Propane Question - Should I be Worried?

[SouthernPride]

Pull all the access doors to the bilge or wherever the propane tank is. Propane gas is heavy and drop to the lowest point available.

[boatpoker]

Originally Posted by SouthernPride

Pull all the access doors to the bilge or wherever the propane tank is. Propane gas is heavy and drop to the lowest point available.

Your really have to look at the crazy photos of the stuff I see regularly in my surveys. Safe Boat Propane Installations.

Some of these are too dumb to believe but they are all real.

[Mirage35]

Originally Posted by SouthernPride

Pull all the access doors to the bilge or wherever the propane tank is. Propane gas is heavy and drop to the lowest point available.

The bilge! Now, that would be scary!

The tanks are in a well designed, dedicated locker at the back of the cockpit, with a large direct drain straight out the transom. And one of my haul-out jobs was checking the condition of the drain. At least I have that going for me.

[Suijin]

Originally Posted by TreblePlink

While extra caution is appropriate with flammable gas in a boat, I would think that if it was leaking at such a rate as to form a flammable hazard off the boat, the supply would be depleted very quickly.

You need to educate yourself about propane risks. It's heavier than air. Your boat is essentially a bowl. Leaking gas will sink down into the bilge and work it's way up, mixing with air to provide a wonderfully explosive mix. I have two 20 lb. propane tanks in my propane locker. If one of them emptied itself into the boat it would have more than enough explosive potential to destroy the boat and probably kill everyone on board.

Passed this boat in North Carolina this past spring. The owner survived, by a miracle.

[KP44]

If you have any suspicions at all, go through you whole system. Propane is kept in a vented locker outside the boat because it is the most dangerous thing we carry on our boats. Take the time and effort to do it right.

[kish]

A gas pressure gauge on a propane gas tank is analogous to a voltmeter on a battery.
As you are using gas, the pressure will fall slightly, more so when the tank is approaching empty. But you will know that by the flame size also.

Leak detection can be by soapy water, but you can buy gas leakage detector in an aerosol can at outlets where gas plumbing is sold.
Do remember to use gas rated PTFE tape on threaded gas fittings. This is coloured yellow to distinguish from the regular white tape used in water circuits.

Originally Posted by Dockhead

I don't have a pressure gauge on my installation -- it's not typical in the UK. What is good for? Leakdown tests? We use bubblers for that.

[Jim Cate]

A gas pressure gauge on a propane gas tank is analogous to a voltmeter on a battery.
As you are using gas, the pressure will fall slightly, more so when the tank is approaching empty. But you will know that by the flame size also.

As long as there is liquid LPG left in the tank, the pressure is a function of temperature, not on volume of liquid. The pressure gauge tells you nothing about remaining fuel until there is none (liquid) left. At that point, only moments of use are left.

Jim

[deblen]

Originally Posted by Dadrock33

One item of concern for me, as I'm thinking of adding propane to our boat for cooking, etc, is that there shouldn't be any other hose or plumbing connections inside your boat. I may be wrong here (I know many are waiting to jump on that concept) but I think that "the standards" are that there aren't to be ANY other connections to the LPG line other than straight to the device (stove, water heater, furnace, whatever). I believe that this applies to all devices on board - i.e. if you have two devices using LPG, then you have to have two lines coming from the tank locker to those devices. You are NOT to add in a splitter/"T"/yoke halfway through the boat to supply the, let's say, "new device". My concept from earlier instances of LPG on an RV was to hang a boar's bristle brush in the same locker to remind me to use the soap testing check often . . . it's easy and it works.

You are correct. The only joint allowed by ABYC in a propane line after it leaves the regulator in the propane locker is the connection at the ONE appliance. However,you are allowed & encouraged to use a short length of propane rated flex hose with factory crimped fittings between the appliance & copper supply line(If copper was used).These hoses are available all made up for < $10 at any RV supply.

Euro boats often have some type of rubber hose slid over 3/8" copper tubing & hose clamped. This is a no-no!

Safe Boat Propane System Installation

Please note the comment in the above article about Englishmen playing with electricity & French playing with propane.

