Interior refit 1970's kit sailboat questions

[Spot]

Thanks WL.

The gimbals will be metal when the time comes. It is so much easier to prototype and make mistakes with the hardboard material.

I saw that area behind the stove too, it should be used for something.

I follow you on the risk of the large hinged cover...but I still like the idea of a integral cover/backsplash/hood especially for the low ceiling. Here it is mocked up in cardboard. I could add some gas struts to it so it would have to be open held open or closed held closed and it would take force to bring it from one state to the other. One consideration I did not think of was how much light the cover will obscure from the stove.

Cushions will start once I chase down the missing yard of fabric, supposedly there are a couple yards close by according to the interweb. I need to check my stock of zipper tape and sliders as well.

[wingless]

It is possible to raise the stove while maintaining the pivot point and the cover location by making the pivot virtual.

If the side plates have concentric arcs and the stove has slides that move through those arc slots, then the plates extending above the stove may be eliminated.

The virtual pivot point could even be raised higher for greater stability, if desired.

[wingless]

Another option to comply w/ the stove spacing requirements is to have a fixed panel above the stove w/ an air gap to the hull, such as a stainless panel w/ 1" spacers and open perimeter.

The stainless has horrible thermal transfer, perfect for the application and is inflammable, also perfect. The open side air gap ensures the hull won't ever get hot.

[Spot]

Originally Posted by wingless

Another option to comply w/ the stove spacing requirements is to have a fixed panel above the stove w/ an air gap to the hull, such as a stainless panel w/ 1" spacers and open perimeter.

The stainless has horrible thermal transfer, perfect for the application and is inflammable, also perfect. The open side air gap ensures the hull won't ever get hot.

Fabricating a simple stove cover that can be detached and stowed with a fixed stainless ceiling heat shield would be much easier than a single large metal unit with multiple bends, welds, hinges, and locking mechanism...and has a higher probability of getting done sooner than later too! The boat is going to need a cutting board, a stove and/or sink cover would work for that too.


Are you thinking of the gimbal pivot points traveling on an arc so on the low side the stove is down and stowed and on the high side it is free to pivot yet the pivots are well below the stove fiddles?

[wingless]

Originally Posted by Spot

Are you thinking of the gimbal pivot points traveling on an arc so on the low side the stove is down and stowed and on the high side it is free to pivot yet the pivots are well below the stove fiddles?

Quick Paint sketch...

Stationary side plates w/ curved arc cut. Stove has captive posts that travel through arc.

Arc radius could be selected to be higher than existing pivot, increasing stability w/o requiring side plates to extend above stove.

Stove location could remain where fiddles are flush w/ enclosure top.

[Spot]

OK WL thanks, I think I follow now.
My next question would be what radius of arc would allow things to move freely and not be sticking out too far front and back.

I started on the cushions. It took approximately 1 side of a LP record to glue each berth. I did most of the spraying in the garage to keep fumes and over spray out of the dining room. Spray first piece, spray second piece, drag both into house, use a board to straighten first piece, assemble, and roller with a 'Sea Hunt' grade steel SCUBA tank. I cannot honestly say if the tank did anything but I am compelled to apply pressure with adhesives. First cushion needed a little more sauce around the leading edge. Second cushion found me wearing gloves (eventually I learn) and pre-planning a heavier spray around the edges. Next step will be cutting the foam followed by pattern development for the cloth.

Products:
Drawing is from Autodesk Fusion360.
I used most of one can of Loctite 200 spray glue 13.5 oz (382 g).
Foam is Bestway Foam Seat Ultra - 2.8 LB density Extra Firm (60 LB IFD) 24" x 84" @ 3" + Medium (35 LB IFD) @ 1" as a more squishy top layer.

[Spot]

Fun with Foam!
I decided to make a separate pattern for the foam as my berth pattern was a little rough from being marked/cut in place, especially under the cockpit. I put the red rosin paper on top of some holiday gift wrap paper (not having onion skin/tracing paper/ 'bum wad' [technical term from architecture school in the late 80's] in a 24" width) and set up the 24" x 6'6" (61 x 198cm) long piece for the foam. I faired the jagged edge towards the hull with a batten (thin strip of wood held in a curve with weights) on the gift wrap and cut down the middle of the fair line with a hobby knife into a self-healng cutting mat below. I put the pattern on the foam and traced outside of it with a marker. A soft pencil would probably have been better as the markers will sometime bleed into the surrounding materials. Since the gift wrap is so thin I think the marker made the job easier. These are dollar-store type markers and seem to clean up nicely with 91% isopropyl aka 'rubbing' alcohol.

Out came the 2$ US secondhand store electric knife. For the most part it cut nicely and at a 1-2 inch (2.5 to 5 cm) per second speed without having to force it in or pull it up and down through the cut. I opted for a more rounded blade than a hooked blade and it seems that paid off. The only thing missing on this model was a switch lock so it was a slightly awkward hold to keep the knife straight up and turned on. The knife cuts better when fully surrounded by foam so ends of cuts and cuts going tangent to a edge were not as nice. Planning the cuts solves most of this. It also got jagged when the two layers of foam were not glued soundly together. I used up the Loctite 200 and the end of an ancient can of 3M Super 77 (after cleaning the nozzle with a pushpin and a drill bit) to make sure the outer edges of the two foams are glued together. Once the cushions are covered this may not matter but I want them to hold together until they are covered.

