COLREG 35

[Adelie]

Originally Posted by hallejj

Makes sense given the rule but it is definitely not the common practice in the Pacific Northwest. A month or so ago, we went through Thatcher Pass eastbound in the fog with a ferry going westbound. In addition to us and the ferry, there were at least two other boats within half a mile of us. Thatcher is a few hundred yards wide and the ferry generally takes its half out of the middle. The ferry was the least of my concerns as both it and we have AIS. In any case, not a single horn blast was heard and that is typical in my experience. Was the ferry captain putting his ticket at risk?

Abiding by the speed limit in the road is not common practice, especially here in California. But being 1mph over the limit can get you a speeding ticket.

The ferry captain’s ticket would be at risk if there was a collision in the fog.

[Paul L]

Originally Posted by hallejj

Sure this must have been discussed here but can't find anything. As I read COLREGS 35, all vessels in or near an area of restricted visibility MUST make a loud, annoying noise at least every two minutes. This includes vessels at anchor and not under command. In our cruising sailboat, we are often at anchor in fog (usually having gone to sleep under a clear sky.) We also get stuck navigating in fog a few times a year.

If I followed the rule as I read it in a peaceful anchorage at 4:00 a.m. (having interrupted my sleep on a regular basis just to be sure I knew if fog rolled in) I would expect to be lynched. If I anchor and go onshore, I am not sure how it would be possible to comply. Whilst enroute, we use radar and a constant visual watch but generally do not use sound except in response to a signal from another boat (which has happened to us exactly once.) In my experience, vessels underway occasionally but not commonly use Rule 35 sound signals but the overwhelming majority (including, for example, Washington State Ferries) do not.

So, seriously folks: I hate to disregard a rule but they can't be serious. What does everyone else do about it?

I seriously doubt that ferries fail to use their sound signals. I have heard them use them many times.
From a practical point of view small boats don't use fog signals when at anchor. It doesn't make it legal, it is just reality.

Your point about being ashore and having fog roll in missed the main point. When at anchor you are still required to maintain a lookout. So there are lots of regs that small boats ignore.

If a vessel ran into you in the fog while you are anchored, it is likely in a court case that you would be assigned a chunk of the liability.

[Dockhead]

Originally Posted by Nicholson58

In an anchorage, you are at your own discretion. . .

Not according to the Rules.

Originally Posted by Paul L

. . . From a practical point of view small boats don't use fog signals when at anchor. It doesn't make it legal, it is just reality. . . .If a vessel ran into you in the fog while you are anchored, it is likely in a court case that you would be assigned a chunk of the liability.

Yep, this.

[Nicholson58]

We found that in Nova Scotia and the Canadian East Provence’s that commercial fishing and all small boats did not have AIS. Fishermen did not want anyone to now where they fished. They also did not respond to the radio. Most operated no fog signals. Radar was our only way to avoid them. The radar often plotted three or four and they never avoided us. We took all evasive maneuvers.

[psk125]

The definition of "sailing vessel" at the start of the Colleges states that a "sailing vessel" is under sail. If you are anchored or moored you are not under sail and do not have to make sounds. Motor vessels are defined as being "propelled by machinery". An anchored motor vessel is not being propelled by machinery - it is anchored. Please don't wake up at 04h00 to blow your fog horn when you're anchored.

[Franziska]

That, is a really cool story. Thanks for sharing.

Originally Posted by Seymore

Did you ever hear about the value of Newfoundland dogs? The sea around Newfoundland and Nova Scotia is just about the foggiest in the world. In the old days all the fishing schooners would carry a Newfoundland dog, who would tend to laze around and sleep. In pea soup fog, when two fishing schooners got close to each other, without either one seeing the other, The Dog would come alive. He KNEW there was another Dog, over there, and he would start barking like crazy! And the other Dog would come alive and reply, barking like crazy! And that's how they'd know about other boats nearby, in the thick fogs in Newfoundland....

[Adelie]

Originally Posted by psk125

The definition of "sailing vessel" at the start of the Colleges states that a "sailing vessel" is under sail. If you are anchored or moored you are not under sail and do not have to make sounds. Motor vessels are defined as being "propelled by machinery". An anchored motor vessel is not being propelled by machinery - it is anchored. Please don't wake up at 04h00 to blow your fog horn when you're anchored.

Rule 3:
https://www.navcen.uscg.gov/?pageNam...lgamated#rule3
(b) The term "power-driven vessel" means any vessel propelled by machinery.
(c) The term "sailing vessel" means any vessel under sail provided that propelling machinery, if fitted, is not being used.
(i) The word "underway" means that a vessel is not at anchor, or made fast to the shore, or aground.
(l) The term “restricted visibility” means any condition in which visibility is restricted by fog, mist, falling snow, heavy rainstorms, sandstorms, or any other similar causes.

I do not see an explicit definition in the COLREGs for a vessel at anchor.

Rule 35 - Sound Signals in Restricted Visibility
[url]https://www.navcen.uscg.gov/?pageName=NavRulesAmalgamated#rule35[/url
(c) A vessel not under command, a vessel restricted in her ability to maneuver ‹‹ whether underway or at anchor ››, ‹ a vessel constrained by her draft › , a sailing vessel, a vessel engaged in fishing and a vessel engaged in towing or pushing another vessel shall, instead of the signals prescribed in Rule 35(a) or (b), sound at intervals of not more than 2 minutes three blasts in succession, namely one prolonged followed by two short blasts.
International
(d) A vessel engaged in fishing, when at anchor, and a vessel restricted in her ability to maneuver when carrying out her work at anchor, shall instead of the signals prescribed in Rule 35(g) sound the signal prescribed in Rule 35(c).



