Hydraulic Steering Hoses - Getting a Headache

[Chotu]

1). My helm says to use all copper for best performance and responsive steering.

2) My rams say to use flexible hose to protect from vibration. The helm and rams are from the SAME MANUFACTURER!!

3) the autopilot hydraulic pump says to use soft hoses for the connections also to protect from vibration.

4). I have kickup rudders so I am definitely using flexible hose at the rams to allow movement when the rudder kicks up.

Question: are there sources anyone knows of to get good quality hydraulic hoses that have minimum 1000psi operating pressure and 5000psi burst pressure that don’t cost $124 each? Ones with very little give in them that don’t expand when pressure builds inside? Industrial sources?

I have to get 1/4” BSP or NPT fittings on these hoses. I also have to get whatever the type is fitting is that connects to the rand themselves and also connect them to the copper however which way is simple.

For a layout I was thinking copper all the way back to the area of the rudders, then a 4ft or 6ft section of hose to handle the kickup and vibration.

Then I was thinking of putting the hydraulic autopilot pump in the aft structural beam. It has to be as close to the rams as possible. I was going to run copper to that, but get the smallest little sections of hydraulic hose to connect to it to protect against vibration.

There is a “no pressure “ return line from the autopilot pump to the helm. What hose should I use for that? It has to stand up to harsh chemicals like steering fluid and automatic transmission fluid.

I also have the liquid tie bar valve but was going to just run copper to that.

Did this make any sense to anyone? Any comments? Room for improvement? Ideas on where to get good non-marine hose and fittings?

[Bycrick]

The two times I installed hydraulic steering, it was all done in copper tubing, except for a short (18-24”) tail to the cylinder. The pumps were bolted to bulkheads and didn’t move. If I wanted the pump more quiet, then mount it on something flexible and use two more short pigtails. Theoretically, flexible hose will expand under pressure and result in some slop in the steering.

[pcmm]

On my setup I've got flexible MSH hose (marine Steering Hose) with parker field installable fittings on each end. That length of MSH is just 2ft(ish) to get to the relief valve block and then its all solid copper to get to the help (14ish feet)

My hydraulic setup is a Hynautic pressurized 3 hose system.

[Chotu]

OK. Between both of you guys and some response from Dometic/SeaStar, it looks like I can run all copper and some short little flexible hose on the end to connect to the Rams.

Nice tip on those Parker Field installable fittings. That’s the kind of thing I’m looking for. Because I need eight little ends and they’re like $100 each. Even the 2 foot section. It’s the same price as the 12 foot section. Oddly.

So I was trying to find some proper hydraulic hose somewhere with fittings that I can install. I will Google the Parker ones right now.

[PippaB]

McMaster has 2' whips for ~$30 each depending on what ID you need. My only issue with these particular items is they use carbon steel ends and IME they cause rust stains regardless of how dry you keep the area. Also, you don't get much hose choice.

A quick check at Discount Hydraulic Hose says 3/8" hose (guessing what you need) with 5000 psi working pressure is ~$2-3/foot, and fittings, installed, are about $10-15 each end, for a total of $30-40 for a two-foot whip. Personally I prefer to use brass fittings, for the reasons noted above. I also prefer 100% non-metallic reinforcement in the hose for the same reasons, if the outer jacket splits little and exposes a metal braid you once again have a mess on your hands.

No reason you should need to go online though, hydraulic hose shops are ubiquitous, pretty much every town over 10,000 people or so has at least one.

[deblen]

https://www.parker.com/literature/Po...AT_4400_UK.pdf




https://www.grainger.com/category/pi...ategoryIndex=3

[guyrj33]

It seems like there are less expensive options available, for example.

https://www.amazon.com/Value-Degree-...256339011&th=1

[deblen]

https://ph.parker.com/us/en/marine-s...ponse-hose-msh


or any tractor supply/hydraulic shop will make hoses to your specs. Just take the helm & ram to them.
Don't worry about using all hose-it will work fine. / Len

[captlloyd]

You can also do a search for Northern Equipment Tools on the Internet. Mail order industrial hydraulic hoses and fittings.

[Scubaseas]

As others have said any decent size town will have people that make up hydraulic hoses. I use my local NAPA store. Or Summit Racing. Suggest you put covers on any exposed hoses for UV resistance. Wire split looms work OK as do sewn sunbrella that matches your canvas.

[Chotu]

Originally Posted by captlloyd

You can also do a search for Northern Equipment Tools on the Internet. Mail order industrial hydraulic hoses and fittings.

Northern Tool was somewhere I was considering but the hoses looked too weak. Might need another look

[Chotu]

Originally Posted by deblen

https://ph.parker.com/us/en/marine-s...ponse-hose-msh


or any tractor supply/hydraulic shop will make hoses to your specs. Just take the helm & ram to them.
Don't worry about using all hose-it will work fine. / Len

Wow! That’s true! Maybe I’ll go to Tractor Supply.

Good retail ideas.

[Squanderbucks]

I recently removed and replaced my hydraulic steering hoses and installed larger diameter copper. That means that anywhere there is a break in the copper pipe to connect another device such as autopilot or steering ram the copper stops and flexible transition hoses are used to join up to the devices.
A trick I was taught to cut down noise and corrosion on the pipes is to cover each section except for the last 10-12 inches to allow for flare fittings to slide and connect with clear vinyl hose - the cheap stuff. Not with reinforcement and thin wall. There is some that is thicker walled and some that is thinner. Get the thin wall. Before inserting the copper run some lube such as diesel fuel in the hose to wet it and it will slide in like butter.
The thicker vinyl will work but much harder to work with.

If you have bends in the copper try and keep them as sweeping turns instead of tight angles. Bend them up first, lube and put on the vinly starting at the straightest end. May have to warm slightly the vinyl if it is to go around some tighter turns.

Pre fits the copper without the flares and do them one at a time. Once the copper is installed measure up for the hoses and go to the auto store that makes hydraulic hoses and get the hoses made.
Most SAE and JIC fittings will interchange but remember that 3/8" is the exception. Don't try and get 3/8" flares and 3/8" JIC connected.

Don't jave to but I seald each end of the vinyl with Chinese Heat shrink tubing from eBay to keep then sealed up and clean.

[Bycrick]

Before you deal with Northern Tool, you might look at their reviews. I dealt with them for years. Then I sent in an order, it got cancelled without notification. When I contacted them to ask why, the first story was that the sale item was out of stock, but I could certainly order it at the regular price. When I objected to what I thought was bait-and-switch, the next guy told me that "we’ve decided not to ship to freight forwarders." I quit dealing with them and found identical merchandise cheaper elsewhere.

[B-Baysailer]

Surplus center.com has good prices on hydraulic hose