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Nani Kai · 29-06-2021, 09:34

This is a new one on me. 2012 Leopard 39, well maintained. The ball valve connected to the thru hull that supplies raw water intake for the starboard air conditioner does not shut off the water flow when closed. Doesn’t even slow it down. The valve works smoothly, no hesitation, and moves the full 90 degrees. I can see the shaft rotating. The handle is snug. When I removed the sea strainer cover to clean the strainer, water began pouring into the bilge. Non-stop until I replaced the cover and screwed it down tight. We’re not talking about some water spilling out as I removed the top. Full flow no matter if the ball valve handle was open or closed. Never had a problem before with this valve at all.

Only thing I can think of is that the valve shaft is broken inside and is not rotating the ball.

I’m at Brunswick Landing Marina, Georgia. No capability hereabouts to haul out that I’m aware of. I’m only here for another 6 days to do basic maintenance, then back to work.

I am considering diving the hull and whacking a wooden cone up into the thru hull from below and then changing the valve from topside. Not overly enthusiastic about attempting that as failure would be disastrous. I could wait until such time as I can move the boat to St. Augustine or another boat yard nearer if there is one. That won’t happen until November at the earliest.

Anyone else ever experience this? Any bright ideas to resolve it? As long as the strainer cover stays on there’s no water ingress. All the hoses to and from the thru hull, the pump and the strainer were replaced April of last year.

All ideas gratefully appreciated.

BillKny · 29-06-2021, 09:47

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nani Kai

This is a new one on me. 2012 Leopard 39, well maintained. The ball valve connected to the thru hull that supplies raw water intake for the starboard air conditioner does not shut off the water flow when closed. Doesn’t even slow it down. The valve works smoothly, no hesitation, and moves the full 90 degrees. I can see the shaft rotating. The handle is snug. When I removed the sea strainer cover to clean the strainer, water began pouring into the bilge. Non-stop until I replaced the cover and screwed it down tight. We’re not talking about some water spilling out as I removed the top. Full flow no matter if the ball valve handle was open or closed. Never had a problem before with this valve at all.

Only thing I can think of is that the valve shaft is broken inside and is not rotating the ball.

I’m at Brunswick Landing Marina, Georgia. No capability hereabouts to haul out that I’m aware of. I’m only here for another 6 days to do basic maintenance, then back to work.

I am considering diving the hull and whacking a wooden cone up into the thru hull from below and then changing the valve from topside. Not overly enthusiastic about attempting that as failure would be disastrous. I could wait until such time as I can move the boat to St. Augustine or another boat yard nearer if there is one. That won’t happen until November at the earliest.

Anyone else ever experience this? Any bright ideas to resolve it? As long as the strainer cover stays on there’s no water ingress. All the hoses to and from the thru hull, the pump and the strainer were replaced April of last year.

All ideas gratefully appreciated.

Typically the “ball” has a notch, and the end of the shaft has a key that fits in the notch. One, or both, are broken. No easy fix. This is almost surely one of the cheap brass ball valves that so many European boat builders have gone to. The regulations in the EU require them to be suitable for use for at least five years, you are ahead of the game….

I would suggest you replace all the factory installed valves with proper bronze or Marelon sea cocks.

The logistics of that… I can’t help with!

marcjsmith · 29-06-2021, 10:17

Nani, my fear with knocking a plug in while replacing the valve, getting the valve off with out twisting thru-hull and breaking that seal.

you fix the valve, but end up with a persistent seep in a spot where you don't currently have a leak.

deblen · 29-06-2021, 10:18

Your raw water strainer is mounted too low. When you replace the RW intake seacock,relocate the strainer 6in. or so above the docked waterline.

Cheers/Len

HopCar · 29-06-2021, 10:32

You should be able to remove the stem to inspect it without water getting in the boat.

If it is broken you might be able to buy a new stem and replace it. It will be very hard to find a replacement stem and if you go that way, call the manufacturer and see if they will send you one.

If the stem is broken, the ball is probably jammed. Shoot some lubricant in the stem hole before you reassemble it.

I stocked stems for Apollo brand ball valves in my store. I don’t know if the new owners still stock them. I sold very few.

Shrew · 29-06-2021, 10:34

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nani Kai

Only thing I can think of is that the valve shaft is broken inside and is not rotating the ball.

That is my thought as well. I'd get replacements first, then do a short haul and replace it.

