Teak deck - is just sanding enough?

[Stewie12]

I would enjoy the new sailboat and leave the caulking for the winter.

[Chris Cringle]

Don't sand it. Renew the caulking and then clean the teak with bronze wool and a weak oxalic acid/water mixture. Then just keep it clean with clean seawater and a soft brush. You don't want to sand away the texture.

[CarinaPDX]

Before listening to any of this just hose down the deck on a nice, dry day. Keep things wet for a few minutes then watch it dry. The wood will stay wet longer around plugs that have lost their seal - remove them. Also, the wood will stay wet next to caulking that has pulled away from the sides of the channel - mark them with masking tape. If you only have a relative few plugs to replace then just do that. If the caulking is pulled off in a few places then cut them out and replace them properly. If the problems are more widespread then consider a proper deck repair. To my eye your deck does not look ready for that but I admit that it is very difficult to tell from the photos.

Signs that the deck needs a full repair are many missing plugs; hardened, cracked, or shrunken caulking; or uneven teak or teak with rough grain. When things get to that point the answer is to pull out all of the plugs (if there are many missing plugs), refasten the screws if close to the surface, and remove and replace the caulking followed by a sanding. It is not unusual to have to replace a plank or two in high wear areas, such as beneath the shrouds in rainy areas (the rain sheeting off the shrouds erodes soft teak). I did this nearly 20 years ago and the decks still look great. Needless to say it is a big job.

For refastening I use adjustable countersinks with adjustable collars for stops (https://www.mcmaster.com/adjustable-countersinks/) and tapered drill bits (https://www.mcmaster.com/drill-bits/...r-wood-screws/). Because my needs vary a lot throughout the boat this has proven to be the best solution. If buying just for the deck then a one piece solution with the correct countersink diameter and tapered drill size should be fine. When gluing down the plugs use a waterproof glue that is not too strong (never epoxy) so that the plugs can be removed in the future. While still wet lop the top off with a chisel, with the grain. It rarely will break level; if it breaks down too far then dig it out and do it again. After drying just cut flush with a chisel starting on the low side.

For caulking, after cleaning the sides of the channels back to bare wood do the proper preparation first. I used Sikaflex 290 DC for caulking, which called for use of their primer - this is a must!!! First swab the channels out with alcohol or acetone to remove the oils near the surface, then prime. Without primer the oil in the teak will eventually weaken the adhesion of the caulking. My channels are very narrow so I did not use tape on the bottom (ever, since the first caulk in 1979) and have had no problems but I would go with that recommendation if I were doing it again. So the order would be to swab, tape, prime, caulk.

If doing the complete repair then don't fuss over getting all of the plugs flat or masking each channel. You will finish up with the sander and it will look great. Just don't cut away more than is absolutely necessary.

For maintenance never use ScotchBrite, brushes, or even bronze wool: they all dig out the grain and shorten the deck's life. The old (and current) tall ships use half of a coconut shell and seawater to scrub the decks (possibly some soap). The shell is very hard and cut flat so it is riding on the hard grain and never digs into the soft grain. That is why those decks are so smooth. I will use a soft sponge and detergent on my decks when needed but mostly I just rinse them off. The best way to clean a teak deck is to do some hard sailing in seawater... Also, stay ahead of the wet spots around plugs and along seams.

Greg

[Dockhead]

Originally Posted by sail sfbay

. . . . Suggest finishing with Semco natural sealant. That is I am using on my teak rail, steps, trim since I did not want to varnish or oil it and it is easy to apply.

Semco is great on toe rails, washboards, etc., but PLEASE don't put it on that beautiful deck


And don't sand it. It doesn't need sanding.



Use Scotch-Brite pads very carefully, strictly across the grain. That will easily deal with what you've got. Use brown soap or whatever equivalent you have there -- no detergents!!!!


THEN, fix the caulking. Others have said everything you need to know about that.


THEN, treat it all with Boracol to prevent fungus.



THEN, pour buckets of sea water over it several times a month.


And be happy. That's all a teak deck needs.

[picklesandjesse]

Greg above has it right. I suggest you take his advice. Regular sea water is good for laid decks too.

[sailian89]

Didn’t read all the replies, but recaulking is a big job. Just get a tool that holds a razor blade and shave the proud caulk flat. Only recaulk where it is missing or below the teak surface. Don’t want proud caulk as waking on it will separate the sides of the caulk from the teak and let water in. Have twenty plus years doing this on various boats as paid captain. No reason to make work

[gbmacca]

Well - 'they' say you shouldn't do it - but I did!

