Repairing teak & holly cabin sole

[Sand crab]

You have to move the fence twice for both sides of the cut and still will have to chisel the ends and it makes a mess. If you chisel both ends and split the board down the middle you might be able to pull the bad section out in pieces. If it will part along the old edges.

With about 42 years experience I'm pretty handy with a chisel (and all tools actually). I've hand cut dovetails, mortise and tenon, etc. Sometimes the old way is easier and faster especially on little repairs like this.

[Terra Nova]

Originally Posted by Sand crab

...With about 42 years experience I'm pretty handy with a chisel...

Good for you--others may not be so experienced or inclined.

[Sand crab]

That's the point, we don't know the OPs skill level, tool inventory or willingness to spend $100 on a router that he may only use once. A router does take more skill than the average (non-woodworking) guy might possess. Routers are loud, make a mess, and require a respirator and eye protection. And if he's going up against something the router will stop before the desired end so now you have to break out a chisel anyway.

He might be able to cut a groove using any of the methods discussed out of the middle of the offending boards and pry both halves out if the t&g edge hasn't been glued to each other.

I think replacing the wood will be the easy part, finishing the new wood to match the old so it doesn't stand out as a repair might be more interesting.

[finefurn]

Granted this is not a beginners project, Either way you are going to have some level skill and confidence in whatever method you choose for the nature of the repair. Woodworking by it's very nature is a dirty business whether if it's by hand on machine and you need to work accordingly. It's a judgement call to be made by the guy doing the work. Personally I'd go for the router for the bulk of the cut, and the chisel for clean up

[Cadence]

Originally Posted by finefurn

Use a Laminate Trimmer (A small Router) fitted with a mortising bit. Clamp a fence to guide the trimmer. Set the depth of cut roughly about 1/8", make addition passes if needed to remove the all damaged wood. You don't need to remove the entire piece, Clean up the ends of the cut with a sharp chisel. Fit a new piece of wood to the just cut mortise.

I think you are advocating the same thing I was. It sounds better than destroying the mortised joint.

[er9]

Originally Posted by Sand crab

You have to move the fence twice for both sides of the cut and still will have to chisel the ends and it makes a mess. If you chisel both ends and split the board down the middle you might be able to pull the bad section out in pieces. If it will part along the old edges.

With about 42 years experience I'm pretty handy with a chisel (and all tools actually). I've hand cut dovetails, mortise and tenon, etc. Sometimes the old way is easier and faster especially on little repairs like this.

how wide of a chisel do you prefer? do you try and add a groove back into the old board on the section of flooring that was left in place to accept a tongue from the new pieces?

[Cherp]

I knew a girl once called Tegan Holly.

[finefurn]

Originally Posted by er9

how wide of a chisel do you prefer? do you try and add a groove back into the old board on the section of flooring that was left in place to accept a tongue from the new pieces?

Slightly narrower than the width of the piece you are removing. When removing the damaged piece you'll likely break out the tongue of the adjacent, so no grove.

[Sand crab]

Originally Posted by er9

how wide of a chisel do you prefer? do you try and add a groove back into the old board on the section of flooring that was left in place to accept a tongue from the new pieces?

About 1/2" will do. You need a really sharp chisel so a new one would be good. But first mark your stopping points with a square line and score this with a razor knife. You will have to do this even if you router. You chisel this out, always keep the flat side of the chisel to the work you want to save. Chisel a series of small indentations perpendicular to the wood and then remove wood from the defective side. Take only an 1/8" or so at a time, chop, remove waste, chop, remove waste. Chisel a 1/2" channel down the middle of the board, it doesn't have to be neat. In theory the board should just come out in 2 pieces now if the t&g hasn't been glued which is usually the case. If it has then you'll have to chisel down the edge of the board in the same manner. Trying to get one t&g board in place isn't going to happen without modification. If you remove the tongue and relieve out the bottom half of the groove on the new board then you can just drop it in. Epoxy will hold it there. Do not get epoxy on the finished side because it is a PIA to get rid of.



I can give more details specific to the situation if you need.

[Ken Pole]

I acknowledge that this doesn't really answer your question, but I'd opt for one of the synthetics. Did mine five years ago and still happy. Besides being easier to work with, they require little maintenance apart from cleaning, can curve to accommodate hull/liner and, in places with questionable headroom, gain you at last the thickness of the wood. Regards.

[lexowgrant]

Originally Posted by Captain Caliamari

Be careful.
I think Tolulene is more likely to dissolve your lungs first.
Respirator especially in heated confined spaces.

Plus one!

[Oceanconcepts]

I’m late to the discussion, but…
Dissolving any glue used to bond teak and holly seems like a Really Bad Idea. Better to cut out the damaged section and replace or (if the area is small) grave in patches. The best approach depends on the details, so I'm just throwing out options.

With sufficient skills and a really sharp chisel (sharper than any new chisel will be- and sharpening is another skill set) you could remove a piece quickly. As has been pointed out above, flooring installers do this all the time. These are skills worth developing, so you may want to go this route. Chisels are quiet, and don't make much dust.

