Painting Upper Hull While at Dock

[STG]

I need to paint the top portion of my hull (above water line). I was going to haul this month and do so, but the list of projects that I will be doing once hauled has gotten long enough to warrant a 2-4 week stay on the hard. As we only get a couple months of somewhat nice weather here in the PNW, and I want to get some reasonable sailing experience in my new 9to me) boat this summer, I am thinking of waiting until early fall to haul, tent, and do some real work.

So, since the boat really looks poorly right now, I am wondering about maybe rolling a coat on while at dock (in a marina). I don’t want to pay the almost $400 haul out fee when I just have to do it again in a few months. Is it realistic to think I can do this at the dock? It is fiberglass, and the white paint has been worn (buffing?) through to show what appears to have been a blue hull at some time. So a simple waxing to get me by won’t do. A gallon or two of white paint would make a big difference for the summer.

The marina waters are very flat, so the boat won’t be bouncing. I think I can fairly easily tape some visqueen from the water boot line to the dock for spills, and roll a coat on with a long handled roller to make it look better for now. Turn the boat and do the other side.

Has anyone done this? Is it common? Doesn’t seem any tougher than waxing the sides with a buffer, which I see everyone doing? Maybe easier except the visqueen part.

Any advice would be appreciated.

[David M]

I have painted plenty of wood hulls, and brush or roller marks don't matter because this is traditionally how paint is applied to wood hulls.

You may want to take a look at some fiberglass hulls where the paint has been rolled or brushed on before doing this. We have all seen cars on the road where people have applied the paint in the same way and usually it looks pretty bad because we expect perfectly smooth surfaces like a cars body panels and a fiberglass boats hull to look perfectly smooth as well. This is what people are used to seeing.

Depending on your tastes, you may or may not like brushed on paint on a fiberglass hull. Also, one part paint does not adhere as well to gelcoat as two part LPU paint that has been prepped, primed and sprayed on professionally. Also, paint that is rolled or brushed on does not have that same mirror sheen as sprayed on paint.

You also have to consider the resale value. Many people would walk away from a boat where someone had painted the hull with what looks like a couple gallons of Latex or any one part paint which you cannot paint over with an LPU and expect it to stick for very long. You could brush on Awlgrip (an LPU) and the next owner could pay to have it sanded smooth if he wanted the boat sprayed.

Have a look at other boats before breaking out the paint roller.

[motion30]

My neighbor at the dock in Fl had his 72' viking painted white by roller and tip I was shinny and smooth Looked beautiful done in the water Only brush marks were on black window frames Would not look any better if sprayed

[Capt Phil]

Had a neighbor of mine paint (LPU) the entire upper hull on a 65 foot Sea Ranger at the dock. There was a lot of prep work, masking and attention to over spray as the painters were using low pressure spray equipment, were very careful and obviously experienced. The marina management monitored the work carefully and were quite complimentary on the attention to detail, environmental concerns and steps taken to safeguard neighboring boats in the marina. The whole job was much less expensive than having it done in a shipyard and airborne contaminents were much less than having the job done in a yard.
As I recall, the owner discussed the whole operation in detail with the folks who managed the marina as well as the neighboring boat owners. I believe the owner posted a bond with the marina before the work began. He was on an end tie which helped.
I've seen several boats that had their hull topsides painted in a marina. They were wooden hulls that accepted a 'tip and roll' painted technique well. Capt Phil

[Cheechako]

You dont want to roll. Brush and tip. There used to be a couple up here in Seattle that did it...looked like a spray job when they were done. Saw them do one in the water. They had the process down for sure. If you're going to be out of the water, just add a day or two and do it then. If your list is long..maybe just wait til next year and GO SAILING! A poorly done paint job is going to look a lot worse than a little bit of base coat blushing through!

[Jim Cate]

Originally Posted by motion30

My neighbor at the dock in Fl had his 72' viking painted white by roller and tip I was shinny and smooth Looked beautiful done in the water Only brush marks were on black window frames Would not look any better if sprayed

I bet that the painters didn't just stand back and roll on the paint! To get that kind of result requires a lot of prep: usually a primer coat or two, sanding between, and then a careful roll and tip, usually with two folks working... one rolling, one tipping. Not as easy as it sounds.

If the op attacks the job as described in his post, the result might just not be as nice as what you describe!

Cheers,

Jim (Who learned the hard way about r&t painting!)

[minaret]

I've done roll and tip on many boats with many different products, from enamel to awlgrip. Done right it can look just as good as spray, with no brush strokes at all. Acheiving this kind of flow in your topcoat has more to do with ambient temp, humidity, and sunlight/wind than anything else. And lots of experience of course. It's not too hard to get decent results and they'll only get better with time though. Best tips I can give are pick your weather window and tip vertically, I often see people trying to tip horizontally, this is a big mistake. And dont try to do it from a dinghy or raft, instead use lots of docklines to put the boat in its slip aslant so you can get to the bow from the dock and have it held off with no fenders. Then while you're painting amidships have someone carefully adjust the lines so you can reach the stern. Its a PITA to do it in the water, probably worth your 400 to put it in the yard. It'll pay for itself in time saved, unless you're planning on slapping on a coat of whatever with just a roller, which would be a crime IMHO. I attached a pic of the last hull I brushed.

[motion30]

minaret
what paint is your favorite?