I went back through a Sailrite video on v-berth cushions. It seems that nothing is really cut 'nominal' except to pattern the space itself. The foam is bigger 1/4 to 3/8" (6 to 9mm) per edge and fabric is cut 1/4" (6mm) larger than nominal per edge but sewn 1/8"(3mm) inside of nominal to make the seam allowance of 3/8"(9mm).

Q: Does this oversize/undersize track with everyone's experience? My foam is new and is what it is for size, fabric is new synthetic. I could either pattern to be 1/8" under nominal for seam placement or go even more to give it an extra 1/4" or 3/8" extra foam per edge. I do not have strict fit requirements, if the cushions seem a little small in the boat I can trim the decking of the berth before adding fiddles. I could also do a wrap of batting if needed.

[Spot]

I decided to work up the sewing pattern on the computer to take advantage of the software's ability to make all of the offsets. I took my foam 'actual' into CAD as the starting point and offset in 1/4"(6.4mm) each side in to make a theoretical 'nominal' and another 1/8"(3.2mm) to make the stitching line for the 3/8" (9.6mm) seam allowance. The cover should be slightly tighter than the foam in all directions. I am intending to do this as a semi-box cover so I do not have to sew the 2 long straight seams on each that will will be the visible edge of the cushion. So my big pattern piece is designed to be traced and flipped. The small sides and the curved back will be separate pieces and the back one will have a zipper.

[Spot]

The cutting has begun...
The hot knife performed well using the included shoe instead of a glass or metal backer. Even so, I would not consider it 100% 'safe' for use on unprotected fine furniture or surfaces not resistance to heat. The blade needs to be cleaned every so often to remove small globs of accumulated melted fabric. My original 4.x yards, 7.13$ US (total, not per yard) piece of was just enough for both berths using some pattern joining with the off-cuts on the two ends (boxing) that will face the rear lazarette. My machine does not seem to have any issues feeding the fabric or 210D/3 #69 T70 polyester thread. I have two more yards of fabric bought at full price (6.97$US per 54" wide running yard) that I will used to cover back cushions for the berths, against the hull aft of the cabinets, once I figure details like thickness and angle.

[Mickeyrouse]

Wow! A Luger “Windward!”
My first boat. (“Total construction time- only forty hours!”)
My kit arrived on Labor Day. Thought I’d be sailing by Columbus Day. Finally launched (mostly finished) on New Years Eve. Which..it..
sank.
I learned to sail on it, and it got me home every time. I knew I’d fall in love with sailing, which I did.
My experience with that boat was good for one story sold to “Sail” magazine.
Origins: humble.
Life experience: priceless

BTW, the work on your boat looks far superior to what I did on mine.

[GILow]

Originally Posted by Spot

The cutting has begun...
...

Looking great and a darn side smarter choice of fabric than I made. My obsession with increasing the light level in the cabin led me to choosing a stupid beige colour which looks lovely but is a nightmare to live with,

[Spot]

Thanks Matt, thanks Mickey! I appreciate the positive reinforcement.

Horrible cold here today, -13F (-25C) warming to 0 F (-18C), and much of the same all the next week...and even colder some nights. Glad to be doing inside stuff!

[wingless]

Originally Posted by Spot

The hot knife performed well using the included shoe instead of a glass or metal backer. Even so, I would not consider it 100% 'safe' for use on unprotected fine furniture or surfaces not resistance to heat. The blade needs to be cleaned every so often to remove small globs of accumulated melted fabric.

Project looking great. Thanks very much for the ongoing updates!

Brrr to those temperatures. My New England blood has thinned in southern Florida, so I didn't like the cool temps last week and am glad we're back into the 80s again.

My hot knife looks identical. It came with a brass toothbrush for cleaning. I get tip warm and it cleans quickly with toothbrush.

The access for cleaning is better w/o that free cutting guide attached.

[wingless]

Originally Posted by Spot

OK WL thanks, I think I follow now.
My next question would be what radius of arc would allow things to move freely and not be sticking out too far front and back.

The most free movement would be from the single elevated pivot shown in the initial images.

The arc traveller permits a higher virtual pivot, for better stability, if required.

If the traveller extends too far front / back then the advantage of that approach is lost.

[Spot]

Thanks WL for sticking with this, it's been a long thread...

I agree that the 'foot' can be a little messy on the hot knife.
Sometimes if I went too fast, the material would slide through and not cut or if I was near a frayed edge and lingered it would ball up on the blade. I did not want to set the blade too deep into the foot so I did not accidentally mar the tables. I should just get a piece of metal to have that option. I also learned that cutting two layers at the same time can fuse them together and cause more damage undoing them than cutting them separately.