Got the pressure hose out, kept the nozzle a good 18" off the deck and went with the grain - along the whole boat

Was amazed at how it brought the teak back as if nearly new!

Saved a lot of time on my knees - which like a covered wagon, leave me each morning - so that was good too!

Then I oiled it, but noticed that it took a lot of oil so doubled up.

Am about to do it again.

Cheers!

GBmacca

[MatthLE]

Hello;

This is a bit tongue in cheek but:

This method is very steeped in tradition and many decades of use:
obtain a stone with one side flat,
next a bucket of sand
a second bucket with a line attached is also needed
spread the sand on the deck
use the stone to rub the sanded deck
use the bucket with line to rinse with seawater.

Respectfully with a bit of salt added

Lem

[David B]

Originally Posted by pjbori

Hi crew!

I recently acquired a beautiful old sailboat with a beautiful old teak deck. It's actually in relatively good condition (owner said it (the deck) was renovated in 2016), but has since become rather grey, especially in the cockpit area, as well as shedding some of the caulking. I don't like the look of the fancy teak decks which are treated with different chemicals, I like the natural look, but thought maybe a touch of TLC would do it good. I'm thinking: remove old caulking, sanding the surface and applying new caulking. Is this enough, or is there a step I'm missing?

Thanks!

When you say you prefer the natural look, do you mean freshly sanded, or weathered grey?

Also, how thick is your teak?

[pjbori]

Originally Posted by Chris Cringle

Don't sand it. Renew the caulking and then clean the teak with bronze wool and a weak oxalic acid/water mixture. Then just keep it clean with clean seawater and a soft brush. You don't want to sand away the texture.

Hi Chris, I also feel like I wouldn't want to sand away much more of the surface, as it is already pretty thin. So is it possible to do the recaulk by taping off, and then not having to sand afterwards?

[pjbori]

Originally Posted by CarinaPDX

Before listening to any of this just hose down the deck on a nice, dry day. Keep things wet for a few minutes then watch it dry. The wood will stay wet longer around plugs that have lost their seal - remove them. Also, the wood will stay wet next to caulking that has pulled away from the sides of the channel - mark them with masking tape. If you only have a relative few plugs to replace then just do that. If the caulking is pulled off in a few places then cut them out and replace them properly. If the problems are more widespread then consider a proper deck repair. To my eye your deck does not look ready for that but I admit that it is very difficult to tell from the photos.

Signs that the deck needs a full repair are many missing plugs; hardened, cracked, or shrunken caulking; or uneven teak or teak with rough grain. When things get to that point the answer is to pull out all of the plugs (if there are many missing plugs), refasten the screws if close to the surface, and remove and replace the caulking followed by a sanding. It is not unusual to have to replace a plank or two in high wear areas, such as beneath the shrouds in rainy areas (the rain sheeting off the shrouds erodes soft teak). I did this nearly 20 years ago and the decks still look great. Needless to say it is a big job.

For refastening I use adjustable countersinks with adjustable collars for stops (https://www.mcmaster.com/adjustable-countersinks/) and tapered drill bits (https://www.mcmaster.com/drill-bits/...r-wood-screws/). Because my needs vary a lot throughout the boat this has proven to be the best solution. If buying just for the deck then a one piece solution with the correct countersink diameter and tapered drill size should be fine. When gluing down the plugs use a waterproof glue that is not too strong (never epoxy) so that the plugs can be removed in the future. While still wet lop the top off with a chisel, with the grain. It rarely will break level; if it breaks down too far then dig it out and do it again. After drying just cut flush with a chisel starting on the low side.

For caulking, after cleaning the sides of the channels back to bare wood do the proper preparation first. I used Sikaflex 290 DC for caulking, which called for use of their primer - this is a must!!! First swab the channels out with alcohol or acetone to remove the oils near the surface, then prime. Without primer the oil in the teak will eventually weaken the adhesion of the caulking. My channels are very narrow so I did not use tape on the bottom (ever, since the first caulk in 1979) and have had no problems but I would go with that recommendation if I were doing it again. So the order would be to swab, tape, prime, caulk.

If doing the complete repair then don't fuss over getting all of the plugs flat or masking each channel. You will finish up with the sander and it will look great. Just don't cut away more than is absolutely necessary.