[minaret]

Awlgrip in general, but I wouldn't recommend it for a beginning brush enthusiast. Sterling lasts almost as long, looks great and is easier to brush. I wouldn't by choice use anything but an LPU on a glass hull. Make sure you use a brushing reducer, it increases wet time and will help you achieve flow. I recommend reducing substantially more than the manufacterers directions suggest, you have to play around with the mix for your conditions. Pick conditions carefully, no hi temps, no direct sunlight, no wind, not to early in the day because of humidity/dew, not too late in the day because you want it fairly dry before the next dewfall. Midday is usually good because there are less bugs in the air as well, they love fresh sweet LPU and will land in it every time. Of course it's usually hotter then too, depends on where you are what course to take. If you brush when it's hot or windy or in direct sunlight you will have brushstrokes. Experiment on parts or small projects first. Do it on the dock where the boat is so you will be aware of any problems beforehand. You only get one shot at it, and it's a sand and recoat if you blow it. Usually you will have to apply more than one coat for coverage anyway. Sand 400 between coats, and if you have brushstrokes in your first coat, superfine scotch brite them instead of sanding them out. You'll take off the whole first coat and defeat the purpose if you sand out the brushstrokes. That kinda gives you a practice run for your final topcoat as well. And if you blow that you just sand 400 again and coat again. It'll save you a ton of effort if you paint over your bootstripe and re-stripe it later instead of sanding and coating around it on every coat. You dont want anything slowing you down at the waterline when you coat, you need to move fast which is hard from the dock. The other option people often take when painting in the slip is to just paint to the top of the bootsripe and finish the boot and any accent stripe in the yard. Hope that helps. Oh, the pic is brushed awlgrip on my last boat. Please noone steal my color scheme, I paint all my boats this way, it's my signature scheme, dark grey/light gray/very light gray with burgundy stripes. I'll find a profile pic.

[minaret]

Originally Posted by motion30

My neighbor at the dock in Fl had his 72' viking painted white by roller and tip I was shinny and smooth Looked beautiful done in the water Only brush marks were on black window frames Would not look any better if sprayed

Black and very dark colors are extremely difficult to paint without brushstrokes, they get too hot too quick. Manufacterers guide for awlgrip rates highest temp acheived on a flat panel displayed at 90 degrees to the sun. Flag blue rates 240 degrees, dont remember what super jet black rates but it must be ridiculous. I'd brush black at night with lights if I could. But then you need a light tender to move the lights around for you...

[minaret]

Here she is about 1 1/2 yrs after being brushed w/awlgrip. Looks great except for the streaks of scupper grime that are usual after a PNW winter. Of course that comes right off LPU. I painted the hull in the yard, but everything from the dark grey rubrail up was done in the slip, including the house and bulwarks.

[STG]

Thanks for all the advice. I think I will wait until hauling and do it right. I was hoping for a fast temporary fix to get me by, and make it look a little better for now, but in the end I think I will just haul and tent this fall, and use an HVLP gun or something similar. I'll spend the next few months sailing and working on the many other issues that I keep finding for now. That'll give me more time to reasearch paints (including what I have on already).

[minaret]

Originally Posted by STG

Thanks for all the advice. I think I will wait until hauling and do it right. I was hoping for a fast temporary fix to get me by, and make it look a little better for now, but in the end I think I will just haul and tent this fall, and use an HVLP gun or something similar. I'll spend the next few months sailing and working on the many other issues that I keep finding for now. That'll give me more time to reasearch paints (including what I have on already).

Smart move. No such thing as a fast fix when it comes to paint. You'll save yourself money and headache, and be happier in the end. Brushing can still be a good economy option in the yard. Many yards around here will require you to build a tent around your hull when you spray to contain overspray, or to pay for their indoor storage at about a hundred bucks a day. If you brush you dont have to deal with all the headache of tenting and masking, or getting extorted into a big tent or building by the yard. That's why I did it last time. and I have worked at our yard for fifteen years and get a substantial discount. It was still way cheaper and faster to brush it, and I shoot boats for a living!

[heron237]

Originally Posted by minaret

I've done roll and tip on many boats with many different products, from enamel to awlgrip. Done right it can look just as good as spray, with no brush strokes at all. Acheiving this kind of flow in your topcoat has more to do with ambient temp, humidity, and sunlight/wind than anything else. And lots of experience of course. It's not too hard to get decent results and they'll only get better with time though. Best tips I can give are pick your weather window and tip vertically, I often see people trying to tip horizontally, this is a big mistake. And dont try to do it from a dinghy or raft, instead use lots of docklines to put the boat in its slip aslant so you can get to the bow from the dock and have it held off with no fenders. Then while you're painting amidships have someone carefully adjust the lines so you can reach the stern. Its a PITA to do it in the water, probably worth your 400 to put it in the yard. It'll pay for itself in time saved, unless you're planning on slapping on a coat of whatever with just a roller, which would be a crime IMHO. I attached a pic of the last hull I brushed.

tip vertically are you serious

[minaret]

Originally Posted by heron237

tip vertically are you serious

I am serious.

http://www.yachtpaint.com/Literature...10-usa-eng.pdf

Interlux guide to painting page 58. Recommends vertical tip for finishing stroke. Google vertical tipping lpu and you will find many proffesionals who agree with me. And if you think about it it just makes sense. If you tip horizontally the brushstrokes sag into each other and want to create horizontal hangers, tipping vertically creates nice clean flow. Look at a vertically tipped hull and the only hangers you will find will be where they had to tip horizontal around a rail or hardware.