Be Careful with U.S. Customs -- A Cautionary Tale

[contrail]

Originally Posted by Kenomac

‘Curious... why does it seem it’s always OK to post US bashing stuff on a sailing forum where it’s supposed to be against the rules to post political comments?

Seems like it’s only OK if the posts are anti-American. IMO. If non-Americans don’t like the policies, then... either don’t visit the US, or don’t carry large sums of cash if you do. No country is perfect, but I don’t know of any, where a person won’t be stopped at the airport whilst hiding $58,000 in the lining of a carry on bag.

Plenty of the critics have been US citizens as you would know if you have read the entire thread.

[jsc7]

Uh, I think some of the people on this forum are answering without really thinking clearly.

When you LEAVE any country you never have to "declare" anything. No customs form is filled out when you leave a country. The legal requirement to "declare" monetary instruments only exists when you are ENTERING a country, not leaving it. So, the guy in question broke no law whatsoever.

If you carry large amounts of cash, it is advisable to carry a letter from a bank stating that the cash was withdrawn from that bank and naming the account holder and bank account number. If you have such a letter, there will be no grounds whatsoever for seizing the money.

[svlamorocha]

Sorry I did not elaborate.

Dockhead has covered this in minute detail.

If you call CBP from a placed that is listed as port of entry or departure (all international airport terminals are) and tell them you need to see them in person someone will show up and if they don't (their choice) they will deal with you over the phone/email. I have been through this dozens of times leaving the US on foreign boat with foreign crew when I wanted proof of my departure.

[gaucho]

That's in theory the way it should be. But you really need to watch John Oliver's piece and get more informatoin. Civil Forfeiture requires no burden of proof from the accuser (the LEO), but you have to prove in a court, which may not even have a judge appointed but just a prosecutor, that the money you have is legit. It is really ****ed up.

[contrail]

Originally Posted by CarlF

Well, the first problem is the guy didn't speak English, I doubt the CBP has an Albanian speaker standing by on the 800 number.

The second problem is they would have told him that the form (FinCEN 105) has to be be filled out and delivered to CBP. You can't do this on the phone. The form is also only in English.

I travel a lot overseas for pleasure and business. Why put up with the hassle of the form? I have a couple of Fidelity ATM cards that let me withdraw $2000 a day with no fee or exchange rate uplifts at any bank ATM. If I need to send more to someone, I can order a wire sent to their bank account with no wire fee from my mobile phone.

I agree with the concern about US security since 9/11 - including the CG's heavily armed "safety inspection" without probable cause. And I give substantial amounts to the ACLU each year. But everything about this guy and his trip smells fishy. Why did they search his bag? I doubt three bundles of cash wouldn't show up on airport scanners. There's more to this story than the guy's lawyer is saying.

Your extensive travel has obviously missed the many countries without lots of ATM's. I live in the BVI, which would like to think of itself as somewhat advanced. It's per capita income, for example, is greater than that of the "mother country", the UK. And it's a popular luxury vacation and sailing destination. ATM's? Well, there are exactly zero functioning ATM's on Anegada, Virgin Gorda, or Jost Van Dyke, the second, third, and fourth largest islands, all of which are very popular. On Tortola, the largest, there are about a dozen, downtown, which never all function simultaneously, one at the Moorings that usually does, one at the airport that often works, and another at Nanny Cay that seldom works. Think people come on vacation with cash? You bet!

Like many, you need to get around before you discuss avoiding carrying cash in much of the world.

[svlamorocha]

Originally Posted by jsc7

Uh, I think some of the people on this forum are answering without really thinking clearly.

When you LEAVE any country you never have to "declare" anything. No customs form is filled out when you leave a country. The legal requirement to "declare" monetary instruments only exists when you are ENTERING a country, not leaving it. So, the guy in question broke no law whatsoever.

You may think as much as you want, but that will not turn into a truth the generalization you have made.

There are MANY countries that require you to file a form if you leave the country with large sums of cash or certain other forms of payment. The US is one of them. See the back of FINCEN 105 form for the references to US Code and CFR.

Most South American and Central American countries have similar requirements. The odd ones are Brazil where the threshold is 10000 reais instead of dollars and Guatemala where you have to declare ANY amouny of cash.

This rules have been implemented in compliance with a recommendation by the Financial Action Task Force, which is almost mandatory for countries that want access to the US and European bank payment systems.

[Uncle Bob]

Originally Posted by jsc7

Uh, I think some of the people on this forum are answering without really thinking clearly.

When you LEAVE any country you never have to "declare" anything. No customs form is filled out when you leave a country. The legal requirement to "declare" monetary instruments only exists when you are ENTERING a country, not leaving it. So, the guy in question broke no law whatsoever.

If you carry large amounts of cash, it is advisable to carry a letter from a bank stating that the cash was withdrawn from that bank and naming the account holder and bank account number. If you have such a letter, there will be no grounds whatsoever for seizing the money.

Ah, I'm guessing you don't get out much, or if you do you don't go far.

[Singularity]

Originally Posted by jsc7

Uh, I think some of the people on this forum are answering without really thinking clearly.

When you LEAVE any country you never have to "declare" anything. No customs form is filled out when you leave a country. The legal requirement to "declare" monetary instruments only exists when you are ENTERING a country, not leaving it. So, the guy in question broke no law whatsoever.

I really don't understand what goes on the the mind of someone who has no life experience is thinking when making statements in a forum where there is a tremendous amound of life experience.

§1010.306 Filing of reports.

