Was my horse caught behind the cart again...

[Skipper Lee]

I few months ago I bought a Blue Seas 8084 ac/dc panel (not the cheapest solution by far) for my electrical retrofit part of my boat job list from Binacle.ca,
Its great looking and I have already built a nice looking teak surround to mount it to the boat with hinges to make the wiring easily accessed. Everything is basically all planned out everything is all varnished up pretty, Ready to install!

I was reading the Stoopid Boat Builder tricks link I found on a CF post today and it says it is illegal in Canada to build a new boat with a combined AC/DC panel?
Can't I do anything right? Jeeeze.
INSERT STUPID FEELING MAN HERE.

Why would Binacle.ca sell them in Canada!
Is this also true for my used boat retrofit project?
Will my boat now not be insurable?
Anyone been refused insurance by using a combined AC/DC panel in Canada?
Is it legal if I just screw the entire panel in place and forgo the hinges?
Can I/Design/Build/Install a screwed on cover over the AC portion in the back to separate the two sides to comply? the article implies that the AC side needs to have a cover that has mechanical fastenings to remove
Did I really just waste another boat grand? No sleep again tonight!

[Skipper Lee]

Like my Avatar suggests I am barely keeping ahead in this game.
Alternate title,
Two steps back!!! LOL.
Lee

[Uncle Bob]

Originally Posted by Skipper Lee

I few months ago I bought a Blue Seas 8084 ac/dc panel (not the cheapest solution by far) for my electrical retrofit part of my boat job list from Binacle.ca,
Its great looking and I have already built a nice looking teak surround to mount it to the boat with hinges to make the wiring easily accessed. Everything is basically all planned out everything is all varnished up pretty, Ready to install!

I was reading the Stoopid Boat Builder tricks link I found on a CF post today and it says it is illegal in Canada to build a new boat with a combined AC/DC panel?
Can't I do anything right? Jeeeze.
INSERT STUPID FEELING MAN HERE.

Why would Binacle.ca sell them in Canada!
Is this also true for my used boat retrofit project?
Will my boat now not be insurable?
Anyone been refused insurance by using a combined AC/DC panel in Canada?
Is it legal if I just screw the entire panel in place and forgo the hinges?
Can I/Design/Build/Install a screwed on cover over the AC portion in the back to separate the two sides to comply? the article implies that the AC side needs to have a cover that has mechanical fastenings to remove
Did I really just waste another boat grand? No sleep again tonight!

Not Canadian here but I reckon you have answered your own question, how NEW is your boat?

[Skipper Lee]

Really old! 1978.

[Kelkara]

Originally Posted by Skipper Lee

I few months ago I bought a Blue Seas 8084 ac/dc panel (not the cheapest solution by far) for my electrical retrofit part of my boat job list from Binacle.ca,
Its great looking and I have already built a nice looking teak surround to mount it to the boat with hinges to make the wiring easily accessed. Everything is basically all planned out everything is all varnished up pretty, Ready to install!

I was reading the Stoopid Boat Builder tricks link I found on a CF post today and it says it is illegal in Canada to build a new boat with a combined AC/DC panel?
Can't I do anything right? Jeeeze.
INSERT STUPID FEELING MAN HERE.

Why would Binacle.ca sell them in Canada!
Is this also true for my used boat retrofit project?
Will my boat now not be insurable?
Anyone been refused insurance by using a combined AC/DC panel in Canada?
Is it legal if I just screw the entire panel in place and forgo the hinges?
Can I/Design/Build/Install a screwed on cover over the AC portion in the back to separate the two sides to comply? the article implies that the AC side needs to have a cover that has mechanical fastenings to remove
Did I really just waste another boat grand? No sleep again tonight!

Seems to be true for new boats (2010 Canadian small vessel construction standards):

8.10.4 Vessels equipped with both AC and DC electrical systems shall have their distribution from separate panelboard. If both systems share a common enclosure, it must have a partition or have other positive means provided to clearly separate the AC and DC sections from each other. Wiring diagrams to identify circuits, components, and conductors shall be included.

but:

Existing Pleasure Craft:
Existing pleasure craft that were constructed according to an earlier version of this Standard are not required by the Regulations to comply with the current construction requirements of the Small Vessel Regulations, but are encouraged to do so insofar as it is reasonable and practicable.

To be ABYC compliant you need the AC and DC circuits physically separated ... one of these: https://www.bluesea.com/products/4027/AC_Isolation_Cover_-_5-1_4_x_7-1_2x3
is probably all that is needed to make your panel acceptable.