Producing sound signals while at anchor in restricted visibility is required per the COLREGS. Enforcement is at the discretion of local authorities and sanction seems likely only in the event that you are involved in a collision.

[Breaking Waves]

as a side note . . . the rules also require you to keep a 7x24 'proper look-out' when anchored.

Regarding sounds signals while anchored . . . is not this (part g) the relevant rule, rather than the part c quoted several times above:


—INTERNATIONAL—
Sound and Light Signals
RULE 35—CONTINUED
(g) A vessel at anchor shall at intervals of not more than one minute ring the bell rapidly for about 5 seconds. In a vessel of 100 meters or more in length the bell shall be sounded in the forepart of the vessel and immediately after the ringing of the bell the gong shall be sounded rapidly for about 5 seconds in the after part of the vessel. A vessel at anchor may in addition sound three blasts in succession, namely one short, one prolonged and one short blast, to give warning of her position and of the possibility of collision to an approaching vessel.

[hallejj]

Originally Posted by Breaking Waves

as a side note . . . the rules also require you to keep a 7x24 'proper look-out' when anchored.

Regarding sounds signals while anchored . . . is not this (part g) the relevant rule, rather than the part c quoted several times above:


—INTERNATIONAL—
Sound and Light Signals
RULE 35—CONTINUED
(g) A vessel at anchor shall at intervals of not more than one minute ring the bell rapidly for about 5 seconds. In a vessel of 100 meters or more in length the bell shall be sounded in the forepart of the vessel and immediately after the ringing of the bell the gong shall be sounded rapidly for about 5 seconds in the after part of the vessel. A vessel at anchor may in addition sound three blasts in succession, namely one short, one prolonged and one short blast, to give warning of her position and of the possibility of collision to an approaching vessel.

Just to summarize what I think the entire rule says:

1. A vessel in restricted visibility must make some kind of loud, annoying noise at least every two minutes. With the limited exception of some kinds of boats in special anchorages, there are no exceptions that depend on what the boat is doing at the time.

2. The kind of noise that is required does depend on what kind of boat it is and what it is doing.

[Adelie]

Originally Posted by hallejj

Just to summarize what I think the entire rule says:

1. A vessel in restricted visibility must make some kind of loud, annoying noise at least every two minutes. With the limited exception of some kinds of boats in special anchorages, there are no exceptions that depend on what the boat is doing at the time.

2. The kind of noise that is required does depend on what kind of boat it is and what it is doing.

Yep, that's good summary of the rules. Not of what people actually do though.

[rslifkin]

On the short long short horn signal, it slightly annoys me that the automated fog horn controllers never seem to have this as an option. Particularly for boats without a bell (or enough crew to man it), since under 65 feet no longer has to carry a bell.

[Adelie]

Originally Posted by rslifkin

On the short long short horn signal, it slightly annoys me that the automated fog horn controllers never seem to have this as an option. Particularly for boats without a bell (or enough crew to man it), since under 65 feet no longer has to carry a bell.

I've been trying to enlist one of my electrical engineer friends to design a controller, potted in epoxy, to handle a 5amp horn for this.

[rslifkin]

Originally Posted by Adelie

I've been trying to enlist one of my electrical engineer friends to design a controller, potted in epoxy, to handle a 5amp horn for this.

That would be handy. I'd love to see it added as a feature on the Fogmate controllers or something like that.

A little research indicates that some of the Kahlenberg horn controllers do support the short long short signal, but the ones that do are over $1000. That's not worth it for that feature and buttons to produce the maneuvering and danger signals without me just toggling the horn switch myself.

[markpierce]

Originally Posted by rslifkin

On the short long short horn signal, it slightly annoys me that the automated fog horn controllers never seem to have this as an option. Particularly for boats without a bell (or enough crew to man it), since under 65 feet no longer has to carry a bell.

Oh?

https://www.kahlenberg.com/signal-co...del-m-522.html

[wingssail]

Originally Posted by Breaking Waves

as a side note . . . the rules also require you to keep a 7x24 'proper look-out' when anchored.

Regarding sounds signals while anchored . . . is not this (part g) the relevant rule, rather than the part c quoted several times above:


—INTERNATIONAL—
Sound and Light Signals
RULE 35—CONTINUED
(g) A vessel at anchor shall at intervals of not more than one minute ring the bell rapidly for about 5 seconds. In a vessel of 100 meters or more in length the bell shall be sounded in the forepart of the vessel and immediately after the ringing of the bell the gong shall be sounded rapidly for about 5 seconds in the after part of the vessel. A vessel at anchor may in addition sound three blasts in succession, namely one short, one prolonged and one short blast, to give warning of her position and of the possibility of collision to an approaching vessel.

I'm having a hard time finding documentation of this but I seem to remember that Sterling Hayden's great book, Voyage: A Novel of 1896 started with a collision in an anchorage in Boston caused by a drunk watchman who failed to ring the proper bells. The resulting collision caused many deaths and the watchman ran away and joined Neptune's Car for a trip to San Francisco. Great read. That's why we must keep watch at night and ring the bell.