course and speed, and it would move the compass rose accordingly. A piece of paper could be placed on top of the table and the ship's position at the center of the compass could be plotted relative to other objects. But, AFAIK, that was used mostly for combat maneuvers, not for navigation.


You can see it in the beginning of this video:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=x7SPcA6Djrk

[sailingharry]

Originally Posted by SeanPatrick

At least as far back as WWII, ships like the Fletcher-class destroyer had what was called a "DRT", or "dead reckoning tracer". It was a table that had a transparent top, underneath of which was an illuminated compass rose attached to a set of rails that could move. The rails were controlled by a mechanical computer that was being fed the ship's course and speed, and it would move the compass rose accordingly. A piece of paper could be placed on top of the table and the ship's position at the center of the compass could be plotted relative to other objects. But, AFAIK, that was used mostly for combat maneuvers, not for navigation.

Yes, exactly. You have a much clearer memory of it, but that's exactly what I was talking about. I think you are right that it wasn't actually used for "navigation" because, frankly, I don't think I ever saw it actually "used." I knew it existed, I knew its fundamental principle, but all our navigation (or more accurately, "piloting") was done with sights from the peloris and a quartermaster plotting them on the chart -- and in tight quarters, they could update those fixes every minute or so!