Absolutely no teeing in of second appliances,such as a barbecue,etc,etc.. A separate feed line must be run in one piece from the regulator outlet to each appliance .

The whole principle of propane safety is proper installation with no chance of gas leaks into an enclosed area. This means all joints made outside the enclosed area.A propane leak into the outside atmosphere will not cause an explosion.

If you follow the instructions in the attd link,you will have no problem with propane.Safe Boat Propane System Installation

I find posters with the most fear of propane come from areas where propane is not common in their homes & cottages.They use CNG instead. We don't have CNG in the N.E. US & Eastern Canada.We have learned to live comfortably with propane,but it must be installed & maintained properly.

/ Len

[desodave]

Originally Posted by AnglaisInHull

Okay, as earlier noted paranoia is a good thing here, but the recommendations to remove the tanks from the boat while on the hard over the winter?

Given that there is no gas loss with the valves closed (yes, I'm sure of that) I don't see why on the boat is less safe than any of the other possible storage locations (e.g. The tool shed in my back yard). Any reasons someone can offer?

You might want to check your insurance and what it may require regarding your due care when storing the boat.

I remove my tanks and keep them in a garden shed - our house is on a hillside and the shed is below it on the hillside. The shed is "porous" so any leaks from a tank would drain downhill into open countryside. Rather that that than into a bilge. No extra fuel on board in event of fire on my boat or surrounding ones as well. All unlikely imo but rather safe than sorry.

I agree that for many people safe home storage may not be possible.

[deblen]

If you have even a minor propane leak,below the "explosive concentration level" even,the stink of the rotten egg gas is overpowering-no way you could not notice it.
If you turn your solenoid valve off when propane is not required,you will be safe from propane leaks for 99% of the time you are aboard.
If you turn your tank valve off when you leave the boat,you have eliminated any possibility of blowing your boat or the marina up.
If the whole tank of propane leaks into a proper propane locker,it will run out the drain,stinking like hell & dissipate in the atmosphere.
Give your whole propane installation a good check on a regular basis for chafing & soap test for leaks.Actually,you will smell minor leaks before they becomes dangerous.
Install a good quality propane alarm.

When you pick up a re-filled propane tank,always check the tank expiry date.They must be pressure tested & a new valve installed every 10yrs? by the retailer by law.
Give it the sniff test,or better yet,use a sponge soaked in dish liquid to soap test for leaks before you accept it.
Before you plug the regulator fitting into a replacement tank,check both fittings for spiders & dirt.
Always do the soapy sponge test after connecting a tank.
Gauge &/or Bubble leak testers are useful tools for proper maintenance

70 yrs with propane & no incidents yet / Len

[deblen]

Originally Posted by boatpoker

Your really have to look at the crazy photos of the stuff I see regularly in my surveys. Safe Boat Propane Installations.

Some of these are too dumb to believe but they are all real.

I am willing to bet that the majority of propane explosion horror stories & pics resulted from one or more of the dumb installations that you speak of./ Len

[dsteinfeld]

Originally Posted by Dockhead

The regulator should be silent. Paranoia is an absolutely rational attitudes towards propane on a boat.

If you do have a leak, you should be able to find it with soapy water and an artist's paint brush.

<snip>

When you're doing the soapy water thing, be sure to use it on the regulator vent. A punctured regulator diaphragm is a definite culprit in a leak between bottle and solenoid valve.

[Jim Cate]

Query: Why is it bad to have a Tee connection for the barbie within the confines of the propane locker?

Jim

[boatpoker]

Originally Posted by Jim Cate

Query: Why is it bad to have a Tee connection for the barbie within the confines of the propane locker?

Jim

Don't think anyone said that, did they ?

[deblen]

Originally Posted by Jim Cate

Query: Why is it bad to have a Tee connection for the barbie within the confines of the propane locker?

Jim

Jim
You can have all the tees you want WITHIN the propane locker,meaning that you can feed several appliances from the same tank/regulator.
Tees or joints of any kind WITHIN the hull are what is to be avoided.
I presume the principal is that every joint is a possible future leak. Leaks outside the hull,that can disperse overboard,are the "safest" place for a leak to occur,whereas a leak within the vessel presents much more risk of explosion.

Len