**tkeithlu** · 29-06-2021, 10:38

Nani, I'm voting with Bill and Marc. First, doing the job in the water under any but emergency conditions is an invitation to participate in this weeks YouTube "Bone-Headed Boaters." Second, if this one is bad, you are set up for having the same situation or worse with another very soon. The recommended course is that you survey your through hulls, identifying the potentially bad ones, purchase the right collection and a tube of sealant, travel to a friendly DIY yard, and change them out.

The longer I work with bronze, the more I like Marelon...

marcjsmith · 29-06-2021, 10:40

Quote:

Originally Posted by deblen

Your raw water strainer is mounted too low. When you replace the RW intake seacock,relocate the strainer 6in. or so above the docked waterline.

Cheers/Len

could that cause an issue if his water pump is not self priming. Could it cause the pump to loose its prime?

boatpoker · 29-06-2021, 10:44

Get rid of that throughull valve combination and install a real seacock with flange.

Georgia has 9' tides. Find a sand beach and use the tide to change it.

HopCar · 29-06-2021, 10:55

Quote:

Originally Posted by marcjsmith

could that cause an issue if his water pump is not self priming. Could it cause the pump to loose its prime?

Engine raw water pumps are all self priming. If his isn’t self priming he needs to fix the pump. I like to mount my strainer just above the waterline so I don’t have to shut the seacock to clean it.

That said, I have seen generators run with electric pumps that weren’t self priming but they didn’t come from the factory that way.

Manateeman · 29-06-2021, 11:06

BillK is spot on. You have a thru hull with a ball valve. This is not in my opinion a seacock. I would not “whack” anything inside or outside. The tow boats use nerf balls but if you break the thru hull trying to get the ball valve off...then you have a problem.
There is a Yard in St Mary’s GA...Nice guy, can haul cats. It not far from the ICW.
I would put in Groco adaptor plates and ball valves.
There is a Marine how to article on this but I don’t know how to post...maybe some cruiser can help.
I would never again install Forespar Marelon seacocks in any boat I build. I don’t think much of anything plastic for the job. Bronze or 316 stainless but not plastic.
I’ve put Apollo seacocks in boats 30 years ago and they also work fine. The Groco adaptor plates let’s you change valves or cap off without hauling. I use nickel pipe tape and Tef-Gel on my stainless. The corrosion issue with 316 is nonsense.
CeraKote them if you feel it’s necessary...I don’t.
You might want to consider a seachest arrangement. After your Groco, you can add an electric ball valve so if you are off ship for a short day, you flip a switch and nothing is open...longer time away, use your seacock.
Send me a pm if you need more help.
Happy trails to you.
Captain Mark and his manatee crew of professional boatbuilders.

marcjsmith · 29-06-2021, 11:12

Quote:

Originally Posted by HopCar

Engine raw water pumps are all self priming. If his isn’t self priming he needs to fix the pump. I like to mount my strainer just above the waterline so I don’t have to shut the seacock to clean it.

That said, I have seen generators run with electric pumps that weren’t self priming but they didn’t come from the factory that way.

but this isn't an engine, its an A/c unit... I' ve got a mag drive pump on my ancient lunaire a/c that's not self priming and everything needs to mounted below the W/L to the pump won't lose its prime.

so if I need to clean the strainer, I turn off the sea cock. its only 12 inches away so not a big deal...

jt11791 · 29-06-2021, 11:26

Quote:

Originally Posted by HopCar

You should be able to remove the stem to inspect it without water getting in the boat.

If it is broken you might be able to buy a new stem and replace it. It will be very hard to find a replacement stem and if you go that way, call the manufacturer and see if they will send you one.

If the stem is broken, the ball is probably jammed. Shoot some lubricant in the stem hole before you reassemble it.

I stocked stems for Apollo brand ball valves in my store. I don’t know if the new owners still stock them. I sold very few.

How do I get the stem out of an Apollo valve? I removed the packing nut, which seems to be the only retainer, but I still can't get the stem out. Is it just a "pull harder" situation, or am I missing something?

sail sfbay · 29-06-2021, 12:13

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nani Kai

.........I am considering diving the hull and whacking a wooden cone up into the thru hull from below and then changing the valve from topside.......Anyone else ever experience this? Any bright ideas to resolve it?......

You are on the right track........see this YouTube video in the link entitled "Replace a throughhull while the boat is in the water".