I think most folks might get better results (depending on the situation) by taking a bit more time with a small laminate trim router, cutting against guide strips and using a top bearing bit. This is particularly true if you don't need to replace a full board or section, but can get away with just graving in a patch. You can take a much time as needed to set things up so it’s near impossible to cut “outside the lines”. Take small increments of depth. Score the outline of the cut first. This may be the surest way for an amateur to make a clean, flat bottomed cut. Proceed with caution (as you are not charging an hourly rate) and it’s pretty hard to screw up. You will still need to square off any corners of the cut, but that’s not hard.

Double stick carpet tape works well for holding guide strips or patterns for the router. Very useful stuff for built in place ad-hoc jigs.
The small, narrow, laminate trim routers are very useful in boat work, as they can fit into small spaces. They can be had for around $50: Trim Router, Metal Body | Grizzly Industrial
A top bearing flush cutting bit can make it easy to follow guide strips. https://www.toolstoday.com/v-9811-45...BoCtT4QAvD_BwE

I use Aerodux resorcinol glue frequently. Amazon has it. Aerodux bills this as being more forgiving of temperature and pressure variations than other resorcinols, and my experience bears this out, but it is still not a gap filling adhesive like epoxy. Tight joints matter. https://www.amazon.com/dp/B00DP5VQD2...v_ov_lig_dp_it

I have a resorcinol glued cold molded boat that is nearing 50 and still in good shape, so used properly it does hold up.

[er9]

Originally Posted by Sand crab

About 1/2" will do. You need a really sharp chisel so a new one would be good. But first mark your stopping points with a square line and score this with a razor knife. You will have to do this even if you router. You chisel this out, always keep the flat side of the chisel to the work you want to save. Chisel a series of small indentations perpendicular to the wood and then remove wood from the defective side. Take only an 1/8" or so at a time, chop, remove waste, chop, remove waste. Chisel a 1/2" channel down the middle of the board, it doesn't have to be neat. In theory the board should just come out in 2 pieces now if the t&g hasn't been glued which is usually the case. If it has then you'll have to chisel down the edge of the board in the same manner. Trying to get one t&g board in place isn't going to happen without modification. If you remove the tongue and relieve out the bottom half of the groove on the new board then you can just drop it in. Epoxy will hold it there. Do not get epoxy on the finished side because it is a PIA to get rid of.



I can give more details specific to the situation if you need.

thanks...good info.

[CapnCrunch]

Dont know if anyone else mentioned this but Jamestown Distributors sells teak planks and Maple strips (to replace the holly). They're not cheap, but it doesnt sound like you need very much

[MEC]

Hello Ris8r:


If you PM me I will give you some contacts at Hinckley's SWH and Trenton shipyards that have the expertise and knowledge how Hinckley manufactured their cabin sole. Ideally you are looking for someone that was a Hinckley employee dating back to when Bob Hinckley owned the company.


Hinckley had custom milling tools to cut the cruciform shaped holly and made the mortise groove in the teak planks. There cruciform and mortise have a slight keystone shape and clearance for adhesive film. SWH and Trenton carpenter's shops have this tooling.



I doubt it would be worth the effort to reverse engineer the tooling to produce identical joints. What I suggest is that you send the cabin sole board needing repair back to SWH shipyard and have them match and fit a holly strip on your existing teak board. You should specify stock on the surfaces that you will be hand filing/sanding to match the interior.



If you don't want to ship your sole board back to Maine, then have SWH make you a 6 foot long holly piece with stock on the surfaces that you will be hand filing to match to the hull or interior cabinet profile.



For this joint, today Hinckley uses West 105 resin and 207 (clear) hardener, clamped every 8 inches, with curing occurring in a temperature controlled workshop.



If you are going to fit the holly strip on locally, make sure that when the local cabinet shop mills out the existing holly and redoes the mortise, they don't reduce the width of the teak board. If this happens the holly alignment will be off and this will be an eyesore.


It will be nearly impossible to match new holly to the sun-bleached holly in your original cabin sole. It is possible to stain the holly to improve color match prior to clear coating.


After dry fitting the repaired cabin sole, you will need to mask off the teak and spray or brush Awl Grip clear on the new holly to build a clear that matches the thickness of the clear on the teak. Once you have built up enough thickness on the new holly, sand the entire board flat and spray 3 to 5 coats of Awl Grip clear in a completely dust proof room. A trick painters do is to hang the boards upside down in the spray booth so any dust particles in the booth fall on the bilge side of the board.



If you aren't re-finishing the other cabin sole, you will need to polish other cabin sole with 1000 grade water based rubbing compound.


I have coated the bilge side of my boat's cabin sole with several coats of varnish to seal the board on all surfaces. This reduces seasonal swelling and decreases stress on the teak and holly joints.



I hope this information is useful.


Regards,
Marcus Crahan
Sou'wester 52002 Dauntless, (ex Atem ex Pelican)

Newport Beach, CA