Interior refit 1970's kit sailboat questions

[Spot]

Originally Posted by wingless

If the V berth is not symmetric, such as the aft port edge being larger than the starboard, then it might be possible to attain symmetric side cushions by having the removable head cushion have a larger overlap onto one side.

LOL Wingless. How did you know that my head hatch is 3/4" (19mm) off center?

The sides line up pretty good +/- 3/8" (9mm) or so with the exception of the hatch above, which I attribute to a layout error when adding the framework under the berths. It was done to the point of me not wanting to redo it when the error was discovered. If it can be concealed by the upholstery then all the better.

So now I have another set of decisions.

-First is which foam for the v-berth. Lighter weight crew has commented that the side berth cushions seem hard. So rather than go 3" extra firm +1" medium topper I am thinking 4" firm no topper which will save me a glue-up and from having to repack the covers if they need to be flipped.
-Second is how much foam. I was hoping to eek it out of 2 pieces 24x82" but it will be so close. Three would be easier and there would be no shortage for future back cushions or throw pillows.
-Third...fabric. I could stay with what I have been using and locate another 12-14 yards. I could do something different, like another pattern of black and white or grey or go crazy with something completely different, which might drive me to remake the first cushions to match. I am leaning towards matching the already made new ones.

Some pics of the situation and of one cushion in the boat still under the tarp. I am happy to report that my head was not hitting the ceiling and the cushion is way more comfortable that the plywood and random other pieces of foam I have been using as cushions in the meantime.

[wingless]

Originally Posted by Spot

LOL Wingless. How did you know that my head hatch is 3/4" (19mm) off center?

My eyeball tape measure showed it to be off center. That will never show by making the aft cushion edges identical and covering w/ the center cushion.

REALLY, REALLY like the finished results on the cushions, very nice job!

IMO, having the cushions matching would provide the best appearance.

It is likely that even if "identical" fabric may be located then the lot-to-lot variability will have a subtle difference. It would have needed to be purchased at the same time to ensure identical.

If the matching material cannot be located, then my aesthetic would be to have significantly different, such as a solid. (Take w/ a grain of salt, none in my family permits me to effect these types of decisions.)

My very strong suggestion is to not plan on zero margin from the fabric dimensions. The one piece cover worked well, but might not be possible on these wider cushions.

Foam selection is very difficult. As you know first hand, making foam lamination is not fun. Adding to that "fun" it might feel best to have a firm inner core w/ less firm outer top and bottom layers. Again I point to the experts at Sailrite.

It looks like the forward berth cushion must be made of several parts because of the size. It might be required to cover the firm inner core section w/ something thin on each side, plus gluing the joints, so that finished cushion doesn't feel like it has segmented inner foam, then covering w/ the softer exterior foam. The inner and outer layer joints cannot be close at all.

IMO, the middle foam pattern is best. The most important foam part is the aft cushion edge. That aft edge should not be segmented. The middle pattern has a wedge filler up against the hull. That is the best place for a filler and for joints like that.

IMO, throw pillows should be intentionally different. There should be two or three different complementary patterns on the throw pillow. Same w/ the different pillow types having different fringe and piping. (Again, apply salt here)

[wingless]

Do the forward berth foam pattern options work any better when the forward berth is three parts, instead of the two parts shown in the existing pattern?

My suggestion would be to have a three part cushion, so the center head cushion could be removed and set aside when required, rather than having to do something with both forward cushions.

The foam is available as big as 48" x 80" so attaining non segmented panels is possible and is very desirable. Yes, select a density that doesn't need layers bonded together.

[Spot]

Thanks WL.
Three cushions is the current plan, the head needs to be accessed without disturbing the whole v-berth. The cuts in the foam for the hatch will be centered in the foam to maintain visual symmetry and the flip if worn feature.

[wingless]

The foam looks to be available up to 48" x 80". Does that permit a single piece to create the 36½" x 87½" part? If required a glued shiplap joint for an additional part at the bow corners might permit extending the length and maintaining sufficient strength / integrity.

Will there be sufficient retention for the center (head) cushion to not slide aft w/ the tapered side cuts?

[Spot]

Originally Posted by wingless

The foam looks to be available up to 48" x 80". Does that permit a single piece to create the 36½" x 87½" part?

Will there be sufficient retention for the center (head) cushion to not slide aft w/ the tapered side cuts?

The 48 x 80" piece does not reach all edges of 1 cushion, even if rotated. The sides will not be tapered to the hull, as tapered will not 'flip'. I will need something 'fiddly' on the aft edges. My best bang for buck seems to be to buy 3 @ 24 x 82" x 4" firm (2.8 PCF x 45 IDF or so) and a can of glue and have 2 glued seams per cushion and plenty to spare. The foam is easier to cut when you leave a couple inches on each side of the electric knife blade. Middle picture below, fill in small missing corner before cutting.:

[wingless]

Originally Posted by wingless

If required a glued shiplap joint for an additional part at the bow corners might permit extending the length and maintaining sufficient strength / integrity.

Originally Posted by Spot

My best bang for buck seems to be to buy 3 @ 24 x 82" x 4" firm (2.8 PCF x 45 IDF or so) and a can of glue and have 2 glued seams per cushion and plenty to spare. The foam is easier to cut when you leave a couple inches on each side of the electric knife blade.

So the (late suggestion) shiplap joint is too difficult to effect?