[Dsanduril]

Blue Seas lists the 4029 (rather than 4027) as the isolation cover that fits the 8084.

Can't say anything as regards legality on an old boat in Canada, Blue Seas claims it meets ABYC separation requirements.

[Skipper Lee]

YIPPEE!
That's easy enough to get the cover.
I wonder if anyone had an insurable issue though.

[Skipper Lee]

Thanks everyone,
Crying into my beer has been averted!

The panel with the future AC side blank-off cover will go here in the forward berth/head, toothbrush holding sliding compartment with a (future) drop down Nav table that will cover the head area. Whew!

I only have one toothbrush, some TP and one shampoo so it fits , It'll stay dry there and I will box it in so no wiring gets touched by stray/moving stuff in there.
AC/DC Panel, Check.
Proceeding to the next issue,
Isn't CF Great.
Lee.

[GordMay]

Originally Posted by Skipper Lee

... Is it legal if I just screw the entire panel in place and forgo the hinges?
Can I/Design/Build/Install a screwed on cover over the AC portion in the back to separate the two sides to comply? the article implies that the AC side needs to have a cover that has mechanical fastenings to remove
Did I really just waste another boat grand? No sleep again tonight!

Your screws would be mechanical fastenings, requiring a tool to remove, and therefor compliant, if the barrier truly makes the AC side "dead front".

[Var Korall]

Good luck with your project. Did I miss-read your post or does the photo show the installation location is under a porthole? Potential wet location??

[Skipper Lee]

Hi Var Korall,
No your correct, I am struggling to find a better location!
I thought it would be a upgrade to being where the original small panel from the factory was located which is right below the companionway and was continually subject to wet conditions. Although I refit all the Portholes and portlights with new Plexi (That particular one must have leaked as it was glued shut) it is of the type that simply slides open and has no real way to keep it sealed tight and will likely drip or leak somewhat someday. I think this type has no place on a boat but can't seem to find ones that are 8X21 or a bit bigger to change those two out. You can just see the original position below the companionway in the photo. An alternate spot is also under the salon portlight, at least it doesn't open so I suppose it could go there instead.
I have just turned on the temporary heater and I will give it an hour or so to warm up, make some coffee and go sit in the boat and peruse a more appropriate location for it.
Its not easy to find the perfect/right spot if there is one, Seems there's something else in the way everywhere on a 27 Ft boat.

[Skipper Lee]

Yikes, The pix left here upright!

[Scorpius]

Originally Posted by Skipper Lee

Hi Var Korall,
No your correct, I am struggling to find a better location!
I thought it would be a upgrade to being where the original small panel from the factory was located which is right below the companionway and was continually subject to wet conditions. Although I refit all the Portholes and portlights with new Plexi (That particular one must have leaked as it was glued shut) it is of the type that simply slides open and has no real way to keep it sealed tight and will likely drip or leak somewhat someday. I think this type has no place on a boat but can't seem to find ones that are 8X21 or a bit bigger to change those two out. You can just see the original position below the companionway in the photo. An alternate spot is also under the salon portlight, at least it doesn't open so I suppose it could go there instead.
I have just turned on the temporary heater and I will give it an hour or so to warm up, make some coffee and go sit in the boat and peruse a more appropriate location for it.
Its not easy to find the perfect/right spot if there is one, Seems there's something else in the way everywhere on a 27 Ft boat.

You can get excellent custom-made ports or windows with tempered glass (used on the coast guard cutters) from AJR Marine Windows in Port Coquitlam, BC. They are EXCELLENT! but expensive. I replaced all my pilot house windows with theirs and am VERY happy with them.

You have to provide a precise template of the opening. I took my old windows out, traced the openings onto big sheets of cardboard, then temporarily replaced the old windows until the new ones arrived. The new ones fit perfectly when I got them.

www.ajrmarinewindows.com

[Skipper Lee]

Good idea Scorpius,
I'll get a quote!

[seabreez]

Originally Posted by Skipper Lee

Like my Avatar suggests I am barely keeping ahead in this game.
Alternate title,
Two steps back!!! LOL.
Lee

If the boat is older... the rules apply to the year of the boat. Just make sure the wiring is very well done and better than today's code.... Once the wiring is complete, it should pass inspection by a qualified electrician. Better to get a qualified person onboard with your project before going any further...