Fouled Bottom

[GordMay]

In-Water hull cleaning is generally frowned upon, if not outright banned.

Washington State (USA)
http://www.ecy.wa.gov/news/1999news/99-103.html


Australia and New Zealand:

Code of Practice for Antifouling and In-water Hull Cleaning and Maintenance.
http://www.deh.gov.au/coasts/polluti...ode/index.html

EPA (Australia) Consultation
”YOU MUST:
 not allow in-water hull scraping, or any process that occurs underwater, to remove applied surface coating material from the boat hull unless under extraordinary circumstances when approval by the EPA has been provided
 remove biological hull fouling and marine biota (including encrusted animals, barnacles and weeds) at facilities that have the means to capture, contain, treat and reuse or dispose of all listed wastes and pollutants to a licensed waste facility.
http://www.epacomments.sa.gov.au/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=103

[fstbttms]

Originally Posted by GordMay

In-Water hull cleaning is generally frowned upon, if not outright banned.

Washington State (USA)
http://www.ecy.wa.gov/news/1999news/99-103.html

No offense Gord, but I have earned my living cleaning boat bottoms for over 12 years. I know divers all up and down the West Coast and some on the East, and I know for a fact that hull cleaning is not banned anywhere in the U.S., regardless of what the 7-year-old document you found may say. Washington state does require a permit for hull cleaners to work and there is a restriction there on cleaning ablative paints (that is frequently ignored.) But in no state in this country is in-water hull cleaning generally restricted or even "frowned upon." There would be several million very pissed-off American boat owners, if this were the case.

[Alan Wheeler]

I know of people that speed, but if everyone on the road speed, it still doesn't make it legal.

I have to agree with fstbttms here. THere may be exceptions, but I have not seen in water bottom cleaning restricted anywhere here on the west coast.
Just remember, if bottom cleaning is oulawed, only outlaws will clean their bottoms. And nobody wants that

[fstbttms]

Originally Posted by Alan Wheeler

I know of people that speed, but if everyone on the road speed, it still doesn't make it legal.

Jeezus kee-khryst! Your point is that in-water hull cleaning is an illicit activity? Seriously, stick to what you know, because you are out of your depth here, no pun intended. I take offense at your inference that 1.- I don't know what I'm talking about and 2.- That I have spent 12 years of my life in a nefarious, below-board occupation.

In-water hull cleaning is a necessary part of boat maintenance and as such is a common, everyday occurance. As a member of the California Professional Divers Association I attend monthly meetings with representatives from the USEPA, California Regional Water Quality Control Board, Coast Guard, Dept. of Boating & Waterways, Fish & Game, harbormasters, local sheriff's and health departments and others where many water quality-related topics are discussed, anti fouling paints and in-water hull cleaning among them.

So don't tell me that hull cleaning is banned or illegal or otherwise.

Rant over.

[ssullivan]

I'll have to agree that I have never heard of any limitations here on the East coast either. In fact, racers constantly do this and I see guys swimming around scrubbing all summer - and I'm one of them.

[S/V Elusive]

In Southern CA, as Fastbottoms said, hull cleaning is done ALL the time and without (to my knowledge) restrictions. It is a big business. I have my bottom cleaned every other month. I last used the Petitt SR Trinidad on my boat, and it has lasted a little over three years with my hull still getting "Very Good" (one step down from the top rating of "Excellent") coverage and effectiveness ratings by the diver. I did my own bottom painting - using a roller, and I wasn't shy about putting it on: two coats everywhere, and a third along the waterline area and leading edges.

Most of the bottom cleaning divers, in So Cal, work for small companies. There are some independents. The rate on my boat is $1.35 a foot and $8 to change a zinc (I provide my own).

A good diver will not only clean your bottom, but will also clean your underwater instruments and through hulls (up about 6 to 8 inches or so). A really good diver will wipe down the waterline and knock the big chunks off the fenders (if they spent any time in the water) and will leave a tag that says what they did and how the boat's condition below is.