[Spot]

Originally Posted by wingless

So the (late suggestion) shiplap joint is too difficult to effect?

WL, I missed this last night, sorry.
It would add more area to glue.
It would also require accurate cutting to be fully effective.
Sailrite usually shows a plain butt joint when they join foam for cushions.

[Matt Johnson]

Originally Posted by Spot

WL, I missed this last night, sorry.
It would add more area to glue.
It would also require accurate cutting to be fully effective.
Sailrite usually shows a plain butt joint when they join foam for cushions.

The butt joint bond is incredibly strong and nothing you'll feel in the finished product. No need to go through any more difficulty on this part of the project.

-Matt

[Spot]

Originally Posted by Matt Johnson

The butt joint bond is incredibly strong and nothing you'll feel in the finished product. No need to go through any more difficulty on this part of the project.

-Matt

Thanks Matt. I borrowed an idea you shared on stacked foam and densities for the side berths: https://www.cruisersforum.com/forums...ml#post3022813 but will be going 'straight weight' on the v-berth.

[Spot]

Foam is on order, I went with (3) @ 24 x 82 x 4" IDF 45# 2.8 PCF. There will be most of the 3rd piece available for other projects. The vendor is about 2 weeks from order to ship and is less expensive than the bigger outfits online.

Cloth was about 7$ a 54" w x running yard at Walmart, other than the first 4 yards I got on clearance for 7$ total. It was 9$/yd or more elsewhere on line and 12$/yd at Amazon. To balance save time and save money the mid-range online order would have been best. In the end I got enough from 2 different stores, one that showed they did not have it online but had 7 yards in the store and the other where I had bought from the second time. Since I have to wait for foam I did not need an immediate option. I am probably 6-8 Walmart 'trips' (stops and phone calls) into this, although 2 of those were serendipitous as I was at a Walmart for something else. Zipper was from the same vendor I bought from almost 10 years ago, they are in-state and super reasonable. They only had red, blue, and tan the day I ordered.

On yesterday's fabric run I got to stop at both an Asian and Mexican grocery (in adjacent strip malls) on the way back. Gorgeous baked goods for under 1$ each at the Mexican store and it was my first go in a large Asian grocery. I have a coworker who was kind enough to make me a list of all of the local Asian markets complete with names, addresses, and sidebars including the tip about the neighboring Mercado and its bakery cases. They are known to have great salsa too.

The sounder mold is coming along, hoping to pour lead in the next couple days. I got into this during thread drift on another thread where we went from electronic depth transducers to weighted sounders. I am planning on running a small Garmin for basic depth and GPS functions. I was originally going to couple it all with OpenCPN (the whole reason I ended up on CF) but the tablet I got is too dim to read in daylight and I really (really) don't need more 'screen time' so I may bag most of that and go with the basics: charts, compass, sounder.

[Spot]

I tried the wooden mold. It worked pretty good except where I tried to get fancy on the end for the grease plug. Another c-clamp on that end may have helped. A friend at work with foundry experience told me to char the wood. The charring process added some grain to the shape. I am hoping to make a couple small repairs and pour another 1 or 2 with a different solution for the plug end.

[Spot]

The foam arrived yesterday, a few days ahead of my mental prediction based on last time. It is amazing how tight they roll it and the force when released from its stretch-wrap confines. Next step will be patterns. We are supposed to have some nice days this weekend so I may mess around outside rather than sew. Rain and snow possible next week.

[GILow]

Originally Posted by Spot

The foam arrived yesterday, a few days ahead of my mental prediction based on last time. It is amazing how tight they roll it and the force when released from its stretch-wrap confines. Next step will be patterns. We are supposed to have some nice days this weekend so I may mess around outside rather than sew. Rain and snow possible next week.

Awesome, I remember staring at a similar pile and asking myself where to begin.

Now I’ve been sitting on them for a couple of years I can’t actually remember where I did begin.

[Spot]

Originally Posted by GILow

Awesome, I remember staring at a similar pile and asking myself where to begin.

Now I’ve been sitting on them for a couple of years I can’t actually remember where I did begin.

LOL Matt, I am having the same issues and I have just sewn the first ones.

It was in the upper 50's F (15C) here yesterday and it felt so nice. I uncovered the boat and took the templates out for a refit and confirmation session. Then I decided to forego computer-aided design and do the patterns by hand. I used the Sailrite recommendations of oversized foam approx 1/2" or 13mm per side and the as-stitched cushions will be 1/8" or 3.2mm 'inside' of nominal. I added clearance to make up for the off-center hatch and compression post and used a batten to fair a curve to average the small differences between port and starboard so they can be flipped top to bottom by switching them port to starboard.

My plan was to make a new 'universal' template, then make separate patterns for foam and cloth. Then it occurred to me that the foam pattern could be the cloth pattern if I added the lines and cut it down. I drafted for this, knowing that it would be a 'one way trip' after I cut off the difference between foam and cloth. Then it happened...an idea! What if I tack another piece of paper (white) under the one I drafted on (red) and cut them out at the same time...? The white paper was a template for something else that was never used. I used low-power spray adhesive to make a temporary bond and cut way the extra. I am thrilled to have an original and a copy without a second drafting session.

I still need adhesive for the foam. I think I will make a run into Joann's (retail fabric store in US) to get this and any other sewing bits and bobs I seemed short on last time.