For maintenance never use ScotchBrite, brushes, or even bronze wool: they all dig out the grain and shorten the deck's life. The old (and current) tall ships use half of a coconut shell and seawater to scrub the decks (possibly some soap). The shell is very hard and cut flat so it is riding on the hard grain and never digs into the soft grain. That is why those decks are so smooth. I will use a soft sponge and detergent on my decks when needed but mostly I just rinse them off. The best way to clean a teak deck is to do some hard sailing in seawater... Also, stay ahead of the wet spots around plugs and along seams.

Greg

Hi Greg, thanks for the extensive explanation. I agree that the deck itself doesn't look like it needs any repair, except maybe a wash. The cockpit however, is pretty badly in need of new caulking. I tried to take a better photo of a spot that exemplifies how the whole area looks like. As mentioned before, I would like to avoid sanding after all, as the teak is relatively thin already. So could I just mask off everything (the cockpit area is really not that big, my boat is a 28fter) and thereby avoid sanding afterwards?

[pjbori]

Originally Posted by Dockhead

Semco is great on toe rails, washboards, etc., but PLEASE don't put it on that beautiful deck


And don't sand it. It doesn't need sanding.



Use Scotch-Brite pads very carefully, strictly across the grain. That will easily deal with what you've got. Use brown soap or whatever equivalent you have there -- no detergents!!!!


THEN, fix the caulking. Others have said everything you need to know about that.


THEN, treat it all with Boracol to prevent fungus.



THEN, pour buckets of sea water over it several times a month.


And be happy. That's all a teak deck needs.

Hi Dockhead! Sorry for my ignorance, but if the caulking needs to be replaced because it lets water in, then wouldn't washing and scrubbing it before the recaulking just aggravate the issue? So shouldn't I first recaulk, and then wash?

[pjbori]

Originally Posted by MatthLE

Hello;

This is a bit tongue in cheek but:

This method is very steeped in tradition and many decades of use:
obtain a stone with one side flat,
next a bucket of sand
a second bucket with a line attached is also needed
spread the sand on the deck
use the stone to rub the sanded deck
use the bucket with line to rinse with seawater.

Respectfully with a bit of salt added

Lem

Hi Lem! This sounds like a fun method! But i'd be worried of all the sand clogging up my drains, they are rather small...

[pjbori]

Originally Posted by David B

When you say you prefer the natural look, do you mean freshly sanded, or weathered grey?

Also, how thick is your teak?

I suppose somewhere in between. I can see that the deck is now a little bit in need of refreshing, but I also see the 'fancier' boats with shining, oily, light brown teak decks, which I wouldn't want on my boat either...

The teak in the cockpit is about 1 cm thick

[David B]

Originally Posted by pjbori

I suppose somewhere in between. I can see that the deck is now a little bit in need of refreshing, but I also see the 'fancier' boats with shining, oily, light brown teak decks, which I wouldn't want on my boat either...

The teak in the cockpit is about 1 cm thick

OK, so there is not much teak there then, and you want to ensure you don't lose any more.

Here is what it's about.
The greying then cleaning etc just wears away your teak. Notice that it's not flat, but 'tramlined'. It started out flat, but what is missing has over time, washed over the side.

Treat it with Semco Teak Cleaner and Brightener (two part process - the first is basically sodium hydroxide, the second acid (probably oxalic).
The results are spectacular, but once dry, you need to give it a reasonable sand to get rid of the worst of the tramlining.
Only do this procedure once - you will lose around 0.5mm of teak, so you cannot afford to do this on a regular basis.

Now if you leave it, the teak will go grey, and also, even if you don't scrub it, slowly, slowly, the teak weathers away and washes over the side. Even, as some old salts used to do, if you just sluice it down with seawater (in those days you had thick teak and it was not an issue).

I am with you - don't like the 'treated teak' look. I would prefer it to just look like new teak, and this is the closest I have found (we still after nearly 10 years, have people asking if our boat is new). I don't like that you lose some of the black of the caulking, but wiping the treatment off the caulking is too much work, so we live with it.

Semco Natural Tone Teak Sealer is the product, and applied once a year (takes us just a couple of hours on a full 50' deck) is all we do.

But before you seal the teak, you will need to scrape out the caulking that is needing attention, mask the edges then apply new caulking. Remove the masking immediately, then once fully cured, that light sand will sort it out.

Here is how we treat our teak:

https://youtu.be/Qt0uel_v-kY?t=78