Dickinson Heater Questions - V.S. Sigmar V.S.?

[suesue]

Dickinson Heater Questions - V.S. Sigmar V.S.?

HI,

I've read the posts here , but gotten more confused. I am probably interested in a diesel version Dickinson heater.

My main safety / questions would be:

1. Can this be run 24/7 while sleeping?

2 In a calm, will the diesel smoke hang around, and smell up the boat? { or does it disperse vertically ? }

My Neighbor bought a new, solid fuel Dickinson. It does look pretty light weight.

But what's more surprising is the pipe he bought with it.
It is really light gauge - it's the manufactures pipe. It's not even true pipe - it looks like thin stainless curved and riveted together. It looks no more robust than pellet stove pipe - much cheaper bought at the home box store. { Although those aren't stainless } Is stainless
much better for diesel fire?

For the same price, my ex used to get thick stainless pipe for his car projects. Much different quality.

I read about old timers swearing by these heaters - but are the new ones in the same league as the old?

Would the sigmar 100 be better made you think?

Or what do people recommend for 24/7 heat now?

thanks

Sue

[suesue]

3.

A third question would be diesel lower sulfur fuel. I guess that is the most prominent US fuel available now.

One poster { circa 2013? } was very upset with this fuel not working with his Dickinson.

And the retrofit he was promised - only after complaining apparently - didn't appear to appease him.

Are the 2016 Dickinson release heaters coming equipped for this prevalent diesel fuel source? Is the burn satisfactory?

How do other manufactures deal with this new diesel source?

Any other issues?

thanks

[alctel]

I've a dickinson

1) I've run my on low overnight. Just be careful nothing flammable nearby, and have carbon monoxide and smoke detectors!

2) Never seen this

3) Never had a problem with low sulphur - I read the same thread you did before I bought mine and I think he just didn't know how to use it correctly. Mine came with an optional add in for low sulphur fuels but I've never bothered to use it and it runs fine

[suesue]

Originally Posted by alctel

I've a dickinson

1) I've run my on low overnight. Just be careful nothing flammable nearby, and have carbon monoxide and smoke detectors!

............thanks

2) Never seen this

............thats good to know.

3) Never had a problem with low sulphur - I read the same thread you did before I bought mine and I think he just didn't know how to use it correctly. Mine came with an optional add in for low sulphur fuels but I've never bothered to use it and it runs fine

.............well it seems possibly a non issue then? great. Yes the
poor man seemed to get more and more frustrated as he went on.


I note I only learned of Pellets and Pellet stoves when my neighbor said he could burn pellets in this Dickinson Solid Fuel.

Although that is not primarily a pellet stove. But as Ive looked at the
huge number of models of pellet stoves available-- Im wondering if thats
perhaps the way to go?

[GordMay]

Greetings and welcome aboard the CF, Sue.

[alctel]

Originally Posted by suesue

.............well it seems possibly a non issue then? great. Yes the
poor man seemed to get more and more frustrated as he went on.


I note I only learned of Pellets and Pellet stoves when my neighbor said he could burn pellets in this Dickinson Solid Fuel.

Although that is not primarily a pellet stove. But as Ive looked at the
huge number of models of pellet stoves available-- Im wondering if thats
perhaps the way to go?

Maybe? Though storage for all the pellets is a problem I imagine, and you can't easily leave it on overnight

Nothing beats the ambiance of a wood stove though, for sure

[redhead]

Hi Sue - Welcome to CF. I've been running my Dickenson diesel for the last 48 hours. I leave the companionway cracked open a bit (because it gets a bit too hot this early in the season) and we have a smoke/co2 alarm in the aft quarters.

Last winter I left it running on 1.5 (low) for weeks. I would check it faithfully every day and it never sooted up the eisenglass (sp?) so it seemed fine. Outside there is a very fine carbon ash in about 1' diameter circle around the chimney. It cleans up well with Simple Green or Fantastik.

We have another, larger Dickenson stove forward that provides heat, cooking and hot water but we turn it off each night as we sleep in the aft cabin so we're not there to monitor. I'm pleased with both the stoves, it makes cold, wet winters bearable up here!

[seasick]

I was so impressed by the heat output of the Dickensen Diesel heater we had on our boat, that we bought another for our log cabin on Port Madison Bay and let it run from November till March.

[Hyrdflyr]

I love my Dickenson heater on my boat. I have had various diesel stoves on boats for over 25 years and they work for me. That said, They do require an understanding of their operation to use without issues. Installation and draft is critical. Understanding how the fuel/ air ratio effects operation is the key to sucessful use. If you are comfortable with learning from someone knowledgeable, then go for it. They are amazingly efficient and use little of no electricity. Both Sigmar and Dickenson operate similarly.

If your fuel supply is lower than the stove you will need a regulated low pressure pump to provide fuel to the stove under slight pressure. I do not recommend a gravity tank that would require refilling regularly. Sooner of later it will overfill and spill, or is just generally a pain if used routinely.

Get one of the emergency overheat shut off fuel valves when you install the unit. It has a sensor which straps to the back of the flue and shut off the fuel supply if it overheats. Good insurance.

Make sure that you have a barometric Damper.

Have at least 5 feet of flue for the best operation. I have an extra section of flue I remove when under sail and install when needed.

Buy a self energizing fan from a wood stove dealer, and strap it to the top of the stove for free heat circulation in the cabin. Buy some 4 inch computer fans to increase circulation to other sections of the boat. I also have a 120 volt little 6 inch clamp on fan that only draws 1.3 amps that i use at anchor.