[ssullivan]

Hmmm... we have the Petitt on right now as well. Still the same growth, but it's mostly inside thru-hulls and on instruments where you either can't paint much, or where the bottom paint comes off fairly quickly. Glad to hear the pain is lasting 3 years. That's what we had hoped to get out of it as well after others said it was lasting a few years for them.

[Sandero]

I have found in LIS that all the ablative paints I have tried are equally ineffective and think a better strategy is to use inexpensive paint and pay a diver several times a season to clean the bottom and of course do some fast sailing frequently to actually let the stuff ABLATE.

Scrubbing robots are the wave of the future.

Jef
sv Shiva
Contest 36s

[Vasco]

In FL and SC I've paid $2 a foot. My experience with divers has not been the best. Last one that did my boat didn't put the zinc on right and it fell off probably the first time I motored. Some of the others took off more paint than anything. Now I haul the boat in the off season.

[S/V Elusive]

Vasco - finding a good diver is important! I asked around and talked with several people who had their boats cleaned by divers. I kept asking until I found a couple of whom agreed that diver X was really thorough (as opposed to the typical response of: "oh, he is okay, I guess"). I then contracted with the service he worked for, and specified that HE be my diver.

I also take care of my diver at Christmas time, and, offer him beer at the end of the day (when he kept his boat on my dock).

[ssullivan]

Originally Posted by defjef

I have found in LIS that all the ablative paints I have tried are equally ineffective and think a better strategy is to use inexpensive paint and pay a diver several times a season to clean the bottom and of course do some fast sailing frequently to actually let the stuff ABLATE.

Scrubbing robots are the wave of the future.

Jef
sv Shiva
Contest 36s

I agree, Jef. These aren't my home sailing waters, even though I've been in them a couple years now. The stuff that grows in the LIS is just crazy. Brown, slimy, weird stuff. And boy does it grow. Even with the Petitt, the growth is just like the cheapest Interlux.

[fstbttms]

Originally Posted by defjef

Scrubbing robots are the wave of the future.

When they invent one that can change zincs and clean running gear, then I'll be worried.

[fstbttms]

Originally Posted by GordMay

In-Water hull cleaning is generally frowned upon, if not outright banned.

Washington State (USA)
http://www.ecy.wa.gov/news/1999news/99-103.html

Gord, I don't know if you read the text of the article you linked to, but I just did. The article states only that ablative paints should be not be cleaned in Washington, not a general ban on in-water hull cleaning. I have referred to this restriction several times in this thread.

[Alan Wheeler]

Fstbttms, first of all, pull your head in. I did not accuse you of anything and there was no need to respond in the way you did. We (and I say this as Admin and not from the fact it was directed at me) do not want to see personal attacks on this board thank-you.
Gord posted an article that stated the agency would prosecute offenders, so there must be some form of legality implied. I don't care if it was for Washington or where, I have no idea how your laws work in your country and you need to remember this is not an American only Board. Participants are from all over the world. My comment was in general, if it is illegal, then surely it is illegal, no matter how many flaunt YOUR law. Here in NZ, if something like that was published in Wellington, (Our capital, Aint Washington yours??) it would be legal Nation wide.
I am not/was not suggesting anything personal against you, I was making a general lanket comment based on what some authority has placed on a piece of paper. Maybe it's legal, maybe it's not, I don't know, but for an authority to make a document like that and suggest a fine of the amount stated and not have any teeth to prosecute, then it's a bit of a joke ain't it?? We have issues like that here in NZ as well. But it only takes one that is made example of that finaly turns everyones head that the law is seriouse about making the point.
I did not and do not appreciate your reply to me and I suggest you respond in the manner and context in which this board is about in future thank-you.

Now back to the context of this thread. Is it possible that the view of "hull cleaning" and the article that Gord posted are refering to two very different aspects of the job. Is it possible that the "hull cleaning" from your point of view is as simple as that. Cleaning slime and growth off the hulls, but not removing the paint it's self. Is it possible that the Article Gord posted is refering to removal of the paint in it's entirety. fstbttms, I remember you made a comment in a different thread series about some agency concerned with the copper content in the water. Is this document in relation to that perhaps??