(b)(1) A report required by §1010.340(a) shall be filed at the time of entry into the United States or at the time of departure, mailing or shipping from the United States, unless otherwise specified by the Commissioner of Customs and Border Protection.


(3) All reports required by §1010.340 shall be filed with the Customs officer in charge at any port of entry or departure, or as otherwise specified by the Commissioner of Customs and Border Protection. Reports required by §1010.340(a) for currency or other monetary instruments not physically accompanying a person entering or departing from the United States, may be filed by mail on or before the date of entry, departure, mailing or shipping. All reports required by §1010.340(b) may also be filed by mail. Reports filed by mail shall be addressed to the Commissioner of Customs and Border Protection, Attention: Currency Transportation Reports, Washington, DC 20229.

[daletournier]

Originally Posted by john61ct

Fundamental problem there, is most citizens just don't care, got their bread & circuses, don't want the thought and effort of exercising their responsibilities.

Australia, Israel, other more democratic countries, **require** every citizen to vote.

Make the fine say a week's income, people will become a lot more politically aware pretty quickly.

Theoretically correct but in reality not. Most in Australia are politically unaware. Yes they roll up to vote but most vote the way they did last year and the year before, not much thought goes into it, combine this with a vary confusing preference numbering system that most don't really understand.

I'm also disgusted regarding this poor blokes story but I don't just blame the law. I blame the individuals inforcing these laws. They are surely able to have discretion but often choose power, are they actually intelligent enough to hold the positions they do?

It's not just the States, I've had two friends, one entering the UK by plane and one entering Australia via yacht have major problems. The first was quite innocent yet was turned away the second entered Australian waters illegally due to fatigue and engine problems, the circumstances resulted in him losing his yacht! This easily could have been avoided if the individual border force guy hadn't taken a personal grudge against the yachtie.

Whats that old saying "if you want to test a man's character don't give him adversity give him power".

Also I do believe "the people get the government they deserve" democracy gives a choice.

[RaymondR]

Originally Posted by daletournier

Theoretically correct but in reality not. Most in Australia are politically unaware. Yes they roll up to vote but most vote the way they did last year and the year before, not much thought goes into it, combine this with a vary confusing preference numbering system that most don't really understand.

I'm also disgusted regarding this poor blokes story but I don't just blame the law. I blame the individuals inforcing these laws. They are surely able to have discretion but often choose power, are they actually intelligent enough to hold the positions they do?

It's not just the States, I've had two friends, one entering the UK by plane and one entering Australia via yacht have major problems. The first was quite innocent yet was turned away the second entered Australian waters illegally due to fatigue and engine problems, the circumstances resulted in him losing his yacht! This easily could have been avoided if the individual border force guy hadn't taken a personal grudge against the yachtie.

Whats that old saying "if you want to test a man's character don't give him adversity give him power".

Also I do believe "the people get the government they deserve" democracy gives a choice.

Actually, you are not required to vote in Australia. The law requires you to attend a polling place and have your name crossed off the lists of registered voters. Once you have done that you can walk out without having cast any votes. However, most people go ahead and vote either because they are unaware of the attendance requirement only or figure that since they are already there they may as well vote anyway.

Australians whinge about how useless their politicians are but they live in one of the best run countries in the world.

[Simi 60]

Originally Posted by TrentePieds

Re #149

OUCH!!! If there is any America-bashing to be done, leave it to the Americans. Some of them are SERIOUSLY competent at it and TOTALLY ruthless about it ;-0)!!

Seemed spot on to me as I to don't believe the lies that mainstream media and the govt/corporate masters try and feed us.
Unfortunately, most people lap those lies and directives up.

[daletournier]

Originally Posted by RaymondR

Actually, you are not required to vote in Australia. The law requires you to attend a polling place and have your name crossed off the lists of registered voters. Once you have done that you can walk out without having cast any votes. However, most people go ahead and vote either because they are unaware of the attendance requirement only or figure that since they are already there they may as well vote anyway.

Australians whinge about how useless their politicians are but they live in one of the best run countries in the world.

Yes we do have a good country, very fortunate to be born their, this becomes obvious when your surrounded by very poor people as I am now that don't have options.

In saying the above, Australia is following in the footsteps of other western countries both in over regulation and the slow degradation of liberty as discussed here, sure we're not as far down the track, but it's a slippery slope that dosent start that slippery. People willingly trade freedom for perceived security.

In regards to Australians understanding politics because they are forced to vote (or get signed off), ask my mother who the treasurer is? I'll guarantee she can't tell you, yet she is a voting citizen.

Australians are sleep walking along just like the citizens of other affluent countries, it takes conscious effort to make yourself aware of political and social trends and consequences and even more effort to be proactive regarding shaping a better future. If you are one that tries to be informed then you are likely in the minority, most are busy just moving with the herd and really don't want to hear the crazy stuff you have to say.

[Mike OReilly]

Originally Posted by Simi 60

This image says it all. I would add:



… distractions like CF .

[valhalla360]

Originally Posted by AKA-None

Obviously there are people posting here who have never traveled to a cash only society. Our trip to Belize required cash for everything and you can’t simply go to an atm to pull $2000 to pay for a boat rental. We started out with a couple grand and some days had to hit multiple banks with multiple cards to get the required cash for a simple vacation.

That's odd. It was a while back but we took a trip to Belize and didn't need to carry thousands in cash. Has there economy collapsed recently?

[john61ct]

Depends how you travel.

I very rarely spend money at places that take plastic