All of the above have kept us warm in coastal Alaska all the way south to the San Juans. If you have doubts of your ability to deal with these fairly simple requirements, then get a forced air unit such as an Espar that is more sophisticated but less demanding in operation. Then find an knowledgeable dealer who can help you maintain it.

Stay warm.

[Lepke]

I'm old and have been running diesel stoves all my life. In the cold they run 24/7. Properly installed, they run fine. If fuel is giving too much soot, there are catalyst additives costing a few cents to treat a gallon that will make the diesel burn hotter and cleaner.
I have found heating costs for my boat are cheapest with pellets ($5/40# bag), then diesel ($2/gallon), then electricity (.07/kwh at winter dock).
I have a diesel boiler, like a big Webasco, that can also be heated by water tubes in the pellet stove. I can heat the whole 83' boat with pellets and in the coldest weather (below 15°F) spend about $10/day. Mild winter weather about $1.50/day. Less if the diesel stove is running.

[CarinaPDX]

I agree that the stove pipes seem to have thin walls but they do hold up for the long haul. Don't worry about them. BTW consider putting sheet metal screws through the joints so that they can't come apart if accidentally hit. Also put heat shields where you might accidentally touch the pipes - that can be very painful. A 45º jog in the exhaust is a good thing, both for the draft inside the pipe and for breaking the convection flow on the outside which can cook the overhead around the exhaust.

I have had a Sigmar for many years. It kept me warm and dry over a Swedish winter so I am a fan. Sigmar has a few small advantages over the Dickinson stoves but either works fine. The Sigmar is a bit more efficient due to the cylindrical burners. My recommendation is to choose the one that best fits your application, with a slight preference for Sigmar.

One of the advantages that the Sigmar has is that it is designed for bringing air into the burner from outside through a second stove pipe. This is a great solution for preventing a backdraft putting out the flame and then re-igniting, creating a mess - but very few install it this way. Alternatively buy the draft assist fan and use it on windy days. Without the dedicated air supply it is necessary to allow for air intake into the cabin to replace the air that goes up the chimney - which is a big win for keeping the interior dry.

The burner needs to be cleaned every couple of months of continuous operation - no big deal. If it is running properly there should be little or no soot. The proper way to start it is to use an ounce or so of stove alcohol to pre-heat the burner before opening the carburetor for diesel, which greatly reduces the soot at start-up compared to the old way of just igniting a small amount of diesel in the burner (very messy).

You didn't say where you are going to use the boat. If you are staying close to home then pellets or wood might be a good solution but elsewhere it might be difficult to source. Also we are in a very damp environment so the fuel will absorb moisture. Diesel is easy to buy, can burn unattended for days, and is very compact to stow. I recommend diesel for a cruising boat.

Greg

[mitiempo]

While the design is a bit different, Dickinson and Sigmar are the same company. Sigmar was started by ex Dickinson employees and was sold to Dickinson years ago.

[UNCIVILIZED]

You'll likely be well served by a diesel heater. And it's nice to have them even if you also have a forced air setup like a Webasto, as they put out so much heat, sans electricity. Honestly, I wish that all boats were designed with having one onboard in mind. Even on boats in "moderate" climates.

Coils for heating water are advisable. Whether you wind up using them or not. Though it's sad not to. The heat's free, might as well use it. And water keeps it in the boat for longer as well as circulating it better when used in radiators.

Also, pick up one of the fans which is turned by the hot air rising off of the stove. They circulate air well, gratis.

And were it me, I'd look into adding some thermal mass in the vicinity of the stove. So that even when it's not on, or is on low, there's a good bit of heat in the boat. That way even if you turn the stove off, or close to it, when sleeping, the boat doesn't become an icebox.

If you're thinking about solid fuel stoves, especially ones that burn wood, get a good spark arresting system for them. As on Endeavor & some of the other J boats, when the stove/fireplace is in use, there's a crewman on deck who's job it is to see & extinguish any cinders which escape the chimney. Prior to their setting things like the mainsail on fire... Often a cold, & thankless job.

Edit: Does anyone have some thoughts on using finned heat exchangers on stove exhaust pipes? Perhaps ones akin to those built into the blocks of air cooled engines, or of another sort.

PS: Good (boat) insulation rocks! Heater or no.

[Siberian Sea]

If you desire to install a diesel stove or heater such as the Dickinson in your vessel I would advise to to also install one of the emergency fuel cutoff switch. It's very simple. It installs in the fuel line just before to heater carb. How it works is this. It has a temperature censor and in the event your diesel unit should become over fueled and "runs away". The excess heat will cause the safety switch to shut off the fuel. Many boats burn, I'm from Alaska and own a commercial fishing boat there. I have a Dickinson stove that runs 24/7 for months at a time but...... You need to be aware always of the hazard. Perhaps a much much safer and efficient way to go is to buy a Webasto diesel system. I have one of these too it's model "air top st 2000" and it works wonderful. Only used 1 gallen of diesel each. 24 hours. Runs supper clean and 100 per cent safe, I cannot say enough good about this heater. Best place to buy them is from a semi truck dealer like Kenworth. You can install the kit yourself. If you decide to buy one and ever have questions about it feel free to message me here. I've been using one for 10 years now.

[suesue]

Originally Posted by GordMay

Greetings and welcome aboard the CF, Sue.

Thanks! Looks like a great forum.